Author Topic: New project alert! 3 Generations  (Read 16882 times)

Offline ed

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New project alert! 3 Generations
« on: September 15, 2017, 15:05 »
Hi Diyers,

Long time no contribution!  These days, a big part of my time has been spent with my school-going kid.  And following on his homework and tests is just draining, more draining than any amps or speakers projects in the past.  Now for the more serious stuff which I am embarking on...  Rebuilding some old Turntables of the past.  In fact I have 1 for every generation to share…

Project 1 - Generation 2 - Belt Driven, the year was 1976

During CNY this year I took out my Thorens TD160 to spin some vinyls and noticed that the belt is loose.  Upon further inspection I discovered a couple of things detailed below:

1.  Loose is Belt
2.  Drive pulley looks weak
3.  Bitumen sheet on the underside which are used for dampening has started to harden and warp
4.  Springs looked dirty
5.  Wiring can be improved further and headshell on tonearm wobbly

Sounds like quite a bit of work there...

Over the last weekend I actually did quite a bit of work on the TD160.  I re-pasted bitumen sheet on the underside of the TD160, and fitted the AudioSilente Drive Pulley.  The Drive Pulley was easy but damn ex.  The bitumen is cheap but damn sticky.  The springs were cleaned, reloaded and adjusted.

Drive pulley with new belt

Spinning nicely to my eyes

Speed looks ok

Hope to have time this weekend for the Tp16 tonearm

Project 2 - Generation 1 - Idler Drive, the year was 1968

Sometime in March I have the opportunity to lay my hands on a reasonably conditioned Lenco L75.  I paid loads for it.  Until recently when I was working on the TD160, I took it out and explored how I can also make this Turntable look better.  The stock arm is still there minus the head shell and it look battered.  The 2 part tonearm has a shaky feel and the best remedy I have read is to wrap dental floss on it until its firm.  Not the ideal answer I was expecting.  Also I have read enough to conclude that it is not the ideal arm that I am looking for and disassembling it is the first thing I did on this turntable.  Previous owner did replace the V blocks with new ones and the condition is very good.  The rubber is still bouncy to the feel of my fingers.  I deliberated about spending 50 pounds or so for a set of Desmo V blocks but scraped the idea in a day.  I think I will get a new tonearm and my mind is set on the Rega RB251 at the moment.  So my shopping list for the Lenco 75 would be:

1.  New Tonearm
2.  Sand down, cover screwholes, followed by spray painting the deck (Hopefully some spray shop will take my order)
3.  Heavy Plinth with space for outboard tonearms (This one will require a lot of work!)
4.  Power and signal cables revamp

Project 3 - Generation 3 - Direct Drive, the year was 1984

Some time this month I bought a dodgy Direct Drive Turntable.  I wanted a piece of Direct Drive for comparison.  It was a Denon DP-21F.  The seller said Start/Stop does not work but still spins.  I double confirmed that it still spins and paid a reasonable price for it.  By the way the seller also said that the stylus needs a change too.  My intention is to see if I can fix it before investing in a DL-60 or DSN-60E.  I read that some had good results with the AT95E which I currently owned.  Now let’s focus…  When someone tells you the problem is with the start/stop, look no where else other than the start/stop.  I noticed the tact switch for the stop button does not respond to pressure anymore. 

That may be the easiest repair at $1 a button.  Swop in the new tact switches but still didn’t work.  The problem seems to be from the detection circuit.  Realized that it may be due to one of the photocells. 

Also the cartridge, don't think it will go anywhere. 

I wonder if they are sold at Koba or SLT.  Seriously need to make a trip to gather some parts...

Thats all for now, will try to update if I have progress and pics  ;D

jlow
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 14:33 by ed »

Offline DIYer Straits

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2017, 19:04 »
Awesome, Bro. Got to keep them soldering irons heating or else our brains go down the drain.  ;D
Audere' Est Facere'    COME ON YOU SPURS.......
Laptop via XMOS
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Technics SL1200Mk2 (Modded) : Magnepan Unitrac : AT 33PTG/AT ART7
Ortofon T30 MC step-up, Custom MM WAD Phono3S Tube Phonostage/DACT CT100 (modded)
Custom 6N5P/6N6p Aikido Preamplifier
Modded TPA3118 Class D amplifier/Modded TPA 3255 power amplifier/Anaview AMS1000 power amplifier/KT88 SE
FAST with a 6.5" Satori mid and a 12" Pro woofer/Some Satori in birch ply cabinets with a PR/KEF R300
To be updated

Offline ed

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2017, 20:57 »
Sanj, still active huh...

My challenge is bad eyesight these days and of course time!

jlow

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


Offline DIYer Straits

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2017, 21:16 »
Bad eyesight? No problem laa. I had an optician make a couple of high magnification prescription glasses for me, that allows me to do SMD soldering.

The things that I do for DIY....
Audere' Est Facere'    COME ON YOU SPURS.......
Laptop via XMOS
Khadas Tone DAC
Technics SL1200Mk2 (Modded) : Magnepan Unitrac : AT 33PTG/AT ART7
Ortofon T30 MC step-up, Custom MM WAD Phono3S Tube Phonostage/DACT CT100 (modded)
Custom 6N5P/6N6p Aikido Preamplifier
Modded TPA3118 Class D amplifier/Modded TPA 3255 power amplifier/Anaview AMS1000 power amplifier/KT88 SE
FAST with a 6.5" Satori mid and a 12" Pro woofer/Some Satori in birch ply cabinets with a PR/KEF R300
To be updated

ghemml

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2017, 22:17 »
Damn sweet, I think turntable will be the last domain that I probably will not enter. But seeing people modify them and make them sound awesome always amazed me.

Offline ed

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2017, 08:49 »
Bad eyesight? No problem laa. I had an optician make a couple of high magnification prescription glasses for me, that allows me to do SMD soldering.

The things that I do for DIY....


You are quite right there, I have quite a number of reading glasses for soldering only...

Offline ed

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2017, 10:04 »
You are quite right there, I have quite a number of reading glasses for soldering only...

It took me more than 9 mths to get the project moving from reading to execution.  I read a lot articles, and got myself awfully confused and then decided on what I want to do.

The attributes of good TT setup is rather consistent over multiple interest groups and forums.

Roughly as below, though not exhaustive:-

1.  A good plinth helps most of the time.  The Thorens is an exception in this case since the tonearms and sub platter is inversely spring loaded on the same plane, which makes it immaterial for a heavy base.  Great design to me.  The Lenco L75 sits on springs which many said is not a good design.  I have heard the stock L75s and they sound great.  I have also heard a L75 on thick plinth some 15 years back and had no impression now.  My intention is to bolt the L75 on a heavy base since I am already dumping the stock arm and there is no point keep it stock anymore.  The Denon DD I have cannot be ported to a wooden plinth due to its inherent design.  The higher range can be done and I have seen some really great works of DD TTs on wooden plinth.  I will likely set it on a wooden base if I can fix the auto loading tonearm.  Else installing a new tonearm may require some work.

2.  Tonearms!  9 inch, 10 inch, 12 inch, Straight Arm, J Arm or S Arm, many school of thoughts.  I will just go with the straight arms for this one.  Some of the parts I ordered are still pending delivery at the moment so I can still deliberate on this one.  If all goes well only the L75 will need a new tonearm.  I will likely cater more space on the plinth in case other interesting tonearm comes along

3.  MM or MC?  MM for now since I have a pretty decent MM Phonostage.  I am not trying to start a War here. 

4.  Cartridge… I am keen to see how cartridge and its alignment affects the overall performance of the TTs.  I have read enough to conclude that this is the most important part if you have a correctly setup TT with near zero vibration.  I am also aware of the effects of weight applied on the cartridge.  This is my main interest to be frank.

Hope I have time for the next series of update soon…

jlow

Offline j45yip

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2017, 10:35 »
Nice to see you back. I believe the L75 would probably outperform the other 2 after your refurbishing job. Plenty to do in term of mods and upgrades. Any chance of going the PTP way? What arm and cartridge do you have in mind?
Vecteur D2 CD Transport, AN1865n-k Non-OS DAC
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5687 WOT Preamplifier
Behringer DCX2496
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Offline ed

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2017, 16:00 »
Nice to see you back. I believe the L75 would probably outperform the other 2 after your refurbishing job. Plenty to do in term of mods and upgrades. Any chance of going the PTP way? What arm and cartridge do you have in mind?

Nice to see you around too Jo.  I wanted the PTP but it may take me forever and that is why I am keeping the L75 as the last.  Arm I was thinking of the Rega RB251.  Have been reading a lot on Audiomods mod lately.  The souped up RB251 looks very attractive.  Cartridge wise still open.

Offline GAGA@echoloft

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2017, 20:21 »
awesome posts in a long time.....
The Way Is Not In The Sky
The Way Is In The Heart

To attain Knowledge, add things everyday
To attain Wisdom, remove things everyday

Offline ed

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2017, 09:07 »
Finally have some time last weekend for some followup, the previous weekend I was trying to fix something for my wife, which of course takes priority.  I will show you some interesting stuff I did for her when I have time to take some pics...

I got my photocells and soldered them onto the Denon DD TT immediately.  They worked and the auto loading tonearm is functional again.  For those who are trying to fixed their dodgy autoloading tonearms pls note that the photocell has to have a resistive load of 10-15k for my case.  Varies from TT to TT and naked wires can cause electrical shocks which is life endangering.  DIY only works when you know what you are doing.  Also modded the power cord to an IEC male so that it is easier to tap power from my power distributor.

Also took out the cartridge.  An ADC XLM MKIII Improved

Great sounding cartridge as I read.  The replacement stylus is very expensive.  But before you make that very expensive purchase pls note that it is important you ascertain the functionality of the cartridge coils in the cartridge body.  I did my due diligence and found out that one of the channels is dodgy.  See MM readings below:

Luckily I still have my test cartridge, the AT95.  So I popped it in immediately and everything was singing alright.  The autoloading is a bit off as it releases the cartridge too far out.  Guessed I need to realign from the underside another day when I am ready to hot glue some of the wobbly parts and dampen the chassis with spare bitumen sheets.

Also took put my Shure M95 with new stylus from Jico to mount on the Thorens tonearm.  Shocked to find out that I misplaced the mounting screws!  Now I am as good as screwed!  No choice got to place an order and leave this project there for a moment.

Now shift gears to the Lenco L75.  Here are some pics after I removed the stock tonearm.

Resting on springs. 

Idler wheels condition is very good

V blocks still in good condition

Top of table needs a new coat of paint.  I don’t think I want grey as it looked boring.  I will take some time to think about this over the week…

So the weekday assignments for the week will be to get ply for plinth of L75, tonearm of L75, cartridge screws.  Sounds like an exciting weekend in the making.  No not really, don’t think the stuff will arrive by this weekend.  As for working on this plinth this weekend???  OMG sounds like a lot of sweat!  I will think hard about it…
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 14:34 by ed »

ghemml

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2017, 08:52 »

Offline DIYer Straits

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2017, 20:47 »
Never had time to work on the plinth or anything during the weekend coz I received this item.  Spent a lot of time studying the tonearm and figuring out the mods for it.  Lots of room for improvement I would say.  Also spent time touching up my headphone amp as I want to have a closed up comparison of the turntables.

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


You got this tonearm from eBay? It lacks a tonearm lift but you can buy that from UK.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2017, 20:53 by DIYer Straits »
Audere' Est Facere'    COME ON YOU SPURS.......
Laptop via XMOS
Khadas Tone DAC
Technics SL1200Mk2 (Modded) : Magnepan Unitrac : AT 33PTG/AT ART7
Ortofon T30 MC step-up, Custom MM WAD Phono3S Tube Phonostage/DACT CT100 (modded)
Custom 6N5P/6N6p Aikido Preamplifier
Modded TPA3118 Class D amplifier/Modded TPA 3255 power amplifier/Anaview AMS1000 power amplifier/KT88 SE
FAST with a 6.5" Satori mid and a 12" Pro woofer/Some Satori in birch ply cabinets with a PR/KEF R300
To be updated

Offline ed

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2017, 08:44 »
Finally bought the required parts and started working on the tonearm again.  Took out the stock headshell and wanted to replace it with this…

But the construct was different and the pins were shorter. Wasted!  Probably need to see how I can rework on it some other day or get another tonearm if I decided to switch the L75 to a larger plinth.  Stared at the headshell for 5 minutes and was very impressed with the self adjusting capabilities and finishing.  Imagine a nicely grooved stylus on your records all the time.  But that has yet to be tested.  If just looked promising, really promising...

Now back to the stock Thorens headshell again.  Fixed the Shure M95 with new stylus from Jico.  Connect up, a bit wobbly, gave it a push, better. 

Setting up is really easy, every goes to zero, adjust counter weight to balance tonearm till it is almost parallel (can’t say parallel since it done with my failing eyesight) to the turntable top.  Click the antiskate till the tonearms stays put at the end-of-record position.  Lastly set tracking force to 2g (my preferred).  Thorens made it really easy to setup its tonearm, everything done in a minute.  Cartridge alignment next, I stick a mechanical pencil lead to the cartridge and aligned it with an Arc protractor.  This was easy too. 

As I play the records I realized that the M95 picked up details which was not present on the AT95.  Justified for the money spent on the Jico stylus.

Music for now, hearing something different, which made the upgrade purchases worthwhile.  Coupled with servicing of the springs and redamping, this TT will run for a long time.  The motor is still very strong at this moment.  But finding a replacement is easy these day.

Next will explain a bit about my upgrade phonostage and tonearm which I am preparing for the L75.  Stay tuned…
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 14:35 by ed »

Offline BTW

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Re: New project alert! 3 Generations
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2017, 08:52 »
Nice work bro..... Just for info... If you want to upgrade your lenco bearing.... Try Sien's bearings, very reasonably priced and getting great reviews.

https://notanotherhifiblog.blogspot.sg/2017/10/slab-it-and-you-shall-be-suprised.html

 

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