Author Topic: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble  (Read 1918 times)

Offline leslens

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Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« on: March 24, 2019, 19:22 »
current setup
5.2.4 atmos set up
dedicated ht room 4x6m (roughly)

paired sub KK 808

FL sub808 Projector sub 808 FL

I am looking to add on a 15 inch sub and daisy chain the KK808
the 15inch sub would be placed at rear left.

would this be a good option?
Thank you..

Offline ralfale

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2019, 20:28 »
I was in similar position , dual kk808 with rythmik fv15hp. They do work to provide rumble, but i do think they are not the perfect match. Cone diff 8" vs 15", speed diff are obvious.

Having said that, the new kk is improved to provide more rumble. You may want to drop in earth sound for audition. They should be launching soon with early bird discount.

Offline whitesox

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2019, 20:35 »
I was in similar position , dual kk808 with rythmik fv15hp. They do work to provide rumble, but i do think they are not the perfect match. Cone diff 8" vs 15", speed diff are obvious.


+1
I would rather sell both of kk808 then replace them both with 12012.... try first then add two later if still not enough bang for you  (just kidding ... ;D)
REW your room.... calibration, tweaking and listen with your ears.

 :)
« Last Edit: March 24, 2019, 20:37 by whitesox »

Offline ronildoq

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2019, 08:27 »
current setup
5.2.4 atmos set up
dedicated ht room 4x6m (roughly)

paired sub KK 808

FL sub808 Projector sub 808 FL

I am looking to add on a 15 inch sub and daisy chain the KK808
the 15inch sub would be placed at rear left.

would this be a good option?
Thank you..

Good advice from Ralfale, the pairing won’t work. Your 8” subs will bring down the whole system and your 15” subs Performance will be capped due to insufficient headroom from the 8” sub.  If you like the signature of the kk then the new kk 1000 seems to be a better choice pairing with a 15”, try and go for all seal subs if possible.

Place the kk subs in a location where midbass or frequencies above 30hz is good

And place your 15” subs where the response is good <30hz

If you have rew, find the best blend between the pair, matched polarity and finally time align both subs...EQ them if u have an outboard eq

Once you complete the above, you are more or less there. House curve for preference

I think earth sound carries the new KEn Kreisel subwoofer , I need to check it out too, I suppose it’s a much improved version over the dxd12012 , with that 200w more power that could make a significant difference

Offline sdds

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2019, 08:49 »
FYI ,Earth Sound , is the dealer for Kk , Starks sound & Rythmik subs .We have already setup dual KK Dxd1000 series and Starke SW 12 , sub 36 & 45 for demo and comparison in our 6x 4 m demo room at Adephi . Do come down n experience how the new KK sub sounds like as compare to the old one .Thank you

Offline ralfale

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2019, 09:15 »
Bryan touched on an important point on headroom. Indeed they are pretty big gap based on cone size efficiency. That was the main reason i had to sell off my kk808 and moved to something bigger in my new hall. Depending on how loud you crank your sub, you might be able to make do with current 808 (highly recommended to go for min 12" though). If you have to add rumble , perhaps replacing the 808 will be your best bet for better integration and ease of setup.

Fyi my new hall is about the size of your room, and 808 ran out of headroom quickly on my listening volume.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 09:17 by ralfale »

Offline wechnivag

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2019, 10:50 »
Bryan touched on an important point on headroom. Indeed they are pretty big gap based on cone size efficiency. That was the main reason i had to sell off my kk808 and moved to something bigger in my new hall. Depending on how loud you crank your sub, you might be able to make do with current 808 (highly recommended to go for min 12" though). If you have to add rumble , perhaps replacing the 808 will be your best bet for better integration and ease of setup.

Fyi my new hall is about the size of your room, and 808 ran out of headroom quickly on my listening volume.
One way to maximise is to place the smaller kk808 nearfield, eg behind the MLP sofa etc. In small spaces, sound drops about 3db per doubling distance. So having them at 1m behind sofa instead of 4m across the room, gains you about 6db+.

Corner loading them also works. A trihedral corner (eighth space) provides up to 9db in low bass, while a dihedral corner (quarter space) up to 6db. 10db is 10x power, 6db is 4x power. 6db advantage makes a 300w amp feel like 1.2kw amp. Well not exactly, but it's as close to a free lunch as anything - I'll have it!

 If your room is symmetrical, placing one at each back corner, or both stacked at one corner. Though this might feel slightly unbalanced, you feel the midbass coming from one side at the back. If there are no back corners, then just the wall- floor corner directly behind the sofa.

You get the boundary gain, as well as the nearfield effect, so it has a better chance of keeping up with a big FV15HP at the front corner.

Like ralf says, depending on listening volumes and expectations (which varies wildly) , it may be enough for your needs.

There's a e15hp selling at 1.4k, or a pair of orison dd12+ asking 1.6k. Both are considered low bass subs, but perhaps you might want a ported 15 for the size of your space. All things equal, say a Rythmik F15 vs a FV15HP, the ported will have about 6db more output around the tuning frequency.

Requirements go up exponentially for low bass in large space, ported helps to meet that. Again that depends on your expectations too.


Good luck!

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« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 11:18 by wechnivag »

Offline ronildoq

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2019, 12:33 »
Yes definitely check out earth sound, the varieties and options available, they also provide home loan, there is no better place to test it other than your own home, not bad really ...


Offline rock123

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2019, 14:24 »
+1 can visit earth sound for a demo.  Test see their new products. )))
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Sub 1: Rythmik FV18 @900WRMS   Sub 2: Rythmik FV15HP @600WRMS
Sub 3: SVS PB12-Plus/2 @900WRMS down-firing dual 12.3" three 4" Ports
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Offline sevenz

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2019, 16:13 »
Great advice by ronil, wech, ralfale as usual again. :)

I was in similar position , dual kk808 with rythmik fv15hp. They do work to provide rumble, but i do think they are not the perfect match. Cone diff 8" vs 15", speed diff are obvious.

Your 8” subs will bring down the whole system and your 15” subs Performance will be capped due to insufficient headroom from the 8” sub. 

+1 too. I was previously on a dual kk808+ FV15HP/ E15HP setup & had similar experience/ observations like what roni & ralfale mentioned above. But, having said that, it's still possible to be integrated with proper tools and means, and detailed HARD WORK. =)

Maybe could u share if u prefer a plug-and-play easier solution; or, do you prefer to go thru the trouble/process of measuring, calibrating, integrating the subs? This could be one pivotal factor to decide if u should get vastly different sized subs[/i]

Well, if u LOVE the sound signature of the previous KK model & just want some low rumble and not listen very loud, instead of adding a 15", why not consider swapping for a dual KK12012 setup (like what whitesox suggested too)? :) This could be a more hassle free & simple solution! Cos much simpler to integrate identical subs.

I was on a dual kk12012 setup previously, after the dual kk808 + 15". I liked the overall sound of the dual kk12012. There is some low rumble compared to the 808, and yet retain the awesome detailed moving midbass.  ;)

But, the other pivotal factor/ question is - how much low rumble u prefer (aka how "spicy") & how loud are your listening levels? Because if you prefer VERY STRONG low rumble, dual 12012 may not be suitable for u. For my taste, I needed much more low rumble which the dual 12012 could not give me at my usual listening levels, so i swapped to another sub. I think there was someone selling a dual 12012 in the used forum, listed here for ur convenience (http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=282952.0). Maybe useful to snag it, test for yourself if the rumble is "spicy" enuf for u. If spicy enuf, all is good! 

If not, assuming u want to retain the kk bass, instead of adding a 15", one way is to add the Crowsons Actuators (or alternatively bass shakers if cost is a concern) to your dual kk808 and high pass your 808 to preserve the headroom and protect the driver from bottoming. The Crowsons actuators give EXCELLENT LAYERED low rumble, comparable to what a well designed 15" can give. Ronil and Jag had the Crowsons, you can ask them for their comments ;)

« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 17:10 by sevenz »

Offline econav

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2019, 01:27 »
Just for info , we have added a new feature on the New DXD1000 , which allow the 60Hz roll off to be lifted and on Top of that double the power to 1200W , so not only allow the sub to go lower but also increase the useful SPL for another 6-8db depend on the setting and location.
We are not second hand dealer , all items we sell as used are tradedin from our customer and we don't rate it condition but for the buyer to decide on it own.
From time to time we may sell off some New but open up used for rental/standby/loan items and to ensure they cant be sold as Brand new , we will dispose off the box.
all post
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=2968
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Offline ronildoq

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2019, 08:43 »
Ok here it is, you can hear it from the horse mouth, Brian ding from rythmik on why the pairing of the 15” vs 12 or even 8” won’t work and also confirms that why 18” Drivers have better inertia and will sound more authoritative, and it is audible. key to this is also controlling the boominess vide it’s servo feedback.

Why I’ve never looked back after having the 18” seatons, x4!






Also concurs to my findings on why I think the F18 rythmik is very good



The above was only posted just yesterday on avs rythmik thread ....




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Offline leslens

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2019, 00:07 »
Thank you all for your replies, very helpful

I would prefer a simpler plug and play option. looks like dual 12 inches would be the way to go. Now got to convince CEO....

Offline synthesis

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2019, 10:34 »
I don't know how the neighbors of bros who use 15"-18" would feel but my neighbor can feel the rumble from my 12" when I tested it to play heavy bass scene a bit loud.....

Offline desray

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Re: Dual KK808 subs looking to add on more rumble
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2019, 10:47 »
I don't know how the neighbors of bros who use 15"-18" would feel but my neighbor can feel the rumble from my 12" when I tested it to play heavy bass scene a bit loud.....

Still I believe good neighborliness is very very very important. We need to be considerate when we play movies at loud volumes during evening times. The moment you get into a quarrel with your neighbors...that's it! You can expect endless nuts coming at you for as long as you lived there.