Author Topic: OLED TV Thread  (Read 119675 times)

Offline zanter

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #30 on: January 06, 2014, 06:40 »
Maybe using the white will prolong the blue OLED a bit but the blue pixel will still deteriorate affecting the color gamut? If you change tv every 2/3 years sorta person I guess doesnt matter. If it cheap it doesnt matter but if consumer pay double/triple for maybe 1/4 of lifespan then we should at least be aware of what we are getting into.

Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #31 on: January 06, 2014, 12:24 »
LG has all-white OLED (no Blue OLED) panel, so practically it should be able to side-step the Blue OLED's problem.

Here's a write-up in Whats HiFi magazine which lays out the pros and cons of current OLED technology.

OLED TV problems

OLED is extremely expensive to produce and therefore to buy –

OLED production, at the moment, has a relatively low yield, which means that for every set fit for sale, a high number are thrown to the scrapheap.

Recent reports put LG’s OLED yield at 60-70%, while Samsung is at 40-50%. OLED’s hefty price tags won’t start to drop until these yield figures increase, but the good news is they’re improving at a faster rate than anticipated so OLED prices should fall as fast.

Another of OLED’s problems concerns the pesky blue pixel. Because the OLED material used to make blue light deteriorates more quickly than red and green, its lifespan is shorter and over time the colour balance could be affected.

Samsung’s solution is to make the blue pixel twice the size of the other colours while LG’s all-white OLEDs overlaid with RGB colour filters system should side-step the problem. But as OLED is in its infancy it’s hard to know how this issue will play out in the long term.

It’s also worth noting that like plasma, OLED is susceptible to screen burn.

OLED TV benefits

OLED technology, however, has several advantages over LCD and plasma technology. First there are the physical benefits – OLED sets are lighter and thinner than LCD due to the lack of a backlight.

But of greater interest to home cinema enthusiasts are the picture quality benefits, of which there are several. Because OLED pixels emit light directly, viewing angles are much wider, plus colour and contrast stay the same from as far as 90 degrees off centre.

And because each pixel can be turned off individually, OLED TVs can deliver an absolute black and infinite contrast ratio – the Holy Grail for picture purists everywhere. OLED pictures are also brighter and achieve response times of less than 0.01ms, which practically eliminates motion blur. (Note however, OLED TVs are not completely free of motion blur in all cases inspite of OLED's inherent fast switching time. It depends on the method used by manufacturers to drive them as well as the frame rate of the source material).

Offline zanter

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #32 on: January 06, 2014, 15:09 »
If no blue OLED can render blue color?

LG that is using a stack of red, green, and blue OLEDs to make white light. This method is allowing them to use a fluorescent blue that has apparently better stability over time than the blue that other companies will use. It has to do with physics, that is to generate blue you need a high level of quantum energy state which leads to deterioration to the OLED substrate. Also the individual blue/red/green OLED don't have to work as hard to produce white.

There are issues with the OLED aging problem that could lead to the following:

 A) The blue OLED aging differently than the RED/Green OLED, it will cause colour shift over time or inaccurate colour representation .

 B) As all OLED pixels age, they will be susceptible to burn in and the more the OLED are used or not used the burn in issue will intensify.

OLED are relatively new technology hence, its only recently people who have a 2+ year old OLED device start noticing yellowing screens.

Bottom line is your money , your choice. Just pays to be informed and not get carried away in plonking for a 15k set which last you 2/3 years. Maybe once the manufacturer are confident enough to give 3 year warranty to OLED TV  only then its good insurance.



Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #34 on: January 06, 2014, 19:46 »
If no blue OLED can render blue color?

LG that is using a stack of red, green, and blue OLEDs to make white light. This method is allowing them to use a fluorescent blue that has apparently better stability over time than the blue that other companies will use. It has to do with physics, that is to generate blue you need a high level of quantum energy state which leads to deterioration to the OLED substrate. Also the individual blue/red/green OLED don't have to work as hard to produce white.

There are issues with the OLED aging problem that could lead to the following:

 A) The blue OLED aging differently than the RED/Green OLED, it will cause colour shift over time or inaccurate colour representation .

 B) As all OLED pixels age, they will be susceptible to burn in and the more the OLED are used or not used the burn in issue will intensify.

OLED are relatively new technology hence, its only recently people who have a 2+ year old OLED device start noticing yellowing screens.

Bottom line is your money , your choice. Just pays to be informed and not get carried away in plonking for a 15k set which last you 2/3 years. Maybe once the manufacturer are confident enough to give 3 year warranty to OLED TV  only then its good insurance.

It is white OLEDs which have red, green, blue filters, in simple terms,  placed over them. When the white OLEDs are lit and shine through the filters you see them as RGB OLEDs as they take on the colour of the individual colour filter placed over them, very much like stage lighting.

The subtrate used to produce white light is different from the subtrate used to produce blue light. LG do not use "stack of RGB Oleds to produce white light". If they do that then they will never be able to side-step the problem of the Blue Oled as they will have the Blue Oled still in the mix.


Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #35 on: January 06, 2014, 20:58 »
Ok  illustrations below may give a better idea of the different approach taken by LG:



Samsung's method incorporates discrete red, green and blue subpixels into its display, just like a plasma or LED LCD. Given the uncertainty surrounding the blue pixel, it's uncertain what the long-term reliability will be.

LG's way around the "blue" problem is also potentially more cost-effective. It uses a grid made up of white OLEDs (which is actually compressed layers of red, green and blue OLEDs). Over these the company overlays a series of color filters to produce four different subpixels: red, green, blue and white.

To be fair, it may be years before we know which one wins in terms of reliability or longevity, let alone market popularity.

The bottom line is that OLED is essentially a brand-new technology in big-screen TVs, and a number of questions remain. Never the less, it has the potential to be the next plasma or LED LCD TVs.  :)

Offline zanter

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #36 on: January 06, 2014, 21:11 »
I think some misunderstand as to the LG OLED so I cut & paste from http://www.displaymate.com/LG_OLED_TV_ShootOut_1.htm.  LG OLED as illustrated does use stacking which include blue red green white subpixels  to form a pixel hence the there is a blue OLED except that it is stacked. Maybe the stacking improves lifespan. Only time will tell how fast the color gamut will deteriorate but undoubtedly OLED has a lifespan of about 25k hours, with slowly reducing brightness of varying degrees depending on color. Anyway by that time they will perfect Laser Phosphor Display (LPD),which is rumored that Panasonic is adopting in lieu of Plasma. Read more about LPD http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Phosphor_Display

LG OLED TV Technology

This LG TV has some unique OLED technology. First of all, rather than laying out a matrix of separate Red, Green, and Blue OLED sub-pixels throughout, the TV has a uniform set of WRGB sub-pixels that are made as a stack of various colors of OLEDs. This approach simplifies the OLED production, improves yields, and lowers the manufacturing cost. A set of Red, Green and Blue sub-pixel filters, which LG calls a Color Refiner, recovers the desired Red, Green and Blue OLED colors for each sub-pixel. This approach also improves Viewing Angle performance, which is outstanding. LG has also added a 4th clear sub-pixel to every pixel, which produces pure White. This increases the display’s power efficiency and also improves color accuracy and color management. See the Lab Measurements and Technical Analysis section for more information on White Sub-pixels. Lastly, the OLED pixels are all driven by an Active Matrix IGZO Metal Oxide backplane. The Refresh Rate for the display is 120 Hz. Not surprisingly, it’s a cutting edge state-of-the-art display throughout
« Last Edit: January 06, 2014, 21:17 by zanter »

Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #37 on: January 06, 2014, 23:40 »
...  but undoubtedly OLED has a lifespan of about 25k hours, with slowly reducing brightness of varying degrees depending on color. ...

25,000 hours lifespan is more than 8 years, assuming 8 hours a day!!

Thanks zanter .  :)

Offline econav

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #38 on: January 07, 2014, 07:48 »
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Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #39 on: January 11, 2014, 10:48 »
According to an article in OLED-Info.com, LG's WOLED technology was originally developed by Kodak

Kodak's OLED technology

Back in December 2009, LG bought Kodak's OLED business - mainly for Kodak's OLED Intellectual Property. LG paid $100 million for the OLED unit. Kodak had many basic OLED patents as they were the early pioneers behind this technology.

LG's WRGB (White-OLED with color filters, or WOLED) design used in their OLED TVs is based on technology developed at Kodak. WRGB TVs are easier to fabricate because there's no need to pattern subpixels.


More info below:

Kodak's  Active Matrix White OLED architecture

Based on years of experience, Kodak is convinced the path to a low cost, high performing AMOLED display is through the use of WOLED (white-emitting OLED). The benefits include scalability, no need for shadow mask (faster TACT time), and overall better production yield. For OLED to compete successfully in the large-size TV market, the manufacturing approach chosen must be low cost and high yield. Part of "low-cost" means that OLED deposition process must be practiced on the same large glass sizes that are used for LCD TV's (e.g. Gen 8 2160X2400mm, – glass the size of a queen sized bed) in machines with very high throughput.

Kodak has focused its development (OLED materials, white formulations, Tandem Architecture, deposition sources, sub-pixel layouts, display designs, and color filter materials) to enable scale-up to these large sizes with high throughput. The key difference between the Kodak approach and the approach pursued by others is that the Kodak approach is based upon uniform deposition of white-emitting OLED materials (WOLED), whereas others are pursuing the precision patterned deposition of red, green, and blue emitting materials according to the sub-pixel pattern inside the display area (the so-called RGB approach).

The White approach requires color filters patterned according to the sub-pixel pattern. These color filters are typically fabricated using photolithographic methods, which are already scaled to the large glass sizes as they are used for LCD TV's. Kodak's white-emitting OLED approach, therefore, is fully scalable to Gen 8 glass sizes since the only precision patterning required is the same patterning currently used for LCD TV's.

For the Kodak White OLED approach, there are no operations that require precision-shadow-mask patterning materials for the individual sub-pixels – the same materials are used everywhere. This facilitates high-speed processing by eliminating slow alignment operations or slow laser-transfer operations, enables scale-up to large displays and large-size sheets of mother-glass, and permits the concept of a machine with a continuous flow-through deposition operation.

Source: OLED-Info.com


Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #40 on: January 11, 2014, 13:41 »
Fewer OLED TVs in the next few years.

Speaking in an interview with USA Today, S Kim, Samsung's vice president for visual displays broke some worrying news. Samsung will not have OLED TVs for the next 3-4 years.

The reason for this, according to Mr. Kim is OLED TVs are very difficult to manufacture and, because of that, prices are far too high for consumers and for Samsung to further develop the market.

Earlier, Sony and Panasonic were said to have called off their collaboration to co-develop OLED TVs to compete with the Koreans and was a telling sign that Panasonic and Sony did not have any OLED TV on display at the recent CES 2014.

We are now left with LG and a few Chinese manufacturers who are reported to be using LG's white OLED panels.

Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #41 on: June 27, 2014, 12:13 »
Latest, LG has just launched their 65" and 77" 4K UHD OLED TVs using LG's own WRGB OLED technology in the UK.  Both are curved screens with built-in H.264 and HEVC H.265 decoders that make it possible to display 4K contents from external devices connected to the TV's HDMI, USB or LAN ports.

The 65" 4K OLED is priced at British Pounds 5,999 (S$12,800).

www.avforums.com/news/lg-launches-world-first-curved-ultra-hd-4k-oled-tv-in-the-uk-77ec980v-65ec970v.10460

On another note, LG is gearing up OLED production and is already supplying the panels to Skyworth, ChangHong and Konka in China, a good bet that OLED TVs will become mainstream sooner and falling prices will "put the cat amongst 4K LCD TV pigeons".

www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1403784423

« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 12:21 by AB Chan »

Offline avo

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #42 on: June 27, 2014, 13:27 »
Very aggressive pricing indeed. LG must be very confident of their panel yield from their new M2 OLED line.

Offline AB Chan

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #43 on: May 19, 2015, 23:17 »
Looks like the days of projector-less Home Theatre using detachable wallpaper-thin OLED screens up to a 100" may not be too far away in the near future.

LG presented today in Korea, a 55" 0.97mm thick OLED panel weighing 1.9kg that can be stuck to a wall with a magnetic mat and can also be easily removed from it.

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/full/2015/05/19/80/1200000000AEN20150519006000320F.html


Offline francis wu

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Re: OLED TV Thread
« Reply #44 on: May 19, 2015, 23:28 »
Problem is that it's only FHD n not 4K! 

From my One+