Author Topic: My HT Journey resumes. Setting up NEW BenQ 5700 PJ from Scratch N Considerations  (Read 7266 times)

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715


This must be the first major movie released in HDR 10+! Did you get it from Amazon or local?

More interestingly, since it is a Disney release, it may indicate that Disney is switching from Dolby Vision to HDR10+ as it earlier released two titles in DV i.e., Black Panther and The Last Jedi

Hi tsammy, this is a specially tone mapped movie done by a bunch of guys known as Tekno3d, they are miles ahead of the pack, bunch of brilliant guys. Before HDR was launched , they had 1080p HDR... 1 year later, we saw the first HDR in the market.

6 months ago they released this dynamic HDR , so I presume we should be seeing more of these HDR10+ in the market soon. Fortunately I’m a member in this team, and enjoying every single release by these guys, brilliant stuff indeed

Offline tsammyc

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 4665
  • I think, therefore I am
Oh ok, so its a file downloaded via torrent with HDR10+

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
Oh ok, so its a file downloaded via torrent with HDR10+

Yes correct , here is some explanation copy and paste stuff. The one we have is in HDRX

Our internal HDR-X format is basically the same as Dolby Vision or HDR10+.

We dynamically grade content scene by scene/frame and place it into the PQ ST. 2084 Rec. 2020 space.

Dolby Vision/HDR10+ makes use of an injected ST. 2094 metadata information which tells the TV how to represent the color volume/luminance peaks.

Instead using metadata we do it directly into the timeline mastering ( Davinci Resolve ) by using static and dynamic keyframe grading.

 

What’s HDR and why it’s beneficial over the old SDR

HDR or High Dynamic Range is a new standard that’s able to show a higher luminance/gamma/contrast/color spectrum than the old SDR or Standard Dynamic Range.

To grade HDR you need a high precision software such Davinci Resolve.

This grading software allows you to place the SDR content into the new PQ ST. 2084 space.

When applying the correct values and environment settings you are ready to grade the content to fit accurately into the new standard values. *Needs a studio HDR monitor/reference panels.

SDR and HDR are completely incompatible. This mean you can’t take the SDR source image into consideration to grade into HDR.

High Dynamic Range allows the colorist to place the content into a wider spectrum of color volume and brightness/contrast.

In reality there are different nit values for each situation. HDR allows to be closer to real life image.

When in SDR you can go from 0 to around the 120 nits mark. The colorists are limited into this spectrum for anything in the scene.

The color volume will be also limited to the BT. 709 colorspace standard in cinema content.

When in HDR colorist can go from 0 ( where blacks are not always pure black ) to 10.000 nits mark.

Here there’s a huge spectrum to work with and allows the colorist to be closer to what the real life scene looks like. In HDR you are also using a super wide color spectrum into the BT. 2020 standard. For today’s TV’s this content is mapped into the DCI-P3 colorspace.

 

HDR should never change Director’s color choice when grading from SDR cinema content.

When using original SDR cinema content the color should never be changed. Director’s vision choice in color should follow what the original source content looks like when using SDR sources. In the HDR transfer there will be a wider color gamut and gamma/contrast spectrum. The original director’s vision will never be compromised when using an already graded SDR cinema source.

When grading from RAW colorist is open to a complete new grade: Coloring/editing and transferring to HDR. This process does need the director’s choice in between.

 

HDR-X is our format focused into what the studios should be doing when grading UHD Discs

Studios hire freelancers to grade their film content into SDR and also HDR. Some do it worse than others.

This has been always a problem in the industry as the difference in quality/grades are too big considering how much you spent in your Home Cinema devices and also the Films Blu-Rays.

In HDR this problem is even worse. Not all colorists are fully trained into the SMPTE/HDR Grading to be able to transfer technically correct videos.

Even the major studios with blockbuster titles sometimes hires the wrong colorists.

Here in TEKNO3D we are film lovers with the necessary knowledge to do this work properly and most important with passion.

There are plenty of examples where you can notice the studios grade are far from being well done.

Why studios release rushed HDR transfers/bad looking/crushed blacks?

As mentioned before movie studios just hire freelancers to grade their content to HDR.  Freelancers who work for a studio also do it for others at the same time.

Professional High Dynamic Range colorists are just a few today. You can prove this by doing a simple google search to find HDR colorists.

When studios ask a freelancer to transfer to HDR they just give a rate, finish the job as fast as possible and jump to the next.

Freelancers charge per hour/day and the faster they complete a transfer they can just take another job.

This will always impact in the transfer quality. Happened through the SDR era and it also happens with HDR.

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
So far the picture quality from Disney releases are good

I already have black panther as the go to scene to test black levels

Then now we have captain marvel to test specular highlights

Avengers Infinity war is also very very good material

Guardians of the galaxy is also amazingly good, space scenes etc

The only disappointment is on the sound mix, it’s almost always a Dolby “ATMOUSE” from Disney releases. It’s like what’s wrong with the sound? Where is the bass? Where is this and that? Doesn’t match the online screen action, sound mix very poorly done

Offline Jag

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 10760
The lack of PROPER bass is going to affect many titles, not just the ones from Disney. Go check out BEQ on AVS. I'm using it and it significantly restores the lost bass!
Electronics : Denon 7200, MiniDSP Dirac 88A, Emotiva XPA-5 Gen2
ATMOS Audio : Martin Logan Ethos (L&R), ML Motif X(C), ML Motion 4 (14pcs surround spkrs)
LFE : Dual Rythmik FV25HP & Crowson Motion Actuator
Video : Sony VPL-HW55ES, Stewart Screen Studiotek 1.3
Source : HTPC
Fully automated HT via Alexa, Z-wave and Logitech Harmony Remote Control

Offline sigurros

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1647
  • "What we think, we become"
The lack of PROPER bass is going to affect many titles, not just the ones from Disney. Go check out BEQ on AVS. I'm using it and it significantly restores the lost bass!

Hi Jag, was reading up as well on the BEQ thread.

Some was saying it's as easy as loading the "curve" as per titles in the thread in the minidsp to regain the lost bass.

Doesn't this depends individually on the setup and room acoustics?

Maybe am reading it wrong.

Sorry to hijack Ron.

Cheers.

Offline Jag

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 10760
Beq works in addition and on top  of room correction.

Beq restores the lost deep bass using EQs.

At the same time room correction EQ works concurrent to correct room acoustics.

Different problem solved by the same tool.
Electronics : Denon 7200, MiniDSP Dirac 88A, Emotiva XPA-5 Gen2
ATMOS Audio : Martin Logan Ethos (L&R), ML Motif X(C), ML Motion 4 (14pcs surround spkrs)
LFE : Dual Rythmik FV25HP & Crowson Motion Actuator
Video : Sony VPL-HW55ES, Stewart Screen Studiotek 1.3
Source : HTPC
Fully automated HT via Alexa, Z-wave and Logitech Harmony Remote Control

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
The lack of PROPER bass is going to affect many titles, not just the ones from Disney. Go check out BEQ on AVS. I'm using it and it significantly restores the lost bass!

Thanks jag again ! I saw that thread, I agree a lot of these titles have the lower octave filtered. But I haven’t really ventured into it. Wouldn’t the steeper house curve at the lower frequencies bring that right back up?

Just familiarised myself with the seas L26roy woofers, they are magnificent! Absolute speed, good transient Attack and clean sounding. Thanks to synthesis’s build, flawless. I’m using it as stereo subs and seatons purely for LFE to 100hz

The woofers with Low voice coil inductance has very good transients

At the same time also busy dialing in the BenQ PJ, just received the spears and munsil disc, got some work to do.still busy

Just finished whole system time alignment yesterday and dialing in the subs. Now still experimenting with the room perfect XO . Something very special with the lyngdorf, even at 500hz XO, I can’t localised the subs, amazing. Will catch up with you again and share with you when the opportunity arises . Will definitely check out BEQ

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
Hi Jag, was reading up as well on the BEQ thread.

Some was saying it's as easy as loading the "curve" as per titles in the thread in the minidsp to regain the lost bass.

Doesn't this depends individually on the setup and room acoustics?

Maybe am reading it wrong.

Sorry to hijack Ron.

Cheers.

No worries at all.

 The BEQ is good apparently, if the subwoofers can dig deep, have a good extension down Low frequency, then this will benefit the entire set up. I think it’s to do with some sound mix engineer whom, when mixing sound content, decides that anything below <20-10hz, be filtered or attenuated . So when you playback the movie, it’s non existent

This BEQ stuff, restores that. I’m sure it affects the headroom of the subwoofers etc, but I have no experience or test to confirm that, maybe jag will be able to better advise

It doesn’t affect the room acoustics, that’s seperate. It’s more to do with content being filtered by sound mix engineer and this BEQ stuff restores it

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
Managed to calibrate SDR, first unlocking isf mode UP-DOWN-UP-DOWN-LEFT-RIGHT



Using the isf mode, first calibrated for brightness and contrast, here is the setting I went with, sharpness set to 8



Next adjusted for white balance/colour temperature



I found the right balance adjusting Low end/offset and high end/gain for grayscale . There is only 2 point adjustments available, unlike the OLED where I had more control with a 20pt adj



Very nice balance using a gamma of 2.3



Here is the CMS measurements, with settings used

















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
Next I encountered something , there is actually option for anamorphic 2.4:1 and anamorphic 16:9



But I’m not sure what is HDMI equaliser ? Is there even such a thing ? Anyway, just set it to auto and done. I only know Denzel Washington’s Equaliser!



Set the dynamic iris to high ( this is after MSTar firmware update )

Brilliant colour turned on gave some nice light output , that is turned on as well



That’s it, pretty straight forward stuff, nice with multiple choices for night view and daylight settings and the default cinema mode to play around

Next week will be HDR

Next up I’ll share how I dial in the audio side of things on lyngdorf MP-50, with the addition of the dual stereo subs pair , pretty fast as well


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
You tell me for the special price we got during opening sales, unbeatable price, very natural and lifelike , absolutely love the big screen.

Both my kids came and spoke to me, “papa, our home cinema is nicer than this cinema!” We just watched toy story 4 and Spider-Man . So it’s a success ! I didn’t ask the kids, they told me, kids don’t lie ! Hahaha... so it’s a success with this implementation of BenQ with the baffle wall

Here are some of the pictures, using ISF calibrated mode, beautiful !! Some video clips from spears & munsil disc















Strawberries really look yummy and real





So natural, shades of green etc

Just a few to share, it looks wonderful in person looking at these. Love it

Calibration to reference for SDR does help, much better than out of the box settings


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
Pardon my photography skills..

Just to show a few samples, if it looks good on phone, it’s close to very good in person...

Display doesn’t support Dolby vision and HDR10 +




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline Ccyao

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 334
Nice! Thanks for sharing!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Gears: LG 75UJ657T, Denon X7200WA, Emotiva XPA-5 Gen 2, SVS Prime Center/Bookshelf(Front)/Satellite(Surround), AG Micro x 4 for Atmos, dual Rythmik LVX12, Popcorn Hour A-500, xBox One S, Synology DS416.

Offline ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1715
Quick comparison between calibrated SDR vs HDR10 default factory

Big difference, lotsa work to be done, colours were totally off, green looks yellow and red has a shade of orange, but picture quality is very sharp, contrast is also better. Just needs grayscale , colours etc to be calibrated

Some serious work to do on HDR material

Will report my findings again after calibration for HDR