Author Topic: Best USB Cable for under $800  (Read 35450 times)

Online joamonte

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #30 on: February 08, 2012, 21:39 »
Hi Joamonte, can you tell me the SQ difference moving from Konstantin USB to Challenger? I'm using Konstantin at the moment. Thanks

I would say it is just like changing a smaller speaker to same brand bigger speaker....something like changing a ATC SCM 20 to SCM50 , or B&W 805 to 802 if you know what I mean.

More "meat", more relax and better dynamic contrast is expected but the most impressive part is it make the music sound more "sweet" than Konstantin.

The Konstantin is already much musical USB cable compare to the AQ and Kimber I own before  , but once compare side by side with challanger it is difficult to listen back to Konstantin in the next few days.

if AQ coffee and Kimber Ag usb cable score about 3, Konstantin with small grounding box score 7/10 , I would say Challenger with the big box score 10/10 to me now, I don't dare to try their $2k+ USB cable yet because I afraid I would need to spend money again, this USB cable thing really have great impact on sound, but I figure spend too much on it is not very wise because there are alway better cable coming out due to computer technology keep upgrading,  $1k+ is my limit now...... ::) ;D
 
« Last Edit: February 08, 2012, 22:11 by joamonte »

Offline mickomeg

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2012, 22:03 »
I would say it is just like changing a smaller speaker to same brand bigger speaker....something like changing a ATC SCM 20 to SCM50 , or B&W 805 to 802 if you know what I mean.

More "meat", more relax and better dynamic contrast is expected but the most impressive part is it make the music sound more "sweet" than Konstantin.

The Konstantin is already much musical USB cable compare to the AQ and Kimber I own before  , but once compare side by side with challanger it is difficult to listen back to Konstantin in the next few days.

if AQ and Kimber Ag usb cable score about 3, Konstantin with small grounding box score 7/10 , I would say Challenger with the big box score 10/10 to me now, I don't dare to try their $2k+ USB cable yet because I afraid I would need to spend money again, this USB cable thing really have great impact on sound, but I figure spend too much on it is not very wise because there are alway better cable coming out due to computer technology keep upgrading,  $1k+ is my limit now...... ::) ;D

Wow Bro you are tempting me now... :P
JPLAY -> CAPS v2.1 -> Bel Canto uLink -> DEQX (DeqXpert time, phase & room corrected) -> JOB 225 -> Clearwave Symphonia 7R & JL Audio f110, Gigawatt PC2 Evo, Jorma S/PDIF, Entreq Challenger USB & MinimUs, Wywires Gold, Audioquest Sub-3, LessLoss DFPC Signature, TAOC

Offline composition

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #32 on: February 08, 2012, 22:10 »
Bro Joamonte,

So you have to use the Challenger USB together with the TellUs, and the Konstantin with the MinimUs. That's how you gave the 10/10  and 7/10 scores?

So the effect without the ground boxes (ie just the USB cables alone) will be less performing I suppose.

Offline Cerano

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #33 on: February 08, 2012, 22:56 »
uhm no offence bros... im quite sceptical of this... especially since the lengths are too short for EMI or RFI to affect it...

just like some people claim HDMIs make a difference or to take the cake, the rack holding the amp also make a huge difference... new rack punchier bass everything... i think abit ridiculous.

That said I did spend on high end cables too to err on the side of error even though i cant tell the difference.

Are you sure its not psychological?

Offline watchdog

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #34 on: February 08, 2012, 23:43 »
No offence taken.

And no offence to you, but if you can't tell the difference between cables or the difference in racks (admittedly hard to A/B), it could very well be that your system simply cannot resolve the differences. Look on the bright side, you save plenty of money if you cannot notice any difference.

uhm no offence bros... im quite sceptical of this... especially since the lengths are too short for EMI or RFI to affect it...

just like some people claim HDMIs make a difference or to take the cake, the rack holding the amp also make a huge difference... new rack punchier bass everything... i think abit ridiculous.

That said I did spend on high end cables too to err on the side of error even though i cant tell the difference.

Are you sure its not psychological?
Less is more !

Offline Cerano

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #35 on: February 08, 2012, 23:45 »
No offence taken.

And no offence to you, but if you can't tell the difference between cables or the difference in racks (admittedly hard to A/B), it could very well be that your system simply cannot resolve the differences. Look on the bright side, you save plenty of money if you cannot notice any difference.

very true that too. im mostly in HT so differences are less apparent. Either that or my ears are not well trained enough.

I think im more skeptical on the effect of racks.

Offline Quest

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #36 on: February 09, 2012, 00:12 »
very true that too. im mostly in HT so differences are less apparent. Either that or my ears are not well trained enough.

I think im more skeptical on the effect of racks.
effect of racks is easy to test actually. :) can just borrow a platform from someone to see if you can hear.
try to get something of good quality so the gap is big enough to tell. if u are inexperienced typically a large difference is needed.

if u can't, like watchdog says, it's not necessarily a bad thing.

Offline composition

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #37 on: February 09, 2012, 00:20 »
uhm no offence bros... im quite sceptical of this... especially since the lengths are too short for EMI or RFI to affect it...

just like some people claim HDMIs make a difference or to take the cake, the rack holding the amp also make a huge difference... new rack punchier bass everything... i think abit ridiculous.

That said I did spend on high end cables too to err on the side of error even though i cant tell the difference.

Are you sure its not psychological?

This evening I did an A/B with my Furutech GT2 and a normal USB cable to make sure that the GT2 is well worth the $100+ bucks. When I removed the Furutech and replaced it with a normal USB, and guess what. The immense soundstage collapsed, the articulate and rich vocals were gone, and the 'as if you were there' realism vanished. When I put back the Furutech everything came back.

So like it or not, USB cable do make a significant difference, and it is very easy to tell, in fact no need to have a pair of trained ears to hear the diff.

Offline Quest

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #38 on: February 09, 2012, 00:22 »
This evening I did an A/B with my Furutech GT2 and a normal USB cable to make sure that the GT2 is well worth the $100+ bucks. When I removed the Furutech and replaced it with a normal USB, and guess what. The immense soundstage collapsed, the articulate and rich vocals were gone, and the 'as if you were there' realism vanished. When I put back the Furutech everything came back.

So like it or not, USB cable do make a significant difference, and it is very easy to tell, in fact no need to have a pair of trained ears to hear the diff.
on this note i did do some tests with untrained ears for difference in usb cable.
i think some people can tell the sound is more enjoyable but can't tell u why.. :) others might feel no difference. we have to respect that everyone has their view.

Offline orbital

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #39 on: February 09, 2012, 01:27 »
this USB cable thing really have great impact on sound, but I figure spend too much on it is not very wise because there are alway better cable coming out due to computer technology keep upgrading

+1
Please feel contented at some point so you can experience different sound yearly ;D

Offline Cerano

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #40 on: February 09, 2012, 01:37 »
hi bro

but what is the science behind it?

for example take HDMI cables, we all know that different HDMIs are built differently and over longer lengths many are unable to pass the full amount of data. However due to the error correction capability of players, almost any cable goes.

Picture and sound wise has 100% no difference because the signal is fully regenerated at the other end.

Yet many people still go on about HDMIs being punchier (myself having fallen victim to that too) and more colourful and brighter. Even at places like What hifi with some reviews coming out with ridiculous descriptions.

However we know that analog signals (not digital like in HDMI) there are differences. But in this case what is the explaination for them?

Offline Cerano

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2012, 01:40 »
http://www.tnt-audio.com/clinica/intere.html

think this is an interesting read.

Also, i do not dispute that all cables are equal. Some are definitely better question is where and under what conditions do we find that its enough?

Offline Doggie Howser

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #42 on: February 09, 2012, 02:02 »
I think there's a lot to digital signals and how they are converted to analog that we don't understand 100%.

Digital signals are often viewed as simple 1s and 0s. But

a. signals sent are in voltages and there's attenuation in signals due to impedance mismatching so a 5V not be seen as a 5V signal on the other end. So what do you determine as the cut off: 4? 3? 2.5? If you set it too low, you may end up with false positives. If you don't, you may end up with incomplete information. So you end up implementing error correction.

b. Power supply signals from PCs (even DC) and even from some electronic devices can be dirty. Spikes/surges in power signals can occur. If you ever assembled PCs, you'll understand the importance of a good clean power supply but even good PSUs are not designed for hifi tolerances. Power spikes etc can cause EMI in the data lines.

c. digital signals are time dependent. Jitter is sometimes used to describe intermittent delays in the signal. In high speed circuits, you are expecting the 1s and 0s to arrive in a timely manner. Because of EMI/signal degradation, the rate at which they arrive can be subject to errors in interpretation.


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Offline Cerano

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Re: Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #43 on: February 09, 2012, 02:08 »
I think there's a lot to digital signals and how they are converted to analog that we don't understand 100%.

Digital signals are often viewed as simple 1s and 0s. But

a. signals sent are in voltages and there's attenuation in signals due to impedance mismatching so a 5V not be seen as a 5V signal on the other end. So what do you determine as the cut off: 4? 3? 2.5? If you set it too low, you may end up with false positives. If you don't, you may end up with incomplete information. So you end up implementing error correction.

b. Power supply signals from PCs (even DC) and even from some electronic devices can be dirty. Spikes/surges in power signals can occur. If you ever assembled PCs, you'll understand the importance of a good clean power supply but even good PSUs are not designed for hifi tolerances. Power spikes etc can cause EMI in the data lines.

c. digital signals are time dependent. Jitter is sometimes used to describe intermittent delays in the signal. In high speed circuits, you are expecting the 1s and 0s to arrive in a timely manner. Because of EMI/signal degradation, the rate at which they arrive can be subject to errors in interpretation.

Exactly! All of these describe possible problems which are eliminated by our equipment such as power line filters!
Furthermore, ecc is perfect in most instances except for severely degraded signals in which we get drop outs or sparklies not colour degradation!
As for EMI remember our cables are all shielded by dielectrics. Some even quad shielded. Furthermore our distances are so short emi cannot possibly affect our cable much.

Offline Doggie Howser

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Best USB Cable for under $800
« Reply #44 on: February 09, 2012, 08:04 »
The EMI can come from within. Not without.

Cables like locus use EMI shielding paper between power and data.

Plus additional error correction processing introduces changes in timing.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2012, 08:45 by Doggie Howser »
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