Author Topic: Advice on projector upgrade  (Read 3154 times)

Offline skittlewood

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Advice on projector upgrade
« on: June 04, 2020, 11:52 »
Hi all,

I'm using an Epson RLCD projector EH-R1000 which I bought from these very forums and have been very happy with for the past couple of years.

I am thinking of upgrading to 4k later this year to accompany my PS5 purchase.

What I am basically trying to figure out, is how much do I need to spend in order to sufficiently upgrade from my Epson? I don't want to compromise my lumens/black levels just for the added resolution. 

I think I could maybe stretch to $5k budget and i'm a big advocate of buying second hand. Do I look to buy something new out of the box towards year-end, or look to try and pick up a second-hand 4k projector when someone does a big upgrade? I'm unsure if the latter would be possible and i'd have to time it right as there is no guarantee someone will do a big upgrade.

Thanks for your thoughts.


Offline Doggie Howser

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2020, 13:56 »
You'd need to move up to SXRD or DILA to maintain black levels on par with your Epson and true 4K

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Offline desray

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2020, 15:58 »
+1 with Doggie in this. The list is very “short”. Either Sony or JVC is the way to go. No No to DLP if you want better black levels and shadow details.

Both Sony SXRD and JVC utilise the same SXRD technology except for the difference in their implementation. JVC calls it DiLA.


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Offline winwinc81

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2020, 16:12 »
skittlewood, come lets buy tgt :)

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2020, 21:29 »
You'd need to move up to SXRD or DILA to maintain black levels on par with your Epson and true 4K
Thanks Doggie. When you say on par.. will I not see an improvement in brightness and black levels?

+1 with Doggie in this. The list is very “short”. Either Sony or JVC is the way to go. No No to DLP if you want better black levels and shadow details.

Both Sony SXRD and JVC utilise the same SXRD technology except for the difference in their implementation. JVC calls it DiLA.

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Thanks for the intel. Again, I'm hoping for a picture improvement also as not all content is going to be 4k..

The lowest end JVC is the NX5 at around $6k USD?

https://www.us.jvc.com/projectors/procision/dla_nx5/

What are the Sony model options?

Thanks again. @winwin81 I don't mind!


Online tsammyc

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2020, 00:01 »
You don't have to spend a lot for an excellent 4K projector. I went with the BenQ W2700, which is under S$2,500. To get the best black levels with an expensive projector, you will need a perfectly dark room like a batcave. If you don't, this one will save you a lot of money. My projector room is dark only at night, so when I decided to change my 1080p Sony SXRD projector, and Alf was demoing the BenQ W2700, I saw it and decided it had as good a picture as my old Sony and the 4K HDR was superb. Have been very happy with it for the past year.

Here's a review:
https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/video-display/projectors/benq-cineprime-ht3550-ultra-hd-dlp-projector-review/

You can contact Alf for a demo

Offline Audio

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2020, 00:14 »
If you don't have a batcave, you could, of course, do a Screen Innovation Black Diamond screen to counter the ambient light.   :)

(Audio)

Offline econav

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2020, 03:31 »
If you don't have a batcave, you could, of course, do a Screen Innovation Black Diamond screen to counter the ambient light.   :)

(Audio)
this will not come cheap also. How about a DNP....
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Offline econav

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2020, 03:36 »
Epson RLCD projector EH-R1000
if your coming to 5 years used and clocked for 3000hr on the panel , then even the 2700 for less then 2.5k will beat it.
AudioControl,Gallo acoustic, JVC, Ken Kreisel, Starke Sound, FocusView, Rose HiFi, Rythmik, Xgimi, Zidoo UHD2000

From time to time we may sell off New but open up used for rental/standby/loan items and to ensure they cant be sold as Brand new, we will dispose off the box.

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Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2020, 09:06 »
You don't have to spend a lot for an excellent 4K projector. I went with the BenQ W2700, which is under S$2,500. To get the best black levels with an expensive projector, you will need a perfectly dark room like a batcave. If you don't, this one will save you a lot of money. My projector room is dark only at night, so when I decided to change my 1080p Sony SXRD projector, and Alf was demoing the BenQ W2700, I saw it and decided it had as good a picture as my old Sony and the 4K HDR was superb. Have been very happy with it for the past year.

Here's a review:
https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/video-display/projectors/benq-cineprime-ht3550-ultra-hd-dlp-projector-review/
You can contact Alf for a demo
This is great intel. Thank you, I'll definitely consider this. I am in a black and white house and at night time it is a Batcave but during the day I have light breaching the blinds.. I could consider some blackout pull down blinds, that would be quite straight forward to install as i like to play video games in the morning/ in batches over the weekend. I will definitely contact Alf, thanks. Is he a distributor?

if your coming to 5 years used and clocked for 3000hr on the panel , then even the 2700 for less then 2.5k will beat it.
I bought it second hand from the forums maybe 2+ years ago and have replaced the bulb once.

So basically it's the Sony/JVC for maximum quality and then the BenQ DLP as a cheaper 4k option ?

A considerable difference on price, I guess I could keep an eye out for anyone upgrading towards year-end and then make a decision on what is available year-end. Either bite the bullet for the sony/JVC, look out for a second hand one, or buy the BenQ brand new (warranty would be good to have.)

Hate to be a broken record but would there be a considerable difference in quality on the cheaper Sony/JVC to the BenQ?

Thanks everyone, really appreciate the chats.

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2020, 09:07 »
If you don't have a batcave, you could, of course, do a Screen Innovation Black Diamond screen to counter the ambient light.   :)

(Audio)

I've been looking at that screen ever since I saw pictures of it years ago. Wonder about maintenance, mould etc. Wonder if Alf has a demo

Offline alf

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #11 on: June 05, 2020, 11:54 »
I've been looking at that screen ever since I saw pictures of it years ago. Wonder about maintenance, mould etc. Wonder if Alf has a demo

Hello every one it is great to be active again during this long Covid 19 thingy, had made us all tired and restless . ( watch tones of movies he... he ...)

In regards to the options of projection screens for hi contrast with ambient light rejection ability ,good uniformity and have higher resolution finish only two big brands used to have it .

Now there is other option by a few other screen material makers , the current most command ones is the UST optical ( lenticular ) finish surface which redirect the light path towards the viewer . They have so many names and saying it also comes in fresnel combine with lenticular . ( This was use in the days rear projection acrylic screen one end fresnel to capture and lenticular to do distribution and makes it even .)

For any front projection application, be it short throw , mid throw or long throw the most ideal will be using the a smooth finish surface and diffusion type ( which allow wider viewing angle and higher or sharper picture  ) . This will allow flexibility of where is to be mounted , use different option of PJ.

There are White base finish ( Natural and Opti white ) , Light Grey Base  (Phantom grey III ) and Dark Grey Base ( Titanium Grey II ) . All this screen will be use with different environment and client expectation want and needs . Do go and find out on the pros and cons of each from supplier also find out , maintenance requirements, replacement option , frame options , frame velvet colour , what is the humidity level , viewing condition to buy the type you like most .

 Note not all material can be use in the mechanical options but all can be use in the fixed frame for the best result .

Once you have the selected the ones you like and install it the last step is to get it calibrated , option to use the Calibration Disc with UHD player or the colourer meter and PC any one is better than just use the pre sets alone .



 
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Offline Doggie Howser

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #12 on: June 05, 2020, 14:45 »
Thanks Doggie. When you say on par.. will I not see an improvement in brightness and black levels?
Thanks for the intel. Again, I'm hoping for a picture improvement also as not all content is going to be 4k..

The lowest end JVC is the NX5 at around $6k USD?

https://www.us.jvc.com/projectors/procision/dla_nx5/

What are the Sony model options?

Thanks again. @winwin81 I don't mind!

The reason I said on par is that these new HDR projectors have to run much brighter. Much much brighter than SDR projectors. So black levels as a result do suffer. Even on the best JVC zones.

So the Sony and JVC will have comparable if slightly better black levels in HDR mode compared to your SDR only projectors.
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Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #13 on: June 10, 2020, 08:38 »
What sort of price are we looking at for the entry level JVC and Sony chaps?

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2020, 15:02 »
For the JVC looks like..

N5 is 8999
N7 11999

Which prices me out I think, unless I catch someone selling and upgrading from the N5. I'm assuming the Sonys are similar prices?

Offline Doggie Howser

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #15 on: June 10, 2020, 20:48 »
I don’t know the prices in SG. I see the Sony 270ES at under 7k in Australia
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Offline htng

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2020, 18:15 »
You don't have to spend a lot for an excellent 4K projector. I went with the BenQ W2700, which is under S$2,500. To get the best black levels with an expensive projector, you will need a perfectly dark room like a batcave. If you don't, this one will save you a lot of money. My projector room is dark only at night, so when I decided to change my 1080p Sony SXRD projector, and Alf was demoing the BenQ W2700, I saw it and decided it had as good a picture as my old Sony and the 4K HDR was superb. Have been very happy with it for the past year.

Here's a review:
https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/video-display/projectors/benq-cineprime-ht3550-ultra-hd-dlp-projector-review/

You can contact Alf for a demo

Where did you buy the W2700 for $2400? Wanted to get one

Online tsammyc

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2020, 22:19 »
I bought it at the prelaunch price. Not sure what it's going for now. Contact member alf on this forum. I bought it from him

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2020, 20:52 »
So my bulb just went on the Epson. (I think)

Anyone selling a BenQ/JVC/sony?

Fuuuu

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2020, 20:57 »

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2020, 21:11 »
Here is a Sony 285ES within your $5K budget. Note however that I think it is a parallel import set so check with the seller over warranty etc

https://www.lazada.sg/products/sony-home-theater-projector-vpl-vw285es-full-4k-hdr-video-projector-for-tv-movies-and-gaming-home-cinema-projector-with-1500-lumens-for-brightness-and-3-sxrd-imagers-for-crisp-i420022040-s1058978870.html?spm=a2o42.10453684.0.0.86ed5554F7jJts&mp=3

Ok I'm in touch with the seller and they can deliver by Friday.

So forum.
 
BenQ for 2.5+ or the Sony for 4.5k (interest free option is there...)

Will I enjoy a 2k sgd picture quality difference...

I decide by morning. Please vote.

Offline Audio

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2020, 01:36 »
One got moving mirrors and rotating colour disk.

One is solid state.

(Audio)

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2020, 09:18 »
One got moving mirrors and rotating colour disk.

One is solid state.

(Audio)

Verbiage is a bit alien to me but I am assuming you are saying the Sony is better.

Apologies that my queries are a bit annoying, I am just trying to figure out if it is worth that extra chunk of cash.


Offline Audio

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2020, 09:44 »
Verbiage is a bit alien to me but I am assuming you are saying the Sony is better.

Apologies that my queries are a bit annoying, I am just trying to figure out if it is worth that extra chunk of cash.

Sorry, I was just trying to be discrete.  You assumed correctly.  My assumption is one with moving parts would have a higher chance of breaking down.  Whereas, one with no moving parts could, perhaps, lasts longer.

(Audio)

Offline wcseow

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2020, 10:42 »
Hi. One thing you might want to consider is whether you or your family is susceptible to rainbow effect, which i believe will be present in DLP projectors. I believe your.current epson is 3LCD which I believe will not have.thos


I just started using projector and install Optima UHD60. While I do notice RBE but can live with it, my children can't.
Thus I traded in for a JVC N5, which other than much better image quality, will not have RBE presence.

Hope it help
« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 10:47 by wcseow »

Offline moonlight

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #26 on: June 25, 2020, 10:53 »
How big is your screen?
I have been using 1080p SONY PJ. A happy and proud owner. I will upgrade it when 8K TV/PJ is released.
The price of 4k TV/PJ surely will drop further. It is time to grab

Do I need to upgrade my screen to 4K screens and also from 100' to 120' ?
« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 10:57 by moonlight »

Offline alf

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2020, 12:02 »
After reading Skittlewood  intend PJ purchases uncertainty and what is best to get , everyone has different budget , expectation , room constrain , worries on products reliability and warranty coverage  .

A) I always like to work with budget in mine so can explore the possibility of different products on the market .

B) Expectation of picture, I will suggest to go and view it nothing beats seeing it yourself . Having a demo will also let you test it you like it or not , the different setting for games ( refresh rates time ) , night mode or day mode is it up to your expectation. You can also view options to up grade projection screens for better contrast and usage on lighted environment .

C) Room constrain is the main issue for most HT application , not everyone is bless with a ideal room size or a dedicated man cave . Buying a projector main thing to know , if it is able to fit to your room or where you want to place it, if it cant fit there is no joy . Another is wify factor, does the colour and size of PJ acceptable ?

D) Looking at the history of all the different technologies , LCD , DLP and SXRD or Dila these are the 3 main type optical blocks . All are as reliable as they are not new stuff just made,in fact they all have improved in ability to produce better black levels with better brighter brightness for different venues application .

a) LCDs from single panel to 3 panels for both commercial and HT PJ .

b)  DLPs ( Texas Instrument )starts from single chip to 3 chip now more colour segmented on those single wheels type RGB ,RGB colour wheel as what Vincent teo ( reviewer )  likes to call it . Most of the cinema are using DLP chips so reliability is not an issue as they cannot afford break down .

c) SXRDs are Sony and have their own market share ( first adopter of 4k panels or resolutions use for cinema ) also did some OEMs .

d) Dila is JVC and they started with some commercial units and later mainly for Home and simulators application now also have 4k chips set. Have a few OEM brand also .

Known facts :  for home theatre projectors with actual 4K panels (4096 x 2160)  it will not be fully utilize . Most main sources  (UHD 3840 x 2160 ) are in 16:9  TV programme / Netflix / Games / Soccer or Golf / Concerts . Movies are in 2.35 /cinema scope formats
Each projector brands either uses mostly panels technologies  LCD ( Seiko company ) or DLPs  (TI)  are the most .

Most cheaper or commercial usage projector uses lamp base and hybrid lens .

Different brand provides different years for coverage , limited warranty coverage or full coverage , service during coverage house collection or send in . Is it local repair or require to send back to overseas for repair .
Lastly do call around and check if the vendors have promotion or trade in programme , even clearance sales . ( don't just compare from internet ) Most important if you do need help on some tech stuff or mechanical stuff is the vendor able to assist you to solve the issue . 

Hope that give some clear ideas for new buyers  or those doing replacements.

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Offline desray

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #28 on: June 25, 2020, 12:25 »
As always, great helpful advice dispensed by Alf.


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Offline rock123

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2020, 14:22 »
Just dropping a 2 cents here.

Better to check reviews and thriple cfm source of purchase before one purchase any expensive item via online websites e.g. overseas dealer.
If no delivery, that's it....

For PJ , i will purchase it direct from local dealer for warranty and in support.
Enjoy. :)




« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 14:50 by rock123 »
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Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #30 on: June 26, 2020, 18:15 »
Just wanted to say a big thank you to everyone that took the time to give me their thoughts.

I hovered over the buy now button for the Sony for the last 36 hours and was so close to saying yes and having it installed today as I am hella impatient, especially after my bulb blew on my epson.

In the end I decided to wait it out and come back towards the year end when the PS5 is released and I wasn't totally convinced I would see the picture quality increase that I was hoping for. Hopefully by year end, i'll be able to either pick up a solid second hand unit from the forums or spend some proper time with the likes of Arf to get the room properly kitted out.

I've replaced my epson lamp once before with some third party lamp (which was all I could find) but this time I managed to find an official lamb for 100 eur within minutes, so that's a good saving and it'll get here in a few days.

Again, appreciate it and look out for another annoying thread in 6 months.  ;D

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #31 on: June 26, 2020, 20:53 »
Whoever emailed me asking about the lamp, the reply was to nosender@ so the mail bounced.

Here: https://www.beamer-parts.eu/

Offline Corona11

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #32 on: June 28, 2020, 12:32 »
You don't have to spend a lot for an excellent 4K projector. I went with the BenQ W2700, which is under S$2,500. To get the best black levels with an expensive projector, you will need a perfectly dark room like a batcave. If you don't, this one will save you a lot of money. My projector room is dark only at night, so when I decided to change my 1080p Sony SXRD projector, and Alf was demoing the BenQ W2700, I saw it and decided it had as good a picture as my old Sony and the 4K HDR was superb. Have been very happy with it for the past year.

Here's a review:
https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/video-display/projectors/benq-cineprime-ht3550-ultra-hd-dlp-projector-review/

You can contact Alf for a demo
Agree, I too went the DLP route again, after my bad experience with SXRD, don't know why most people like the black levels of LCDs when at $5k you will be getting pixel shifting 4k and with 3 LCDs and panel misalignment, you will not get razor sharp images of the 4k DLPs, I may sacrifice some black shadow details which may be 5 percent of the movie but then 95 percent of the movie would be razor sharp and more film like.

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Offline desray

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #33 on: June 29, 2020, 19:12 »
Agree, I too went the DLP route again, after my bad experience with SXRD, don't know why most people like the black levels of LCDs when at $5k you will be getting pixel shifting 4k and with 3 LCDs and panel misalignment, you will not get razor sharp images of the 4k DLPs, I may sacrifice some black shadow details which may be 5 percent of the movie but then 95 percent of the movie would be razor sharp and more film like.

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Yes, unless u get go higher end like > $10K minimum for SXRD panels, at $5K range for 3LCD...the 8.3 million pixels DLP may be a better VFM projector to get to enjoy 4K HDR content.

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Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #34 on: July 05, 2020, 10:35 »
Whoever emailed me asking about the lamp, the reply was to nosender@ so the mail bounced.

Here: https://www.beamer-parts.eu/

Help!

So this website had the option of buying official Epson replacement bulb or unofficial. I bought the official and it arrived in record time.

So I just installed it and cleaned the filter whilst I was at it. Turned on the projector on and got double flashing red light which according to the manual is

 "Internal problem
Auto iris problem/
Cinema filter problem"

After a power down or two, I got an error message on the screen which said auto iris error, contact Epson for help.

Another power down and it worked fine however, the image is EXTREMELY dull. I dare say 30pc as bright as what I had previously and pretty much unwatchable in even pitch blacked out room. The subtitles were not even white but a dark grey.

Is the bulb naff, or is something wrong with the projector? I tried settings and it's not in eco mode or anything, even dynamic only had a marginal difference and still pretty much unwatchable.

Any thoughts on what to do or what could be the problem?

Offline econav

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #35 on: July 05, 2020, 23:50 »
If you still hv your old lamp and still working insert it back and try.

How to check a projection lamp brand New or Used?
1) take a pic of the lamp by pointing the cam into the Lamp reflector and send me .

after your reply , i can show you the step ....
AudioControl,Gallo acoustic, JVC, Ken Kreisel, Starke Sound, FocusView, Rose HiFi, Rythmik, Xgimi, Zidoo UHD2000

From time to time we may sell off New but open up used for rental/standby/loan items and to ensure they cant be sold as Brand new, we will dispose off the box.

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Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #36 on: July 06, 2020, 11:29 »
If you still hv your old lamp and still working insert it back and try.

How to check a projection lamp brand New or Used?
1) take a pic of the lamp by pointing the cam into the Lamp reflector and send me .

after your reply , i can show you the step ....
Old lamp is no longer working.. I was receiving a red flashing error light on the bulb light, so ordered another.

I tried booting again last night and received the auto iris error message on screen, and then double flashing red light.

Trying to find an epson service center in Singapore or a projector specialist.

Any recommendations?

Offline skittlewood

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #37 on: July 06, 2020, 11:42 »
And of course the service centre is complete bollocks "sorry sir, we cannot help you because the unit is discontinued" - literally no help.

Does the forum have any recommended third party service centres that aren't completely useless?

Offline econav

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Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #38 on: July 07, 2020, 02:18 »
Remember 29 March 2019? if you can send to me this afternoon , i can try to help you check the lamp brightness issue and also the Iris .


Epson bulb woes - light status and possible replacement bulb? Help!
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AudioControl,Gallo acoustic, JVC, Ken Kreisel, Starke Sound, FocusView, Rose HiFi, Rythmik, Xgimi, Zidoo UHD2000

From time to time we may sell off New but open up used for rental/standby/loan items and to ensure they cant be sold as Brand new, we will dispose off the box.

All posts
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=2968
Service & collection : Block 1085 #03-36 Eunos Ave 7A  whatsapp 96387418 to arrange

Offline Doggie Howser

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Re: Advice on projector upgrade
« Reply #39 on: July 07, 2020, 07:29 »
I had a JVC RS60 from new in 2010. It was a workhorse. Worked fine through 2 lamp changes.

after the third bulb blew I couldn’t find an original so went third party. Projector powered up but the bulb wouldn’t start. I couldn’t tell if it was the bulb or the projector but I figured 8 years was a pretty good run.

Went for the then current JVX X9500 then bit the bullet and went for the Sony 760ES.

No regrets. It’s really hard to go back to a 1080p or FauxK projector after this.

The Benq that many have recommended isn’t a bad option either. I think the W2700 is just a really good bang for the buck. Just bear in mind the throw distances might not work 100%. But small niggles for a noticeable uptick in resolution and color.
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