Author Topic: Need some help on sibilance  (Read 2350 times)

Offline wcseow

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Need some help on sibilance
« on: December 25, 2018, 09:06 »
Hi
Have recently added in Gallo Micros and Mission LX2 to move from a 3.1 to 5.1.4 setup. 3.1 setup are using existing Mission LX4, LXC and sub. Replaced Denon 1400 with Onkyo RZ730.

With this, I seem to get strong sibilance, or I think it is being known as. A very strong emphasis on the sssss to the point that dialogue and music/effects sounds distorted. Something that is not present in the earlier 3.1 setup


I got it on all speakers and all sources (xbox one x, ps4, netflix via xbox and TV) using All Channel Stereo mode to test).

Thinking it might be a speakers issue, since there is one occasion of a sudden volume change due to switching of inputs, I replace the new LX2s with an existing pair of LX2 but still have similar outcome.

I used it for gaming, movies mostly and leisure music using spotify etc.

Have tried fiddling with reducing treble on tone control and equaliser settings without much success.

Any suggestion will help. A bit exasperated but also mindful of whether replacing the AVR or speaker brands  will help.

Thanks for reading

Offline pcking

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2018, 10:26 »
Not sure what speaker cables are you using now.
You can consider using thicker speaker cables like AWG12 or thicker.
Do not use silver plated ones.
"The worse of the two is he who, when abused, retaliates. One who does not retaliate wins a battle hard to win."

Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #2 on: December 25, 2018, 10:59 »
Hi. The Fronts and Centre are using same cables as setup last year, copper strands. Bundled with the setup when i bought it . Looks thick.
The new Micros and LX2 cables are silver colored strands, comes bundled with the installer for Gallos. These are thinner than the ones for the fronts and Centre
Sorry, need to go back to check whether there are AWG markings on the cable.

My initial thoughts are that since all speakers experienced it, the cables should not be the cause
« Last Edit: December 25, 2018, 11:01 by wcseow »

Offline cleadett

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #3 on: December 25, 2018, 11:10 »
I don't think it is your cable.
Start to investigate from your  Onkyo RZ730...
It is the main source supply all these noises to all speaker.

 :)

Offline bluepill193

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #4 on: December 25, 2018, 11:22 »
Sorry, have to ask the obvious question: have you calibrated with the onkyo avr room correction software? Maybe try again with the room lay-out, furniture position etc as close to normal listening condition as possible. Also need to be very quiet during the process.
Also I find the AG speakers bright sounding (probably small size and lack bass).

Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #5 on: December 25, 2018, 11:23 »

I don't think it is your cable.
Start to investigate from your  Onkyo RZ730...
It is the main source supply all these noises to all speaker.

 :)

Thanks. Had played with treble tone control and equaliser settings with only slight improvement from perspective of reducing the high freq. Overall sound still left much to be desired.

RZ730 is new and wondering whether it is a matching issues with the speakers. Thus contemplating replacing either one and if so, not sure replacing which one is a better bet.

Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #6 on: December 25, 2018, 11:26 »
Sorry, have to ask the obvious question: have you calibrated with the onkyo avr room correction software? Maybe try again with the room lay-out, furniture position etc as close to normal listening condition as possible. Also need to be very quiet during the process.
Also I find the AG speakers bright sounding (probably small size and lack bass).

No worries. Yes, I did the calibration a number of times.
My AGs are for ATMOS, thus so far not paying too much attention to that. Lol.. a bit too high to put my ears to.

Mainly its my Missions that are demonstrating it.

Offline Boxerfan88

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Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #7 on: December 25, 2018, 13:07 »
No worries. Yes, I did the calibration a number of times.
My AGs are for ATMOS, thus so far not paying too much attention to that. Lol.. a bit too high to put my ears to.

Maybe the calibration is causing the problem? Are you able to reset to default, don’t calibrate and test with sample media?

Seems like this problem started after you changed to a newer AVR. I’m suspecting the calibration may be pushing up the higher frequency to a point you dislike it.

If caused by calibration, maybe there is a sound program that rolls off the HF to your liking. I don’t use Onkyo so cannot comment how. In my Yamaha, flat tends to push up HF to achieve flat at MLP (speakers rolls off when not on-axis). Natural is closer to speaker flat. I guess Onkyo would have some frequency curve choices.


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« Last Edit: December 25, 2018, 13:12 by Boxerfan88 »
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Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #8 on: December 25, 2018, 13:13 »
Maybe the calibration is causing the problem? Are you able to reset to default, don’t calibrate and test with sample media?

Seems like this problem started after you changed to a newer AVR. I’m suspecting the calibration may be pushing up the higher frequency to a point you dislike it.

If caused by calibration, maybe there is a sound program that rolls off the HF to your liking.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

While I did not test before calibration, I did test it with AccuEq Off which I assume its the same. With that, the results are the same.

I did did factory reset a couple.of times but I ran the test after the calibration.

Maybe will try a factory reset again and check it out without the calibration.?


Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #9 on: December 25, 2018, 16:27 »
Not sure what speaker cables are you using now.
You can consider using thicker speaker cables like AWG12 or thicker.
Do not use silver plated ones.

Just check the cables
Front/Centre : Dali White Wave 1,5mm2..i think id 18AWG

Surrounds/Atmos : 20AWG

Offline econav

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #10 on: December 25, 2018, 16:53 »
This term can be addr in two ways,
1) The system without any input signal or at standby and still producing that hiss....ing sound from all speaker and if this a the case ,first remove all input connected to the AVR ( HDMI input, RCA input and also the sub output ) and check to confirm does it Stop , if so connect back the input cable one by one to confirm which cause that issue.
2) IF the sound is come from the main spk during playback , chk low vol how it sound and does it appear? then follow by increase the vol ( some horn loaded device can produce such sounding due to compression).
3) test it with only the front 3 spk playing ( Just disconnect all other spk ) if still sounded the same then may be consider the problem start here ,if not follow by connect back the surround to confirm and then connect your top to confirm , this will help you to indentify step by step where the issue come from.
4) even a new avr can cuase such a issue when all spk connected , due to save cost in the build/design.
5) test the amp with pair by pair of your surround vs top front vs top rear , one pair of a time connect to just the L and R channel to confirm does any pair of this ( spk+wire combine ) give that issue .
« Last Edit: December 25, 2018, 17:02 by econav »
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Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #11 on: December 25, 2018, 18:52 »
This term can be addr in two ways,
1) The system without any input signal or at standby and still producing that hiss....ing sound from all speaker and if this a the case ,first remove all input connected to the AVR ( HDMI input, RCA input and also the sub output ) and check to confirm does it Stop , if so connect back the input cable one by one to confirm which cause that issue.
2) IF the sound is come from the main spk during playback , chk low vol how it sound and does it appear? then follow by increase the vol ( some horn loaded device can produce such sounding due to compression).
3) test it with only the front 3 spk playing ( Just disconnect all other spk ) if still sounded the same then may be consider the problem start here ,if not follow by connect back the surround to confirm and then connect your top to confirm , this will help you to indentify step by step where the issue come from.
4) even a new avr can cuase such a issue when all spk connected , due to save cost in the build/design.
5) test the amp with pair by pair of your surround vs top front vs top rear , one pair of a time connect to just the L and R channel to confirm does any pair of this ( spk+wire combine ) give that issue .

Hi. Thanks for the advice. Below is the results.

1. Speakers are silent when system is off or standby.
2. The situation remains at low volume too.
3. See the same situation for all the speakers, albeit I did not test the Atmos Micros.
4. I have Denon 1400 before the RZ730 and it was ok though with 3.1 setup. If I am to replace the AVR, which brand/model should I put my bet on?
Alternatively if I replace the speakers only, which ones to consider.
5. The surrounds faced the same situation. Could not really test the Atmos individually as doing it at AVR side is a bit if a challenge. Am thinking since the "grounded" speakers face same concern, I concentrate on the F C n Surrounds.


Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #12 on: December 25, 2018, 19:18 »
While I did not test before calibration, I did test it with AccuEq Off which I assume its the same. With that, the results are the same.

I did did factory reset a couple.of times but I ran the test after the calibration.

Maybe will try a factory reset again and check it out without the calibration.?



Just did factory reset, no calibration. Same
:(

Offline econav

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #13 on: December 25, 2018, 19:44 »
after power up the system with playing anything .
1) Vol @zero also have that ?
2) does increase the vol also increase that sound with any signal/source playing ?

if this is the case, send  the AVR for repair as is new and the problem should from the AVR .the sound you hear could be a kind of cracking insteed of Hissss,......
We are not second hand dealer , all items we sell as used are tradedin from our customer and we don't rate it condition but for the buyer to decide on it own.
From time to time we may sell off some New but open up used for rental/standby/loan items and to ensure they cant be sold as Brand new , we will dispose off the box.
All used items will not come with cable.
For viewing of used items. text@96387418
all post
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=2968

Offline wcseow

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Re: Need some help on sibilance
« Reply #14 on: December 25, 2018, 20:29 »
after power up the system with playing anything .
1) Vol @zero also have that ?
2) does increase the vol also increase that sound with any signal/source playing ?

if this is the case, send  the AVR for repair as is new and the problem should from the AVR .the sound you hear could be a kind of cracking insteed of Hissss,......

Hi
I meant with the avr power down or on standby, the speakers are silent. No ssssss...:)

With it power up and with source active, zero volume no ssss. With the volume at low, can hear the "sibilance" and it gets louder and more distinct as the volume is turned up