Author Topic: Lyngdorf thread  (Read 22978 times)

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #165 on: March 21, 2019, 12:20 »
Same would apply to a single sub in a setup where full range mains can go low too.

yes ! mains and subs time alignment will be next after the subs... But i find that for movies especially, no matter how good the mains are, its better to segregate the low frequencies below 80-100hz to the subs and let the mains focus above this range. Somehow the mains play better when " tasked" to handle higher freq and stripped off of low bass duty. The dynamic range improves significantly, especially when the mains are in cruising mode. Of course if the blending of mains and subs are not done well in the time domain, it will sound worse off compared to mains playing full range.

I understand better now after owning the Lyngdorf. I can see many things on implementation and design, they are really good stuff

I highly recommend this processor if funds permit, its so easy to use and its absolute top class

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #166 on: March 22, 2019, 07:49 »
Let’s find out more about how I further fine tune the set up

A recent topic popped up on centre speaker placement on tv console by bro Sevenz

Here is how I did mine.



Take a look at the above example where the left speakers are boundary loaded (in blue) and when it is moved forward (in brown). if I go with a XO of 100hz and speaker moved forward, I need not worry about the response below 100hz where the subs are given its duty and above 100hz the speakers take over. When the response is better, I leave RP to do the blending of subs + mains

Why I chose 100hz? The first criteria is to look at the roll off point of the mains. In my case above, u can see the roll off is 40hz, that’s the monitor audio gold gx300 series. Roll off. Normally you would want to cross it at an octave above ie 80hz

But as u can see above, going with 80hz there is a null at 80-100 (in brown).So no amount of room EQ can solve this, the ideal choice is then 100hz XO or higher, 120hz . But the blue is good to cross at 80hz.

Which would be the better along the two? 100hz would be better because I’ll enjoy the best of both worlds, a better response from 100-200hz from mains + better response below 100hz from subs( I focus on equalising subs from 10-100hz)

So this is subjective, you need to work out what’s best for u. The steps above is one method, looking for the best option to blend mains with centre...

Next we need to look at.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #167 on: March 22, 2019, 08:19 »


Let’s look at response when the ports are plugged in vs no plugs

You can see from above there is some nice bass added when the ports are unplugged. Does it matter ? No, because the region below 100hz is managed by the subs, so no benefits here.

Let’s look at the spectrogram



The above is when the ports are unplugged where you have more “free” bass from the ports. Look at the nasty standing waves circled in red above . Though below 100hz will not matter at this stage since I’ll be using 100hz xo and subs take over below this region.

Then look at this when the ports are plugged, sealing it



The standing wave at 160hz still there but the rest of the frequencies are better , 200hz ++ and 300hz ++ standing waves no longer there

Conclusion, plugged the ports for my case and move the speakers forward, again this speakers not meant to boundary load

Let the mains focus above 100hz for better dynamics

The above is how I did it at my place, at your home it will be different. This is something nobody can answer. You need to measure yourself and find the best solution


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #168 on: March 22, 2019, 08:34 »


Next up I look at the energy time curve to kill off all first reflection points from the centre speaker

Notice that the above will show u a spike in green at about 4ms. This first reflection is from my leather sofa headrest (in green) to the microphone.

Once I put a pillow, re-measure, u can see the spikes are brought down, (in gold) . So the reflective leather headrest is the cause for this spike . Having said that, for HT I prefer to have it because it provides tactile response from Low frequency to head level.

If you are into music, this is a no no. Some will use a towel or small blanket etc to cover this headrest area. Perfectly alright,enjoy the tactile + solve the first reflections off sofa headrest

In general, the above shows dbfs below -20 and all the spikes are within this range, some even better at -30, reasonably even and good.

Very happy with the centre channel now, left right TOP bottom reflections all killed off

Don’t under estimate all these minor adjustments and tweaking. They are time consuming, but set once and forget and The overall experience is tremendous when you are able to identify and pin point the problems and solve it in your room.

The same process is to be repeated for mains , LCR is what matters most for HT

Ideally I would have my mains slightly forward, centre slightly at the back to form an arc. Then the image will be very good


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #169 on: April 06, 2019, 12:53 »
Here is the final nail in the coffin, look at how I timed aligned the 4 subs below



The first pair of subs showing impulse rise at the first 5ms, second pair same timing perfect 5ms, and combined impulse both hitting exactly in the first 5ms

What this means is the transient Attack from the subs are precise, fast and accurate. One signal in for bass and energy from all 4 subs hit the Same time at MLP, this is the type of class I’m referring to...

Notice also once all the subs are time aligned, the phase response matches up as well



The line in black shows both pairs of subs phased aligned

From the above exercise I can conclude that a time aligned subs should always result in a properly phased aligned situation. HOWEVER... a phased aligned sub need not necessarily mean its time aligned

They can seem to be in phase, in 720 degrees , 1080 degrees, but the timing of the arrival of the impulse is one cycle late. This situation will muddy the bass. It also signifies that looking at the amplitude response alone is not enough

So amplitude response, decay rates, impulse...

TIMING IS THE KEY


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #170 on: April 06, 2019, 19:13 »
Fully dialed in the subs after 3 months testing and listening.Finally happy with the performance of the entire setup. This is the end of my journey for sound integration optimisation for Dolby Atmos

I’ll be be happy to host anyone keen to attend the demo, next Sunday 14th April.

1st session 2pm - 3.30pm (2 slots)
2nd session 3.30pm - 5pm (2 slots)

PM me if you are keen to have a listen. In a Living Room HDB, this Demo will feature the following which is the gear being used at the moment

1. LG C7 OLED 65” display. I’ll play some Tekno3d HDR-x material so you will have an idea of how good the picture quality is.
2. Lyngdorf MP-50 processor with room perfect EQ using divini power cord.Will share my experience with this and answer any questions you have
3. Speakers in use are the Monitor audio GX series, apex for heights and backs, CT180 for ceiling (8 channel Atmos )
4. Stacked pair seatons F18, 18” subwoofers
5. Oppo 205 playing the source files, connected using divini power cord
6. plixir Elite 3000 provides the clean power supply for the entire set up
7. PSI active Bass trap for specific decay handling , MOAB bass traps, 80% BAD panels flanking Atmos and my fav of all time SMT diffusors
8. Amplifier emotiva xpa-1 dual monoblocks, Apollon hypex NCore 8 channels for Atmos, ati525 power centre and surrounds. ( a bit of a rojak amplifiers but ok)

I’ll host another session again in May19
« Last Edit: April 06, 2019, 20:22 by ronildoq »

BadEnglish

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #171 on: April 06, 2019, 19:52 »
Fully dialed in the subs after 3 months testing and listening.Finally happy with the performance of the entire setup. This is the end of my journey for sound integration optimisation for Dolby Atmos

I’ll be be happy to host anyone keen to attend the demo, next Sunday 13th April.

1st session 2pm - 3.30pm (2 slots)
2nd session 3.30pm - 5pm (2 slots)

PM me if you are keen to have a listen. In a Living Room HDB, this Demo will feature the following which is the gear being used at the moment

1. LG C7 OLED 65” display. I’ll play some Tekno3d HDR-x material so you will have an idea of how good the picture quality is.
2. Lyngdorf MP-50 processor with room perfect EQ using divini power cord.Will share my experience with this and answer any questions you have
3. Speakers in use are the Monitor audio GX series, apex for heights and backs, CT180 for ceiling (8 channel Atmos )
4. Stacked pair seatons F18, 18” subwoofers
5. Oppo 205 playing the source files, connected using divini power cord
6. plixir Elite 3000 provides the clean power supply for the entire set up
7. PSI active Bass trap for specific decay handling , MOAB bass traps, 80% BAD panels flanking Atmos and my fav of all time SMT diffusors
8. Amplifier emotiva xpa-1 dual monoblocks, Apollon hypex NCore 8 channels for Atmos, ati525 power centre and surrounds. ( a bit of a rojak amplifiers but ok)

I’ll host another session again in May19


Very good to hear that.

How is Dolby Atmos's helicopter is flying in circle eighth your 8 tops ?

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #172 on: April 06, 2019, 20:02 »

Very good to hear that.

How is Dolby Atmos's helicopter is flying in circle eighth your 8 tops ?


Yea Dolby Atmos helicopter clip is circulating , with bass... can feel the movement left back right front

Nice !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

BadEnglish

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #173 on: April 06, 2019, 20:10 »

Yea Dolby Atmos helicopter clip is circulating , with bass... can feel the movement left back right front

Nice !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Time to rock !

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #174 on: April 06, 2019, 20:20 »
Time to rock !

Very different now from the last time u heard it , acoustics played a huge role too

BadEnglish

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #175 on: April 06, 2019, 20:32 »
Very different now from the last time u heard it , acoustics played a huge role too

Great !
Post some photos lar

Offline desray

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 19568
  • Bring the "Cinema experience" back home...
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #176 on: April 06, 2019, 21:41 »
Roni, glad to know that you have finally found your audio nirvana. Good job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #177 on: April 06, 2019, 22:39 »
Roni, glad to know that you have finally found your audio nirvana. Good job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Finally ahh.... after all the tinkering, tweaking, experiments, testing etc , wonderful journey ! So much experience gained in the process . I’m sure there is more to come, but for now sit back and relax, one final piece is the PJ with 150” to complete it.

Offline sdds

  • Trade Count: (+3)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1180
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #178 on: April 06, 2019, 22:48 »
Congra bro and start to enjoy the fruits . ;D

Online ronildoq

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2209
Re: Lyngdorf thread
« Reply #179 on: April 06, 2019, 22:50 »
Congra bro and start to enjoy the fruits . ;D

Yea !! Haven’t had the time to visit earth sound, soon soon!