Author Topic: Given the priority to choose between room treatment and Room calibration  (Read 3299 times)

Offline kennyluck2000

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Offline rayleh

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That's very cool from you without any WAF issue... 8) 8) 8)

Not w/o WAF issue, just need to know my limit.

Offline ronildoq

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I can see a lot is affected by WAF when it come to room treatment. Is is really a serious issue to handle WAF  :-\ :-\ :-\
I have share with a few of my kaki about WAF issue. I have never restrict my wife from doing anything she love.. i give total freedom for her to decide what she want to do...
Take care kids while she is away...  8). Let her know i be always standby her when she need me.
This commitment is for life not a joke..  ;D ;D ;D
She know i have 3 things in my life, family, soccer & HT... 8) 8) 8) no joke is for life.. ;D ;D ;D
It depend on how passionate you are for HT & Hi Fi... to some is just pass time hobby and there is no point going through all those WAF harassment.
My wife once ask me when i gonna stop all these tweaking and changing of equipment.
My answer to her "You rather i spend time & money on these things and not going outside to spend time and money on others woman...I know what i am doing right now and i hope you can let me carry on with my passion. Just like i don't restrict you from doing anything you love..." ;) ;) ;)

+1, there are many ways or suggestions to handle it, have acoustics panel in ABC or Time tables, for your kids, use that excuse. I was lucky because I was already into this hobby when I met the Mrs . So that’s lucky and that is why she understands. Same like u, it works both ways. U give respect, u earn the respect. It’s always that way between Husband and Wife.

Having said that, I would say both are equally important. You cannot not have a room mode or peaks and nulls <300hz or from 10-100hz, it’s IMPOSSIBLE. Using acoustic panels to solve problems <100hz is not as effective as EQ and can be costly if one decides to take that route. You can still solve problems at lower frequencies with helmhotz, if you have the funds and means.

Not having both, will be a nightmare. Especially if you have it in the hall, like mine. There are too many reflections and sound leakage etc to handle, it’s really challenging. More often than not, the room will dominate . You are now actually listening to your “room” and no longer your speakers.

After my Long journey calibrating subs, REW, placement etc, I realised that sometimes, it’s not really ideal to just place the acoustic panels. Some areas will not require it. You really need to measure and know exactly where and how to place them. Type of material and wether absorption or diffusion works better.I wouldn’t say it’s luck, it’s experience. You Place one panel at X location, measure and listen. Rinse and repeat , place and measure and listen. After some time, you will have the experience

The first and foremost place above all, is the back of the MLP, this is the area that does serious damage to the listening experience, especially for HT, because all those speakers are angled towards MLP and a lot of this energy is reflected off back of MLP , this reflected energy messes things up in the time domain, and muddies the frequency

It’s a Long topic, but conclusion will be to have EQ, especially important for subwoofers. And acoustics for problems above Schroeder frequency. And careful  placement of the acoustic panels using a combination of absorption and diffusion  to solve the problems in that particular room.

I think u have had some experience after I demonstrated to u and other members in the past using REW how you solve the bass issues using the psi active bass trap. It’s the same methodology . You listen, place it at problematic area, turn on psi and listen again. It’s not really about luck, it’s a calculated approach

Good luck bro in your journey. It’s good that you are humble and always constantly trying to improve your set up! Great job ! You can always apps me if you want to share your experience, always welcome

Offline kennyluck2000

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+1, there are many ways or suggestions to handle it, have acoustics panel in ABC or Time tables, for your kids, use that excuse. I was lucky because I was already into this hobby when I met the Mrs . So that’s lucky and that is why she understands. Same like u, it works both ways. U give respect, u earn the respect. It’s always that way between Husband and Wife.

Having said that, I would say both are equally important. You cannot not have a room mode or peaks and nulls <300hz or from 10-100hz, it’s IMPOSSIBLE. Using acoustic panels to solve problems <100hz is not as effective as EQ and can be costly if one decides to take that route. You can still solve problems at lower frequencies with helmhotz, if you have the funds and means.

Not having both, will be a nightmare. Especially if you have it in the hall, like mine. There are too many reflections and sound leakage etc to handle, it’s really challenging. More often than not, the room will dominate . You are now actually listening to your “room” and no longer your speakers.

After my Long journey calibrating subs, REW, placement etc, I realised that sometimes, it’s not really ideal to just place the acoustic panels. Some areas will not require it. You really need to measure and know exactly where and how to place them. Type of material and wether absorption or diffusion works better.I wouldn’t say it’s luck, it’s experience. You Place one panel at X location, measure and listen. Rinse and repeat , place and measure and listen. After some time, you will have the experience

The first and foremost place above all, is the back of the MLP, this is the area that does serious damage to the listening experience, especially for HT, because all those speakers are angled towards MLP and a lot of this energy is reflected off back of MLP , this reflected energy messes things up in the time domain, and muddies the frequency

It’s a Long topic, but conclusion will be to have EQ, especially important for subwoofers. And acoustics for problems above Schroeder frequency. And careful  placement of the acoustic panels using a combination of absorption and diffusion  to solve the problems in that particular room.

I think u have had some experience after I demonstrated to u and other members in the past using REW how you solve the bass issues using the psi active bass trap. It’s the same methodology . You listen, place it at problematic area, turn on psi and listen again. It’s not really about luck, it’s a calculated approach

Good luck bro in your journey. It’s good that you are humble and always constantly trying to improve your set up! Great job ! You can always apps me if you want to share your experience, always welcome

Hi Bryan is good to see you back to share your HT experiences and that will definitely benefit to those who are new to room treatment or those who have been hesitate of getting some acoustic panel for their room. We are here to share something we know.. it might be wrong or at some point, some may not agree to what we have experiences. But that willing to share can actually help us to explore more new experiences that we never thought of...always thinks positively and i can say i am not always right or wrong.

I have been a strong believer on room treatment for a very long time and till today i still believe room treatment will help you achieve better listening experience with or without room correction. With additional room EQ it can help enhance further.
Your room is definitely a good place for demo with proper room treatment material and still look quiet decent... no the best looking room..but still cool.. 8)

My room even though look awful with all treatment material but without any room EQ will still sound much much better when compare to room without any room treatment... :)
But having say that room treatment does not mean you need to buy off-self complete product which will cost you a fortune. We can always choose to go diy route which will cost very much lesser but need your time to built and dirty your hand... 8) 8) 8)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 14:02 by kennyluck2000 »

Offline ronildoq

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Yea, best to try yourself. Only u will know, if it works, very good. Point taken and learnt something new. If it doesn’t, it’s ok. Move on, doesn’t work for u. Try other means or other approach.

That rice theory was a shocker for me too. Initially I was like, wait a second, rice sack on subwoofer cabinet ? Are u sure ? How is that gonna help? But after Pete tried out and said it worked, I thought I should try it out. And it was pointed out by Wechnivag  Then I googled and found that there is some credible theory behind it. By NASA!   :o

And it really worked wonders on my stacked subwoofer, the TOP subwoofer sits firm , less vibration on the cabinets and I don’t get the false ceiling rattling sound, what a tweak !

Similar like u, I’m also constantly learning .... it’s always good to exchange ideas...


Offline wechnivag

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That rice theory was a shocker for me too. Initially I was like, wait a second, rice sack on subwoofer cabinet ? Are u sure ? How is that gonna help? But after Pete tried out and said it worked, I thought I should try it out. And it was pointed out by Wechnivag  Then I googled and found that there is some credible theory behind it. By NASA!   :o

And it really worked wonders on my stacked subwoofer, the TOP subwoofer sits firm , less vibration on the cabinets and I don’t get the false ceiling rattling sound, what a tweak !


I learned it from sifu Diyer Straits. He used steel shots in his speaker stands. Not mass loading, but loose in the top platform which is built hollow, exactly like PID. Sharing and passing on the knowledge


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Offline Hillviewer

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Can use sand instead of rice?

Offline wechnivag

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Can use sand instead of rice?
From my understanding, if it's loose dry sand it's good. Depending on the sand it may pack and compact solid over time due to vibration, so then you will lose the vibration energy dissipation , becomes pure solid mass loading only.

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Offline ronildoq

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Can use sand instead of rice?

Some of them actually use stainless steel sand for sandblasting in a similar capacity, I went with steel shots, 25kg. Works nicely. So far so good, effective on the stacked subs. If I don’t stack the subs, probably won’t need this

Offline joamonte

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WAF of room acoustic treatment totally wasn’t a problem at all if one have the Budget , and determination to do it, after all, most of the money spend on the acoustic treatment tool are actually to make it LOOK nicer rather than on sound performance......... unfortunately not many people willing to spend as much as their system total cost on room acoustic , I know some hi end audiophile in Singapore willing to it , but not many.

Offline stvc

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WAF of room acoustic treatment totally wasn’t a problem at all if one have the Budget

That not true, they have different vision. Maybe not all but at least my :'(. But then again you are right, it won't be problem if you rich enough to afford a dedicated room. ;D

Offline joamonte

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That not true, they have different vision. Maybe not all but at least my :'(. But then again you are right, it won't be problem if you rich enough to afford a dedicated room. ;D

It is all about $$$$$$$$$ and how determine are you to get good sound from your system, too bad not many ppls really realise how much impact the room contribute to the sound of their audio system...
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 14:18 by joamonte »

Offline stvc

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I think most people know, i would say the room could take 50% of the sound quality? But this just a hobby, not a must, so different people have different justification. Just like a car, Some people willing to pay for luxury car some rather to take public transport.

For myself, there is no way to add any panel to my wall even with proper ID design as i have my system at living room, input from my wife, "it's so ugly". Unless i have a spare room which she will allow me to do what ever i want, unfortunately i cannot afford. :'(

Offline darlynvcs

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Both are right in your own way.... some will very much like to do treatment but just boh lui....
some have deeper pocket but can't stand panel or foam sticking out. Just a matter of preference. 

Offline stvc

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Precisely.