Topic: Looking into buying vinyi cleaning machine..

[Ilovehifi]

What brand is recommended?

Manuel cleaning like unable to do
a 100% clean job.

Thanks

[Analog_Solutions]

I have used the Clearaudio Matrix, Nessie, Loricraft and DIY Ultra Sonic cleaners.
None of them will 100% suit everyone. It is a matter of which feature is important to you.

1. Clearaudio or Nessie
This will appeal to people who want convenience and everything to be done by a push a button.  The downside is that the brush and the vacuum felt will gather dirt and you can only replace them with proprietory brush and felt.  Not only that you do not have control over the pressure being applied by the brush onto the LP.  Over time, your records will become dirtier even after cleaning.  The motors are relatively noisy no matter what people say.

2. DIY Ultra Sonic

For ultra sonic cleaners, you must be careful of the cleaning agent which you add to the distilled water as well as to watch over the temperature of the water after a few cycles of cleaning.  After cleaning, you will have to place the LPs on a drying rack to dry manually.  If your cleaning agent or emulsifier is not effective, there will be water marks left on the LPs.

3. Loricraft
To me the Loricraft is the best compromise among all those I have tried. There is no auto button.  You need to apply the cleaning liquid manually and hold the brush to clean the records.  This allows you to control the pressure as well as the specific areas to be cleaned.  Some very old LPs have mold at the edge of the label.  I am able to clean these off.  But on ultra sonic or clearaudio type of cleaner, you cannot do that.  During suction, there is a nylon thread resting between the suction pump and the LP and for each LP, a new section of the thread is used.  So there is no issue of dirty vacuum felt.  The other important advantage is that the Loricraft is very very quiet.  I can play my LPs while playing music at the same time.  No matter what people say about the Clearaudio or the Nessie being quiet, they are still comparatively noisy especially when you use it at night when your family is resting or asleep. 

[BTW]

I use the Zenn Audio spinner version..... simple, easy and fast to use.

http://www.zenn.com.sg/zenn_record_cleaning_machine.htm

[jerome_the_lang]

I bought loricraft, and then the spinner as the backup/initial cleaner for ultra dirty records.

Ended up the spinner becoming the main cleaner because it makes records sound better.

The loricraft have several problems.

First, during cleaning, water tend to splash over the sides making it necessary to prepare box of tissue to wipe off the top surface of the main box.

Secondly, the thread underneath the nozzle is a source of sound degradation - silk rubbing over surface of vinyl records can create a type of static that makes records sound closed-in with a bit rolled off at the top frequencies.

Thirdly, you can't really leave the loricraft alone.

Lastly, the bottle at the side which collects the dirty water and used thread looks really yucky after a while.

The spinner enables contact-less cleaning and drying to allow records to sound better. I ordered some modifications to the sizes of the top and bottom clamps to cover the label properly and to ensure the bottom clam doesn't come into contact with the groove area.

[jtsamarinda]

Not so when using the Loricraft, it's a good machine I would put it in second place to the KL Audio Ultra Sonic.
It sounds like you are putting to much water while cleaning.So you get spill over.
Third order I place the VPI cleaner.

[jerome_the_lang]

Won't rinse properly if you are going to be so stingy with water...

 

Anyway it proves that you can't leave the loricraft alone.

The issue with sound-degrading static arising from the silk thread underneath the nozzle rubbing against record surface continues to plague the loricraft.

Go contact-less cleaning and drying for better sound!

 

[jtsamarinda]

Sorry not so. The thread is there to have a gap so vacuum could suck out the dirt and protect the nozzle from damaging the vinyl record. Use the proper thread supplied you would not have static build up. It's only when you use nylon thread than you will have that problem of static. Once you have scrub the record with applied brush you could leave it for a while, while it sucks the dirt.

Owner of Loricraft, KL Audio, VPI Typoon. DIY Ultra sonic cleaner and DIY cross between Loricraft and Keith Monk.

[jerome_the_lang]

Sorry not so. The thread is there to have a gap so vacuum could suck out the dirt and protect the nozzle from damaging the vinyl record. Use the proper thread supplied you would not have static build up. It's only when you use nylon thread than you will have that problem of static. Once you have scrub the record with applied brush you could leave it for a while, while it sucks the dirt.

Owner of Loricraft, KL Audio, VPI Typoon. DIY Ultra sonic cleaner and DIY cross between Loricraft and Keith Monk.

Hahaha, the truth is staring at you right in your face and you are still clueless.

The KL audio cleaner is a contact-less cleaner/dryer

There is a reason why the KLA sounds better and it is not just due to the ultrasonic cleaning method. The contact-less drying is one of the major reasons.

The thread rubbing against the record surface is a major detrimental problem.

But there are other, far more cheaper options of contact-less cleaning and drying out there that might even yield better sound that the KLA

 

[jtsamarinda]

Haaaa! Yes you are right.( The thread if used the original does not damage the groove if setup correctly).  The KL Audio use ultra Sonic for cleaning it also has disadvantage which even is contactless  can damage the groove of the record due to cavitation if the power level is not controlled. As in many cheap ultra sonic machine. Which are been sold. But the ultimate cleaner is still the KL Audio if you can afford it.

[jerome_the_lang]

First, many people has claimed that after ultrasonic cleaning, vinyl records can sound "dulled". Coupled with microscopic debris found at the bottom of the reservoir, many people believe that the cavitation process can potentially damage records. This has not been proven.

OTOH, what is really not known to the generally leaden-eared audiophiles is that different water coming into contact with vinyl records that change its sound temporarily, even if it just 1 second of contact.

Distilled water can make records sound dulled. Raised temperature exacerbate the sonic changes further.

But all this is just temporary.

Spray tap water over the record and dry it without contact with other materials other than air, you will be able to restore its sound to it's original pristine condition.

The KLA is a nice convenient machine to have.

But having the ability to apply tap water for final sound conditioning is lacking.

[jtsamarinda]

First, many people has claimed that after ultrasonic cleaning, vinyl records can sound "dulled". Coupled with microscopic debris found at the bottom of the reservoir, many people believe that the cavitation process can potentially damage records. This has not been proven.




OTOH, what is really not known to the generally leaden-eared audiophiles is that different water coming into contact with vinyl records that change its sound temporarily, even if it just 1 second of contact.

Distilled water can make records sound dulled. Raised temperature exacerbate the sonic changes further.

But all this is just temporary.

Spray tap water over the record and dry it without contact with other materials other than air, you will be able to restore its sound to it's original pristine condition.

The KLA is a nice convenient machine to have.

But having the ability to apply tap water for final sound conditioning is lacking.

1. Do some research on cavtation it does damage the vinyl groove. Have a 500X microscope and check it out. the debris you find contain dirt as well as vinyl, this only happens on those cheap Ultra sonic machine which are design for medical purpose. I guess you are not well informed ( jerome_the_lang).
2. KL Audio has a second machine Model KD-CLN-LP200S which has the ability to use tap water with a filtering system, keeps out the dirt and sediment contamination of tap water.

3. Using tap water is a no no. Why? your water which you drink contains lots of mineral deposit e.g sand and other dirt if not filtered and the water does not  smear (E.g water marks) compared to distill water where there is no water tension. As well as filtered tap water.

I have heard and tested tap water gives a better sound cause the tap water contains milky sustains which acts as lubricate directly after wash. When it's dried it hardens like mud and thus sounds grainy.