XtremePlace Forum

AV Galaxy => Planet Displays & Projector => Topic started by: econav on January 15, 2019, 10:40

Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: econav on January 15, 2019, 10:40
Just received confirmed Retail list price for the 3 new model and first batch should be landed by end Mar for delivery.

Retail list price,will be posted on the sales post
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=288869.msg1318331#msg1318331


Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 15, 2019, 20:48
Thanks for sharing. :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 16, 2019, 20:53
I have had received quite a few PMs from members asking me for my comments on whether to upgrade the X series to the N series. Unfortunately I am unable to comment at this point. I usually don't like to comment on stuff that I personally have yet to review. It will be considered an extremely irresponsible thing to do if I prematurely state something which I have no personal experience with. As such, I will appreciate if members can stop asking me for my opinion on which is better as I really don't know at this point. The N series could very well be worse than the last gen X series for all we know...

I am pushing for dealers to ship in an early unit of N7 for me to play around with and hopefully before the actual launch, everyone here will have a first-hand info based on my experience playing with it. As always, I will share my review and personal take on some of the new features in this latest N series family.

JVC Singapore has informed local dealers that the earliest shipment for N7 series (at least) will only arrive sometime in Mar. Some dealer told me early Mar while some say end of Mar to early Apr. I think this is too long a wait considering that other countries already selling like hotcakes except for Asia continent this time round. I blame it on the JVC management for failing to do a good job but that's just my take as a customer. Anyway I understand from some dealers that JVC Singapore management team was in talk with JVC Japan side to press for delivery of early pre-orders, hopefully we can get the new N series as early as end of Feb to early Mar. Nothing concrete being firmed up yet.

I will let the dealers provide us with more first-hand info updates on the discussion between the 2 sides. Their info will be more credible than mine.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 18, 2019, 21:36
Today I had placed a pre order for the JVC N7 through a local dealer. If all turns out well, I should be getting the projector either end of Jan or early Feb.

Fingers crossed that I can get it before CNY but I highly doubt it.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 18, 2019, 22:45
Congrats on your new toy.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: jeffong on January 19, 2019, 14:21
Been stuck with my old trusty AE7K PJ for over 5 years now. My attempts over the past two years to upgrade to 4K have been thwarted due to lack of throw distance and unwillingness to downsize my 92 inch screen. However i’m now prepared to size down to 80 inch with the emergence of the N7 but a new deliema has arise.

Given the emergence of premium large screen TV displays, i’m now in two minds over going for a 77/85 inch OLED/LCD over the JVC N7. Assuming total cost would be quite similar, how many of you folks would continue to stick with the PJ route. Thanks for all your comments.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 19, 2019, 14:41
Been stuck with my old trusty AE7K PJ for over 5 years now. My attempts over the past two years to upgrade to 4K have been thwarted due to lack of throw distance and unwillingness to downsize my 92 inch screen. However i’m now prepared to size down to 80 inch with the emergence of the N7 but a new deliema has arise.

Given the emergence of premium large screen TV displays, i’m now in two minds over going for a 77/85 inch OLED/LCD over the JVC N7. Assuming total cost would be quite similar, how many of you folks would continue to stick with the PJ route. Thanks for all your comments.

If large screen flat TVs @ 100" can be bought at below $10k, I would go for a flat screen TV.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: jeffong on January 19, 2019, 14:57
If large screen flat TVs @ 100" can be bought at below $10k, I would go for a flat screen TV.

100 inch TV would cost more than the RS4500 lah.. Maybe in 5 yrs time when Micro LED has matured, you can then size it up like LEGO bricks over several years to reach your desired size. 🤣
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: keai on January 19, 2019, 15:01
Been stuck with my old trusty AE7K PJ for over 5 years now. My attempts over the past two years to upgrade to 4K have been thwarted due to lack of throw distance and unwillingness to downsize my 92 inch screen. However i’m now prepared to size down to 80 inch with the emergence of the N7 but a new deliema has arise.

Given the emergence of premium large screen TV displays, i’m now in two minds over going for a 77/85 inch OLED/LCD over the JVC N7. Assuming total cost would be quite similar, how many of you folks would continue to stick with the PJ route. Thanks for all your comments.
for the size you quote, TV is no brainer for me.

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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: JayKrishna on January 19, 2019, 17:33
https://www.dropbox.com/s/i5awjhlktmgtc8b/1.%20JVC%202018%202019%20Projector%20Comparison.pdf?dl=0 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/i5awjhlktmgtc8b/1.%20JVC%202018%202019%20Projector%20Comparison.pdf?dl=0)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: jeffong on January 20, 2019, 19:13
One benefit of staying the PJ route will be the 3D support that is present in the N7. Anyone know if the JVC works with active 3D glasses from Panasonic & Sony?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 20, 2019, 19:30
One benefit of staying the PJ route will be the 3D support that is present in the N7. Anyone know if the JVC works with active 3D glasses from Panasonic & Sony?

Not sure but I'm using JVC very own 3D active shutter glasses (come as a bundled). I have to say that the 3D have come a long way for JVC and it had improved by leaps and bounds. Gone are the days of parallax error or ghosting. Bro Jeff, you getting the N7 yourself?


Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 20, 2019, 20:12
I have read that 8K e-shift found in the top-tier NX9 did not really improve the image overall especially for those in 1080p. The reviewer preferred to switch off the e-Shift which somehow made the image looked softer and even add some "noise" in certain footages. Just imagine one is paying so much more and yet  the best image quality is to turn off e-Shift. That's not good...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Hero on January 20, 2019, 21:07
I will be getting the N5. Currently using a remaco pull down 106" screen which I think will not do justice to the N5.
After some research, have narrowed down my search for 106" fixed screen to the Silver Ticket sold on Amazon.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CYLK1BQ/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A330XBNPFIPBVL&psc=1
Sharing here for info. Not yet pull trigger but planning to do so soon  :)

One question I have is if I watch standard blu ray on the N5, will it have any upscale capability? As 8 out of 10 movies I watch will be in standard blu ray should I use a 1080P projector for non 4K discs or just use the N5 for everything? Any views?  :)
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 21, 2019, 06:29
I will be getting the N5. Currently using a remaco pull down 106" screen which I think will not do justice to the N5.
After some research, have narrowed down my search for 106" fixed screen to the Silver Ticket sold on Amazon.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CYLK1BQ/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A330XBNPFIPBVL&psc=1
Sharing here for info. Not yet pull trigger but planning to do so soon  :)

One question I have is if I watch standard blu ray on the N5, will it have any upscale capability? As 8 out of 10 movies I watch will be in standard blu ray should I use a 1080P projector for non 4K discs or just use the N5 for everything? Any views?  :)

Actually this is the most difficult question to answer. These new “N” series are the latest models that comes with true native 4K panel as compared to previous JVC models which in essence STILL a 1080p full HD panel which employs their proprietary eShift algorithm to upscale 1080p video to near 4K quality and in that aspect, eShift has did quite an admirable job imo. But now, we are dealing with something different in the sense that it is true 4K panel which means eShift will not be employed this time except for 8K materials which the flagship model (NX9) will have and not the rest. Until some of us get our hands on any of the N series projectors to test out, there is no way we can tell whether for normal Blu-ray in 1080p will perform better or on par with previous gens using eShift.

For me, I am inclined to think that it will do a better job than eShift because there is less processing power for scaling to take effect, leaving more processing needs for the auto tone-mapping feature to take its course on HDR content. Again, this is my own opinion and nothing I say here holds water as it is just my guess.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Hero on January 21, 2019, 08:36
Thx Des for ur views. Yup just have to try for ourselves once new projector arrives n decide then.

My ht setup in my hall so now figuring out where to place my fixed screen when not watching movies, as my previous pull down was places in front of tv console. Furtunately i have 2 separate walls to hang the fixed screen when not in use.... but not sure how tedious it will be to move the screen each time, but i am digressing here  :P
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: jeffong on January 21, 2019, 16:04
Not sure but I'm using JVC very own 3D active shutter glasses (come as a bundled). I have to say that the 3D have come a long way for JVC and it had improved by leaps and bounds. Gone are the days of parallax error or ghosting. Bro Jeff, you getting the N7 yourself?

Yeah.. seriously considering it although it sucks that I'm limited to only a 80 inch screen.  The other challenge that I'm seeing is getting hold of a good 80 inch HDR-ready PJ screen itself.  Seems like none of the better brands even have this kind of sizing with 92 being the minimum.  Customization would likely cost a lot.  Heck, if the Sony 85 inch Z9G can be had for the same price of the N7, maybe that would be a better option. :-)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Audio on January 21, 2019, 16:09
jeffong,

If it is not a 100" screen, i think you will get better mileage going with a large screen TV.

Size is everything......   :)

(Audio)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: jeffong on January 21, 2019, 16:31
Unfortunately flagship large screen TV's are being sold like BMW and Mercs in Singapore.  Super high markup that makes no absolute sense.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on January 21, 2019, 18:03
Thx Des for ur views. Yup just have to try for ourselves once new projector arrives n decide then.

My ht setup in my hall so now figuring out where to place my fixed screen when not watching movies, as my previous pull down was places in front of tv console. Furtunately i have 2 separate walls to hang the fixed screen when not in use.... but not sure how tedious it will be to move the screen each time, but i am digressing here  :P

Hi Hero ,

To look neat you can stick back to manual pull down the better choice will be a motorize screen .

On the fixed type you can use a fixed screen with stand with wheels or other option wire hang down on top down , when not in used can hang over the other side .

Hope that helps .
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 21, 2019, 18:42
jeffong,

If it is not a 100" screen, i think you will get better mileage going with a large screen TV.

Size is everything......   :)

(Audio)

+1


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 21, 2019, 18:43
Hi Hero ,

To look neat you can stick back to manual pull down the better choice will be a motorize screen .

On the fixed type you can use a fixed screen with stand with wheels or other option wire hang down on top down , when not in used can hang over the other side .

Hope that helps .

+1



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Hero on January 21, 2019, 22:29
Hi Hero ,

To look neat you can stick back to manual pull down the better choice will be a motorize screen .

On the fixed type you can use a fixed screen with stand with wheels or other option wire hang down on top down , when not in used can hang over the other side .

Hope that helps .

Thanks Alf. Motorised screen with tab tension too costly for me. Also, I hate all the squished bugs over time which is inevitable when using a rolled up screen. I wanna go for fixed screen this time to get the optimal viewing experience from the N5.

I reckon a smooth 'texture free' screen is essential because from my calculation, each 4K pixel will be approximately 0.6mm x 0.6mm when projected on a 106" screen. 
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 22, 2019, 06:24
Thanks Alf. Motorised screen with tab tension too costly for me. Also, I hate all the squished bugs over time which is inevitable when using a rolled up screen. I wanna go for fixed screen this time to get the optimal viewing experience from the N5.

I reckon a smooth 'texture free' screen is essential because from my calculation, each 4K pixel will be approximately 0.6mm x 0.6mm when projected on a 106" screen.

Yes, fixed screen is the best for home theatre enthusiast like most members here. I’m using a Carada screen from US since 2012 and have not failed me simply because of rolling mechanism over time. Of course like u mentioned, it takes up a whole lot of space especially in a living hall. Some wife may not approve of it.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 22, 2019, 06:50
Go for fixed or at least a tab tension screen.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: whitesox on January 22, 2019, 08:15
Thanks Alf. Motorised screen with tab tension too costly for me. Also, I hate all the squished bugs over time which is inevitable when using a rolled up screen. I wanna go for fixed screen this time to get the optimal viewing experience from the N5.

I reckon a smooth 'texture free' screen is essential because from my calculation, each 4K pixel will be approximately 0.6mm x 0.6mm when projected on a 106" screen.

Squished bugs ?
I wonder how can it happen? surely before you rolled it up, you need to check whether there is a bug resting there or not?
if you have dedicated room then fix screen is a good choice, free from cicak ... this deaf creature likes to poo everywhere... poo speakers and screen.
(I use bug repellent, dual sonic sound type, doesn't work)

Recommend to use tab tension screen, if your AC position is near to your screen.

 ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Hero on January 22, 2019, 08:27
When it's late and way past ur bedtime after a movie, the last thing on your mind is to check for bugs hiding on your 106" screen, especially the back of the screen which is all BLACK ah  ;)

I should know since i have been using 106" screen (dalite and remaco) since 2011. Love every inch of it. Still do after all these years. Have absolutely no desire to look at those 60, 70, 80 inch TV displays at the shops.  :)

And since my family and I love big screens so much....... we just took the plunge and got the N5, with a litle nudge from our current projector ae7000 which just so happen to die on us. It's fate lah  :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on January 22, 2019, 10:42
Thanks Alf. Motorised screen with tab tension too costly for me. Also, I hate all the squished bugs over time which is inevitable when using a rolled up screen. I wanna go for fixed screen this time to get the optimal viewing experience from the N5.

I reckon a smooth 'texture free' screen is essential because from my calculation, each 4K pixel will be approximately 0.6mm x 0.6mm when projected on a 106" screen. 

The tap tension is more costly because to have best result it has to be custom made with ( Large roller system heavy drop bar with bigger motor to make it quitter .   
A black border is spray all round to obtain the 16:9  format with custom black drop on top . Even with all the mechanical thing in place,there still be some pros and con on Tap Tension screen  ( wider casing length wise to accommodate side taps ) room condition to consider , installation possibility movement to site ........ETC

With the same type of mechanical system apply with a fiberglass base has far more lesser issue again it also does have its pros and cons .

It is a command issue if insect get stuck any of this type of material it can be remove best fast before the insect leaves some stain marks on the screen .

Hence fixed is still the best for 100% flatness projection surface , that's  why you don't see any proper cinema or theatre has motorize screen . Fixed screen also have pros and cons material is expose to element and people touching or drawing on it , dusty velvet frame , mould or fungus attack , lizard or insect nesting .......ETC

So to choose screen have to consider a bit more thought into it of their differences .

Most brands screen will have proper advice on what type of screen is most best suited for the room . They will ask for room humidity test , mounting site , shipping into site possibility and is it possible to do what you desire . Best to ask lots of question before getting the screen choice . Other important consideration warranty , services, material or parts is it available and for how long .

Hope that helps
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 22, 2019, 11:06
When it's late and way past ur bedtime after a movie, the last thing on your mind is to check for bugs hiding on your 106" screen, especially the back of the screen which is all BLACK ah  ;)

I should know since i have been using 106" screen (dalite and remaco) since 2011. Love every inch of it. Still do after all these years. Have absolutely no desire to look at those 60, 70, 80 inch TV displays at the shops.  :)

And since my family and I love big screens so much....... we just took the plunge and got the N5, with a litle nudge from our current projector ae7000 which just so happen to die on us. It's fate lah  :)

Congrats.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: c722 on January 22, 2019, 21:10
tab tensioned screen is as good as fixed. And it's neat.
I dun have problem on insects.
But I have big problems on molds ! :( This is branded Stewart some more.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on January 22, 2019, 23:21
tab tensioned screen is as good as fixed. And it's neat.
I dun have problem on insects.
But I have big problems on molds ! :( This is branded Stewart some more.

This is one of the major issue for tap tension screen ,it does not matter what brand as long as the environment is humid ( fungus and mold  will appear)   
 
I am experimenting  the 2nd generation of motorize system with even larger roller bar , heavy drop bar and a more silent motor ( 25 % larger than conventional motorize type ) On both fiber glass 4k surface and another is tap -tension with the same mechanical structure . Both also have longer black drop .

I have manage to install the fiber glass material very happy with result . Tomorrow will install the tap tension and see if it is to my expectation , keep my finger cross . ( sorry self shiok )

Any way as I have shared earlier each products has it place just have to be more meticulous during purchase , check the room humidity level before buying a tap tension screen .

Do remember when you buy a projection screen it will be a Long term investment and when you incopperate to your design of your home . Placement is key , follow by installation position and will it cause amplified sound , service maintained and repair , will the flatness last along time . If buying a good well made screen it will last you a Long , Long time with the lease problems . 





Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: econav on January 23, 2019, 11:02
Today I had placed a pre order for the JVC N7 through a local dealer. If all turns out well, I should be getting the projector either end of Jan or early Feb.

Fingers crossed that I can get it before CNY but I highly doubt it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It came to our understanding that this "unknown source of info/delivery period and pre-order" that are directly related to the local market and warranty have created unease and tensions for some of our customers/dealers, and we have since updated this "insinuated chain of events" to JVCKENWOOD Singapore.

Official indication from JVCKENWOOD Singapore will follow shortly and we reserve all rights for any action, if needed, for the good of all who already placed their orders and deposits and the confidence of our valuable customers/dealers be restored.

Valerie Neo
Director of Sales
ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: econav on January 24, 2019, 14:47
Dear Valuable Customers/Dealers/and all at Xtremeplace

As per my message of yesterday, attached is the Official Letter from JVCKENWOOD SINGAPORE PTE LTD
which is self-explanatory.

We hope that the confusion that had been created by "some parties" either implicitly or explicitly have all
been clarified through JVCKENWOOD SINGAPORE PTE LTD.

We extend our apologies to those valuable prospective customers who might had been caught in the web of
deceit by some person/people with ill intentions to affect the credibility of both JVCKENWOOD SINGAPORE PTE
LTD and ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD and its' management and staff in your waving decision.  We fully understand
your plight in this dilemma.

We certainly look forward to be of service with introducing good products to all and in Xtremeplace and your friends in due course.

We, in ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD  wish all a Blessed and Prosperous CNY.

VALERIE NEO
Director of Sales
ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD

(https://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk329/ckpeng/jvc%20LETTER_zpswgzl0frz.jpg)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 24, 2019, 19:50
Thanks Valerie for the clarification. :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: econav on January 25, 2019, 18:17
Today I had placed a pre order for the JVC N7 through a local dealer. If all turns out well, I should be getting the projector either end of Jan or early Feb.

Fingers crossed that I can get it before CNY but I highly doubt it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Dear Desray

In the capacity of your current profession, what is right to say and what is not, I believe as a responsible person you are fully aware of such a stand as the wrong claims/words and their connotations can result in legal actions by the relevant parties.  On
15 Jan 2019, we posted our prices/program and delivery/warranty terms very clearly.  However, on 18 Jan 2019, you posted you had placed a pre-order through a local dealer and delivery would be end Jan 2019 or early Feb.  I believe you would have conclusive information for the warranty and delivery before you posted your message with your order in hand.  After your posting, there were rumours by some unknown sources that their supplies of JVC N series projectors are also in Feb and come with 3 years' warranty and they are warranteed by JVCKenwood Singapore.  All those who have been dealers/customers of JVC projectors know very well they come with 1 year warranty in the past.  But we requested for JVCKenwood Singapore to extend a 2 years' warranty for their new N series. 

If you have confirmed your order of the N7 from "your local dealer", am I right to say, the warranty terms and delivery status were stated clearly on your order but it seems you were still doubting the authenticity of our posted warranty period. 
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=281710.msg1296506#msg1296506
With the release of your information, many prospective customers and dealers locally and overseas are questioning us and JVCKenwood.  Our Japanese counterpart would like to know the source from your kindself since you made this statement.  This, I believe you would agree with me is what a responsible person would do.  As you and all the readers in this forum know, news be they fake or true will affect the aftermath of a product/dealer/distributor/manufacturer and it has to be delivered with caution.

Having said all the above, we would like to hear from you where this source was derived from and who is the local dealer who made such promises.

Your cooperation and frank sharing would help to dispel the doubts of your followers/readers and restore confidence in the marketplace.  However, if you do not wish to share openly in this thread, you may like to email me personally at
valneo@econ-av.com.

VALERIE NEO
Director of Sales
ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD

CC: JVC KENWOOD SINGAPORE
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: bluepill193 on January 25, 2019, 18:29
Wow what is happening? Why is there threat of legal action when someone just mentions he is expecting delivery of a projector? Maybe the target should be this so called local dealer who may have made some false promises/claims rather than confronting the buyer?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on January 25, 2019, 19:19
Dear Desray

In the capacity of your current profession, what is right to say and what is not, I believe as a responsible person you are fully aware of such a stand as the wrong claims/words and their connotations can result in legal actions by the relevant parties....

I'm not a follower of Desray , but I believe above paragraph is not called for,  especially this is a hobby forum and giving that what he posted

Today I had placed a pre order for the JVC N7 through a local dealer. If all turns out well, I should be getting the projector either end of Jan or early Feb.

Fingers crossed that I can get it before CNY but I highly doubt it.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Any Tom,  Dick, or Harry can be a dealer but authorized dealer is a question.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on January 25, 2019, 19:53
Wow ...I manage too look at the Official Letter states it is Authorize Dealer not Exclusive dealer correct ?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: bluepill193 on January 25, 2019, 22:04
Wow ...I manage to at the Official Letter states it is Authorize Dealer not Exclusive dealer correct ?
+1
Ridiculously aggressive tone just because buying from someone else who can deliver the goods earlier. If want to pursue then go after the seller, why threaten the buyer. You also have no right to ask buyer to contact you especially when your tone is so full of menace. Wtf
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on January 25, 2019, 23:35
Absolutely rubbish tone... Who are you to question Desray? He does not owe you or any of us anything, as he was simply sharing his own experience purchasing from another dealer that is not you... and as a buyer, do clarify how he is liable for any legal action if he incorrectly states the delivery time and warranty period...

He is neither part of JVC KENWOOD... and I am sure he had better things to do than spread falsehoods for nobody’s gain
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 26, 2019, 06:03
I read Desray comments and I can’t see any wrong. Am I missing something?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on January 26, 2019, 09:23
I read Desray comments and I can’t see any wrong. Am I missing something?


I don’t find anything wrong too, maybe Desray is very excited with his new toy, I would be if I were him, absolutely ecstatic, especially if I could get delivery earlier than expected....

It’s risky to over promise and under deliver, from a sellers point... so gotta be wary whom we purchase from ....then again I can buy it from overseas and start using it tomorrow... who is to stop him? I think he has good intentions, and wanted to post an early review of the N7 for the benefit of all...

There is absolutely no sense threatening legal action on end users, JVC should go after the irresponsible seller, whoever that is...


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 26, 2019, 09:48
Unnecessary drama.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Hero on January 26, 2019, 10:11
Looks to me like an irresponsible JVC seller giving out unsupported promises to secure more sales for himself is the root cause here.
 
On the brighter side, I am grateful that Econ AV has helped to secure and confirm a 2 year warranty for us buyers, and also give caution to potential buyers to be careful about ensuring your purchases are supported by local warranty.

Desray's well meaning posts was unfortunately caught in the crossfire.

Let's drop the negatives and move on with the positives ok  ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: AndrewC on January 26, 2019, 10:19
Valerie Neo/ECON AV, I urge you retract your post, apologise to Desray, and the X’Place user community. Otherwise, this is going to end in tears, yours. It’ll start with a formal letter of complaint to JVC-Kenwood Singapore about your belligerent public posting using their name.

Don’t say you weren’t warned.


Dear Desray

In the capacity of your current profession, what is right to say and what is not, I believe as a responsible person you are fully aware of such a stand as the wrong claims/words and their connotations can result in legal actions by the relevant parties.  On
15 Jan 2019, we posted our prices/program and delivery/warranty terms very clearly.  However, on 18 Jan 2019, you posted you had placed a pre-order through a local dealer and delivery would be end Jan 2019 or early Feb.  I believe you would have conclusive information for the warranty and delivery before you posted your message with your order in hand.  After your posting, there were rumours by some unknown sources that their supplies of JVC N series projectors are also in Feb and come with 3 years' warranty and they are warranteed by JVCKenwood Singapore.  All those who have been dealers/customers of JVC projectors know very well they come with 1 year warranty in the past.  But we requested for JVCKenwood Singapore to extend a 2 years' warranty for their new N series. 

If you have confirmed your order of the N7 from "your local dealer", am I right to say, the warranty terms and delivery status were stated clearly on your order but it seems you were still doubting the authenticity of our posted warranty period. 
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=281710.msg1296506#msg1296506
With the release of your information, many prospective customers and dealers locally and overseas are questioning us and JVCKenwood.  Our Japanese counterpart would like to know the source from your kindself since you made this statement.  This, I believe you would agree with me is what a responsible person would do.  As you and all the readers in this forum know, news be they fake or true will affect the aftermath of a product/dealer/distributor/manufacturer and it has to be delivered with caution.

Having said all the above, we would like to hear from you where this source was derived from and who is the local dealer who made such promises.

Your cooperation and frank sharing would help to dispel the doubts of your followers/readers and restore confidence in the marketplace.  However, if you do not wish to share openly in this thread, you may like to email me personally at
valneo@econ-av.com.

VALERIE NEO
Director of Sales
ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD

CC: JVC KENWOOD SINGAPORE
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 26, 2019, 10:40
Bad marketing for the both jvc and econ.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: avo on January 26, 2019, 10:43
This is a PR disaster for econ av.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Andreasgursky on January 26, 2019, 10:49
Valerie Neo/ECON AV, I urge you retract your post, apologise to Desray, and the X’Place user community. Otherwise, this is going to end in tears, yours. It’ll start with a formal letter of complaint to JVC-Kenwood Singapore about your belligerent public posting using their name.

Don’t say you weren’t warned.

+1 Public Apology is definitely needed
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: nickyviii on January 26, 2019, 11:37
i think that the official distributor has a right to find out about this "local dealer", since they are the official authorized distributor in sg

desray

1. did u check the authenticity of the dealer? if the dealer is not an official local distributor, you should change your statement in your earlier post to state that there is NO OFFICIAL LOCAL warranty from local sg distributor. the pj will be an expensive paperweight if it breaks down

2. if the dealer is not an official local distributor, i hope that not many people in the forum follow your advice and bought from this local dealer that you recommended, warranty and repairs would be an issue.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: bluepill193 on January 26, 2019, 12:33
Might have missed something but I thought all that was said is about ETA of the projector and warranty. No recommendations were made to buy from the seller, at least not publicly.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on January 26, 2019, 12:40
i think that the official distributor has a right to find out about this "local dealer", since they are the official authorized distributor in sg

desray

1. did u check the authenticity of the dealer? if the dealer is not an official local distributor, you should change your statement in your earlier post to state that there is NO OFFICIAL LOCAL warranty from local sg distributor. the pj will be an expensive paperweight if it breaks down

2. if the dealer is not an official local distributor, i hope that not many people in the forum follow your advice and bought from this local dealer that you recommended, warranty and repairs would be an issue.

I don't think he even named the dealer who sold him the set.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: willshaw on January 26, 2019, 19:38
Typical PR disaster for econ av.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: corga on January 26, 2019, 22:08
Frankly I am very discouraged by whats happening here. What started as a simple post has suddenly escalated to the extent that its caused more discomfort and unease among the forum members than the original post ever did. Let's keep these types of things out of this forum and if people have something private to discuss then that's what the PM's are for. This is absolutely bad PR for Econ/JVC who till now have had a great reputation.

Just my humble opinion.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: econav on January 27, 2019, 18:27
Dear All in Xtremeplace

It seems that my last post had been misconstrued by some that we are after Desray. I apologize if our good intentions had been taken negatively.

Our concern is that there are "some people/companies" who have imported sets which are not covered by local warranty or are using these export sets to deceive the prospective customers into purchasing and claimed that they are warrantied by the local manufacturer. We are also concerned that if sometime down the road they may have lost interest for the products or ceased operations, and all those who bought from them will be in a dilemma for aftersales service (if needed).

This is the purpose why we made clear indication that the new JVC "N" series will come with the local warranty card. As such, irregardless which local dealers the customers purchased from, they will be assured the service rendered by the local Service centre.  We believe this will be more transparent.

Why we requested for Desray's cooperation ...........? This is because he may be innocently being "used" by that "unknown source with an agenda to garner more sales with early delivery promise". Our concern is Desray may be put in a tight spot for disseminating untruthful information unknowingly and unintentionally to those who seek his advice with the many PMs he received.

If the source happens to come from any of the local dealers who used unethical tactics with false promises to gather more sales, we will deal with this accordingly as we take this matter very seriously as it affects other dealers' efforts and fair competition.

The legal aspect was also perceived in the wrong context. I am merely indicating it can happen to anyone who may release fake/unconfirmed info unknowingly and affecting certain parties who may seek legal recourse to put the wrong, right. Why would we be taking legal action against Desray....? Afterall, he had already placed an order with a local dealer. We are merely seeking his kind understanding to share for the good of others.

We understand projectors are just one of the many items in doing up a full HT system setup and that lots of customers prefer to buy from whichever audio companies they are working with to integrate as a system.  We believe we should make these projectors available to all potential audio dealers as part of their package offered to their customers in a more accessible way rather than being exclusive and limited.

I hope I have clarified the situation and I believe Desray also have all your interests at heart to buy from the right dealer to safeguard all your investments.

Thanks once again for hearing us out and wishing all a Happy Lunar New Year.

VALERIE NEO
Director of Sales
ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD

 
 
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on January 27, 2019, 19:05
...
Why we requested for Desray's cooperation ...........? This is because he may be innocently being "used" by that "unknown source with an agenda to garner more sales with early delivery promise". Our concern is Desray may be put in a tight spot for disseminating untruthful information unknowingly and unintentionally to those who seek his advice with the many PMs he received.
...


I still can't convince that you/JVCKENWOOD Singapore need his cooperation. If he had been cheated on local warranty , are you implying that you area going to honour ?

Let me repeat again, I'm not a follower or admirer of Desray,  but both of your 2 posts don't make sense.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Spectre on January 27, 2019, 20:04
Dear All in Xtremeplace

It seems that my last post had been misconstrued by some that we are after Desray. I apologize if our good intentions had been taken negatively.

Our concern is that there are "some people/companies" who have imported sets which are not covered by local warranty or are using these export sets to deceive the prospective customers into purchasing and claimed that they are warrantied by the local manufacturer. We are also concerned that if sometime down the road they may have lost interest for the products or ceased operations, and all those who bought from them will be in a dilemma for aftersales service (if needed).

This is the purpose why we made clear indication that the new JVC "N" series will come with the local warranty card. As such, irregardless which local dealers the customers purchased from, they will be assured the service rendered by the local Service centre.  We believe this will be more transparent.

Why we requested for Desray's cooperation ...........? This is because he may be innocently being "used" by that "unknown source with an agenda to garner more sales with early delivery promise". Our concern is Desray may be put in a tight spot for disseminating untruthful information unknowingly and unintentionally to those who seek his advice with the many PMs he received.

If the source happens to come from any of the local dealers who used unethical tactics with false promises to gather more sales, we will deal with this accordingly as we take this matter very seriously as it affects other dealers' efforts and fair competition.

The legal aspect was also perceived in the wrong context. I am merely indicating it can happen to anyone who may release fake/unconfirmed info unknowingly and affecting certain parties who may seek legal recourse to put the wrong, right. Why would we be taking legal action against Desray....? Afterall, he had already placed an order with a local dealer. We are merely seeking his kind understanding to share for the good of others.

We understand projectors are just one of the many items in doing up a full HT system setup and that lots of customers prefer to buy from whichever audio companies they are working with to integrate as a system.  We believe we should make these projectors available to all potential audio dealers as part of their package offered to their customers in a more accessible way rather than being exclusive and limited.

I hope I have clarified the situation and I believe Desray also have all your interests at heart to buy from the right dealer to safeguard all your investments.

Thanks once again for hearing us out and wishing all a Happy Lunar New Year.

VALERIE NEO
Director of Sales
ECON AV CONCEPTS PTE LTD
I understand your need to clarify and your concerns from perhaps a legal and sales standpoint. But that still does not excuse the belligerent and confrontational tone. The use of formal letter heads and all these 'legalese' is totally uncalled for. Misunderstandings like these should just be clarified first in a civil manner at a personal level before blasting in such a way in a public forum. Such acts only make you look defensive and desperate...

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on January 27, 2019, 21:07
Well the clarification did not clarify the original post. The original post seems to be putting Desray as the instigator of the whole issue. At least that’s how I read it.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kelvinsin on January 27, 2019, 23:00
千年道行一朝丧。。。
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on January 28, 2019, 06:34
I have dealt with Peng econav many times and even though I haven’t always purchased from him (because of where I live), he’s always been great with service and advice and knowledge. And he’s always been patient with many others in the forum.

I am inclined to attribute this to a misunderstanding and an obliquely worded document.

FWIW being in this industry in Australia, I know getting an exclusive distribution for a product line is a pretty tough process with many concessions and costs associated with taking on and distributing the brand. And being stymied by grey imports can be a very aggravating experience especially when the recalcitrant dealers are misrepresenting the terms to end users.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: francis wu on January 28, 2019, 10:35
I think Doggie has pointed out some relevant points here and I feel that we should all take a break and let the matter rest.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on January 28, 2019, 11:17
I have dealt with Peng econav many times and even though I haven’t always purchased from him (because of where I live), he’s always been great with service and advice and knowledge. And he’s always been patient with many others in the forum.

I am inclined to attribute this to a misunderstanding and an obliquely worded document.

FWIW being in this industry in Australia, I know getting an exclusive distribution for a product line is a pretty tough process with many concessions and costs associated with taking on and distributing the brand. And being stymied by grey imports can be a very aggravating experience especially when the recalcitrant dealers are misrepresenting the terms to end users.

I believe we are dealing with an authorized dealer not an exclusive distributor , according to JVCKENWOOD letter that posted by econav.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on January 28, 2019, 11:37
I believe we are dealing with an authorized dealer not an exclusive distributor , according to JVCKENWOOD letter that posted by econav.

Correct bro, don't think there is exclusive dealership for this line of products...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on January 29, 2019, 09:05
I believe we are dealing with an authorized dealer not an exclusive distributor , according to JVCKENWOOD letter that posted by econav.

The letter from JVC says
(https://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk329/ckpeng/jvc%20LETTER_zpswgzl0frz.jpg)

"appointed EconAV as its authorized partner"

and later that they would only honor the warranty on purchases made through EconAV and its dealers.

This seems to indicate that it is a sole distribution arrangement.

Do you know differently?

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on January 29, 2019, 12:00
The letter from JVC says
(https://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk329/ckpeng/jvc%20LETTER_zpswgzl0frz.jpg)

"appointed EconAV as its authorized partner"

and later that they would only honor the warranty on purchases made through EconAV and its dealers.

This seems to indicate that it is a sole distribution arrangement.

Do you know differently?

According to Cambridge Advanced Leaner's Dictionary

sole   /səʊl/ /soʊl/  adjective   [ before noun  ]   
1.    being one only; single
    My sole objective is to make the information more widely available.     
  The sole  survivor  of the accident was found in the water after six hours.   
2.    not shared with anyone else
    She has sole  responsibility  for the project.     
  I have sole charge of both children all day.   


So authorized partner does not really mean sole partner or sole distributor.
JVCKENWOOD still can appoint another company to sell their N series and yet calls the company Authorized Partner.

One authorized partner, two authorized partners, three authorized partners but
Sole distributor, only one !
 
And the word usage of partner is ambiguous.
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on January 29, 2019, 12:50

So authorized partner does not really mean sole partner or sole distributor.
JVCKENWOOD still can appoint another company to sell their N series and yet calls the company Authorized Partner.

One authorized partner, two authorized partners, three authorized partners but
Sole distributor, only one !
 
And the word usage of partner is ambiguous.

If JVC has another partner, they should not have worded it to say they will not honor the warranty if these new projectors aren’t purchased from EconAV or resellers appointed by EconAV.

Do you know who is the other reseller or partner?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kelvinsin on January 29, 2019, 13:28
Wah become lawyer discussion thread, lol... good info!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on January 29, 2019, 13:34
According to Cambridge Advanced Leaner's Dictionary

sole   /səʊl/ /soʊl/  adjective   [ before noun  ]   
1.    being one only; single
    My sole objective is to make the information more widely available.     
  The sole  survivor  of the accident was found in the water after six hours.   
2.    not shared with anyone else
    She has sole  responsibility  for the project.     
  I have sole charge of both children all day.   


So authorized partner does not really mean sole partner or sole distributor.
JVCKENWOOD still can appoint another company to sell their N series and yet calls the company Authorized Partner.

One authorized partner, two authorized partners, three authorized partners but
Sole distributor, only one !
 
And the word usage of partner is ambiguous.

+1

you are right! Bro, how come your nick is Bad English?? Should change it to Good English!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on January 29, 2019, 19:05
If JVC has another partner, they should not have worded it to say they will not honor the warranty if these new projectors aren’t purchased from EconAV or resellers appointed by EconAV.

Do you know who is the other reseller or partner?

If JVCKENWOOD had worded just sole distributor for NX series,  there won't be confusion or misunderstanding.

To make it thing worsen,  it appointed Econ as an authorized partner for the range on immediate effect on 22 Jan 2019. There might had authorized dealers,  or partner before that date and perhaps desray had happened to get from that dealer.

I'm just guessing, and I'm neither defending desray nor attacking Econ. My point is plain simple : Econ should had not use legal threat on this forum unless it has gathered enough evidence to prove that action of desray caused monetary losses.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on January 29, 2019, 19:45
I read it as such too. I believe this letter simply states that EconAV is one of the appointed authorised dealers for JVC or JVC N series for that matter. It does not mean that there are no other dealers out there.

And to answer Doggie; yes I do know otherwise, please pm for info because apparently buying projectors nowadays might cause me to end up in the court room lol

According to Cambridge Advanced Leaner's Dictionary

sole   /səʊl/ /soʊl/  adjective   [ before noun  ]   
1.    being one only; single
    My sole objective is to make the information more widely available.     
  The sole  survivor  of the accident was found in the water after six hours.   
2.    not shared with anyone else
    She has sole  responsibility  for the project.     
  I have sole charge of both children all day.   


So authorized partner does not really mean sole partner or sole distributor.
JVCKENWOOD still can appoint another company to sell their N series and yet calls the company Authorized Partner.

One authorized partner, two authorized partners, three authorized partners but
Sole distributor, only one !
 
And the word usage of partner is ambiguous.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kelvinsin on January 29, 2019, 19:56
I read it as such too. I believe this letter simply states that EconAV is one of the appointed authorised dealers for JVC or JVC N series for that matter. It does not mean that there are no other dealers out there.

And to answer Doggie; yes I do know otherwise, please pm for info because apparently buying projectors nowadays might cause me to end up in the court room lol

I also scare sound affair sue me for using exported oppo203, alpha audio sue me using exported pioneer avr, harvey norman sue me using imitated phillip 9700,  CDA audio sue me using exported gotham cable, djq sue me using exported sine plugs...
I really worry....
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kelvinsin on January 29, 2019, 19:56
If JVCKENWOOD had worded just sole distributor for NX series,  there won't be confusion or misunderstanding.

To make it thing worsen,  it appointed Econ as an authorized partner for the range on immediate effect on 22 Jan 2019. There might had authorized dealers,  or partner before that date and perhaps desray had happened to get from that dealer.

I'm just guessing, and I'm neither defending desray nor attacking Econ. My point is plain simple : Econ should had not use legal threat on this forum unless it has gathered enough evidence to prove that action of desray caused monetary losses.

Hi bro, are you lawyer? Lol
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on January 29, 2019, 20:36
If JVCKENWOOD had worded just sole distributor for NX series,  there won't be confusion or misunderstanding.

To make it thing worsen,  it appointed Econ as an authorized partner for the range on immediate effect on 22 Jan 2019. There might had authorized dealers,  or partner before that date and perhaps desray had happened to get from that dealer.

I'm just guessing, and I'm neither defending desray nor attacking Econ. My point is plain simple : Econ should had not use legal threat on this forum unless it has gathered enough evidence to prove that action of desray caused monetary losses.

I am just puzzled that JVC would word a letter saying that warranty is voided if the projector was not purchased through EconAV and its designated dealers - if there was a second authorized distributor involved.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on January 29, 2019, 21:57
I am just puzzled that JVC would word a letter saying that warranty is voided if the projector was not purchased through EconAV and its designated dealers - if there was a second authorized distributor involved.

I guess... the JVCKenwood staff need to go get English lessons from BadEnglish? Hahahah
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on January 29, 2019, 22:40
AVSForum member first impressions and reviews of the NX9 and N7 models started to surface of late. Some of the reviews so far has been good but not something that will "blow you away" kind of good when compared to the PQ of last X gen series like the 9900. The HDMI Input (syncing) delay still exist and some reported that there is absolutely no change despite the JVC guys at the CES 2018 booth claimed there was a significant improvement in terms of HDMI switching to 60% faster! Pack of bullshit...I have also gathered what appears to be a  IRIS bug whenever the user switched off the projector while in HDR mode. When power back on, the IRIS settings seems to retain the aperture setting for HDR even though the physical len IRIS appears to be working fine. The workaround is to ensure that you exit from HDR content back to SDR content before you shut down the projector in order to ensure the aperture setting for the IRIS has returned to the correct aperture value when watching either SDR/HDR content when you first turn on the projector. Seems like a bug to me. The typical "bloominb" or "halo" effects for white letters or object against a black background still exist in this new N series which in my opinion is another negative.

My advice is for the last gen X series models like 7900 and 9900 users to hold on and wait for more reviews to populate before committing yourself to purchase the new N series.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: mutant on January 29, 2019, 23:33
Absolutely rubbish tone... Who are you to question Desray? He does not owe you or any of us anything, as he was simply sharing his own experience purchasing from another dealer that is not you... and as a buyer, do clarify how he is liable for any legal action if he incorrectly states the delivery time and warranty period...

He is neither part of JVC KENWOOD... and I am sure he had better things to do than spread falsehoods for nobody’s gain

Totally agree with you.. WHO ARE YOU TO QUESTION DESRAY?!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Weichiun on January 30, 2019, 06:37
I also scare sound affair sue me for using exported oppo203, alpha audio sue me using exported pioneer avr, harvey norman sue me using imitated phillip 9700,  CDA audio sue me using exported gotham cable, djq sue me using exported sine plugs...
I really worry....

As long as you happy and got problem, don’t find back the authorized dealer...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kelvinsin on January 30, 2019, 06:51
As long as you happy and got problem, don’t find back the authorized dealer...
Well, i believe this theory simple even kids can understand. Certainly you cant differentiate joke and reality. :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kelvinsin on January 30, 2019, 19:27
Im sorry but does anyone see my ball? This morning i remember i left here but i cant found now. Where my ball?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Weichiun on January 30, 2019, 20:29
Well, i believe this theory simple even kids can understand. Certainly you cant differentiate joke and reality. :)

Seem u not ever a kids and just like to joke in the Xtremeplace.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: AndrewC on February 01, 2019, 10:58
Seems pretty obvious ECON AV is not an “Exclusive” Distributor for JVC’s N series Projectors - if they were exclusive, they (or JVC) would not leave it so ambiguous.  ::)

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 01, 2019, 13:21
Seems pretty obvious ECON AV is not an “Exclusive” Distributor for JVC’s N series Projectors - if they were exclusive, they (or JVC) would not leave it so ambiguous.  ::)

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

I think it is simple - the other dealer should get a letter from JVC saying that the N series projectors they sell have full Singaporean warranty - with 3 years and available in February :)

I don't think there is any ambiguity in "Only sets sold by our Authorized Partner, ECON AV Concepts and its dealers will have our JVCKENWOOD Singapore official warranty card with the serial no. imprinted on it"
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: AndrewC on February 01, 2019, 15:01
I think it is simple - the other dealer should get a letter from JVC saying that the N series projectors they sell have full Singaporean warranty - with 3 years and available in February :)

I don't think there is any ambiguity in "Only sets sold by our Authorized Partner, ECON AV Concepts and its dealers will have our JVCKENWOOD Singapore official warranty card with the serial no. imprinted on it"

What's interesting is that on JVC's US and Europe websites, they properly list their Projector Distributors online... but not for JVCKenwood Singapore. Something definitely "fishy" smelling. Makes me tempted to call up JVCKenwood and ask them WTF is going on... (but I'm not sure why I'd bother, I'm not personally or professionally connected to anything to do with Projectors... but it bugs me to see a company making pseudo-legalese threats to consumers on a public forum).
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 01, 2019, 15:11
What's interesting is that on JVC's US and Europe websites, they properly list their Projector Distributors online... but not for JVCKenwood Singapore. Something definitely "fishy" smelling. Makes me tempted to call up JVCKenwood and ask them WTF is going on... (but I'm not sure why I'd bother, I'm not personally or professionally connected to anything to do with Projectors... but it bugs me to see a company making pseudo-legalese threats to consumers on a public forum).

You have to remember how small the SG market is.

I remember being shocked at how cheap JVC was in Australia when I first moved over. I guess there is just enough of a market to get the prices down.

And even with the bigger market, the projector section for Where to buy is ZILCH too :P

They'd rather list the car audio dealers.

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: AndrewC on February 01, 2019, 15:20
You have to remember how small the SG market is.

I remember being shocked at how cheap JVC was in Australia when I first moved over. I guess there is just enough of a market to get the prices down.

And even with the bigger market, the projector section for Where to buy is ZILCH too :P

They'd rather list the car audio dealers.

Good point.

Whatever it is though... when I'm eventually in the market for a Projector, I know which local company to avoid (I'd rather gray-market import myself if I'm hard-up on the brand, then to buy from someone who makes threats in public  ;D).
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 01, 2019, 15:28
Good point.

Whatever it is though... when I'm eventually in the market for a Projector, I know which local company to avoid (I'd rather gray-market import myself if I'm hard-up on the brand, then to buy from someone who makes threats in public  ;D).

I would choose a good dealer that has demonstrated good sales and after sales support. And who's actually brought JVC prices in SG in line with Australia... is a good bonus
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on February 01, 2019, 15:38
My take is like many enthusiast products in Singapore, this island is too small for JVC to market the projector lines here. The implication may be why JVC was not able to provide repair service to my faulty optics engine of my JVC HD1 back in 2009; a $10k projector that goes bad in 2 years. Engineer told me cannot be done locally. I hope things have improved but I doubt so. Quoting Epson as an example is it has as a big market share in corporate projector business and could invest in its service and repair infrastructure and possibly provide proper training for it's engineers regionally. So sometimes purchasing a product needs to take principal and distributor service and support into consideration. 
Whenever I purchase a big ticket item, I always consider what happens when I have trouble with it? What's my means of recourse? What's the service support history of the principal and distributor? You are buying close to or more than 5 figure electronics here, many things can go wrong with these complex electronics especially with mechanical components and optics in it, and we are not living in Japan where service is top notch, so shop smart!
No matter, this thread is a bad thread in terms of public relations for both the principal and distributor.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on February 01, 2019, 16:00
My take is like many enthusiast products in Singapore, this island is too small for JVC to market the projector lines here. The implication may be why JVC was not able to provide repair service to my faulty optics engine of my JVC HD1 back in 2009. Engineer told me cannot be done locally. I hope things have improved but I doubt so. Epson on the other hand has a big market share in corporate projector business and could invest in its service and repair infrastructure and possibly provide proper training for it's engineers regionally. So sometimes purchasing a product needs to take principal and distributor service and support into consideration. No matter, this thread is a bad thread in terms of public relations for both the principal and distributor.
Whenever I purchase a big ticket item, I always consider what happens when I have trouble with it? What's my means of recourse? What's the service support history of the principal and distributor? You are buying close to or more than 5 figure electronics here, many things can go wrong complex electronics especially mechanical and optics in it, so shop smart!

To be fair few years back I send in a japan brand LCD projector to service centre ,
they said have to change full optical block and they cant change it hear . I guess they must need a clean room to do it .

I post it on forum got a threatening message by dealer " lucky have letter from service centre letter " to state the facts .

Yes, Kaydee I guess you have to be careful when buying products. Make sure you ask what type of after sales service  dealers are providing  and the type of manufacture / warranty /support that you will get . 

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 01, 2019, 18:21
I just read the the flagship model, the NX9 have some serious issue with the optical engineer block and it seems to be affecting the first batch which was released in Oct last year. Will it have any problem with the N5 and N7, can’t tell for sure at the moment. Seems like JVC gonna need to replace all the defective sets with the 2nd batch (mfg date in Jan 19). Fingers crossed.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on February 01, 2019, 19:39
Well what ever it is there will be 2 year warranty from JVC Singapore , bring it back to service centre and they will have to attend to it .

The only part if there is issue  on the PJ than taking leave and waiting to the unit to be send back will be a painful. 



Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on February 02, 2019, 11:58
My take is like many enthusiast products in Singapore, this island is too small for JVC to market the projector lines here. The implication may be why JVC was not able to provide repair service to my faulty optics engine of my JVC HD1 back in 2009; a $10k projector that goes bad in 2 years. Engineer told me cannot be done locally. I hope things have improved but I doubt so. Quoting Epson as an example is it has as a big market share in corporate projector business and could invest in its service and repair infrastructure and possibly provide proper training for it's engineers regionally. So sometimes purchasing a product needs to take principal and distributor service and support into consideration. 
Whenever I purchase a big ticket item, I always consider what happens when I have trouble with it? What's my means of recourse? What's the service support history of the principal and distributor? You are buying close to or more than 5 figure electronics here, many things can go wrong with these complex electronics especially with mechanical components and optics in it, and we are not living in Japan where service is top notch, so shop smart!
No matter, this thread is a bad thread in terms of public relations for both the principal and distributor.

If you do some research, both Tritone AV and Sound Decisions are dealers for JVC, and I’m sure both of them would have better service than EconAV... No worries if you love the product, rarely SG will only have one dealer
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 02, 2019, 12:15
If you do some research, both Tritone AV and Sound Decisions are dealers for JVC, and I’m sure both of them would have better service than EconAV... No worries if you love the product, rarely SG will only have one dealer


In the past yes. I got a few JVCs from Sound Decisions before.

But for the new 4K native N series? That would contradict what the JVC letter says. Like I said, all the other dealer needs to show is a letter from JVC SG providing assurances that they are an authorized dealer too. Maybe it might be the rebadged RS series?

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 02, 2019, 14:13
My enthusiasm level for these JVC N series projectors had dropped to an "all time low" after what supposed to be an exciting times for all JVC DiLA lovers. But because of small things like where, when and who I choose to purchase my projector from dominated this whole thread. What started off as good intentions to get an unit early so that I can do an early review and share it with everyone here to make informed buying decision, especially those who are on the fence on whether to upgrade or to stay put...I used my own hard earned money to buy a product and spend hours to calibrate and then come up with a review, all in the name of sharing knowledge and it turns out that my "action" literally became the "main topic on JVC and her dealership in Singapore. Frankly, as a customer, I don't really care who is/are the dealer(s) as long as he/she can deliver the goods I want and at a price I'm comfortable with.

As a customer in Singapore using JVC products for so long, I feel so embarrassed and utterly disappointed that it has to come to this state where it has to be a "zero sum" game here...for someone to win, someone else has to lose. This entire thread has turn out into a travesty which is better left alone lest more absurd accusations and finger-pointing down the road. And I'm not gonna play this game as I think I have better things to do in my life than doing review for projector. As such, I have decided not to review this new JVC N series product but I will answer some of the queries that members has along the way.

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on February 02, 2019, 15:04
My enthusiasm level for these JVC N series projectors had dropped to an "all time low" after what supposed to be an exciting times for all JVC DiLA lovers. But because of small things like where, when and who I choose to purchase my projector from dominated this whole thread. What started off as good intentions to get an unit early so that I can do an early review and share it with everyone here to make informed buying decision, especially those who are on the fence on whether to upgrade or to stay put...I used my own hard earned money to buy a product and spend hours to calibrate and then come up with a review, all in the name of sharing knowledge and it turns out that my "action" literally became the "main topic on JVC and her dealership in Singapore. Frankly, as a customer, I don't really care who is/are the dealer(s) as long as he/she can deliver the goods I want and at a price I'm comfortable with.

As a customer in Singapore using JVC products for so long, I feel so embarrassed and utterly disappointed that it has to come to this state where it has to be a "zero sum" game here...for someone to win, someone else has to lose. This entire thread has turn out into a travesty which is better left alone lest more absurd accusations and finger-pointing down the road. And I'm not gonna play this game as I think I have better things to do in my life than doing review for projector. As such, I have decided not to review this new JVC N series product but I will answer some of the queries that members has along the way.



Good decision not to review a product using your own money. Why do free marketing for a company? Unless The company send you one unit for review and you can choose to buy if you like it.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 03, 2019, 22:48
Some members asked me whether the new N series projectors support Dolby Vision (DV)...unfortunately the answer is no. It support HDR10, possibly HDR10+ and HLG.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on February 04, 2019, 09:31
My enthusiasm level for these JVC N series projectors had dropped to an "all time low" after what supposed to be an exciting times for all JVC DiLA lovers. But because of small things like where, when and who I choose to purchase my projector from dominated this whole thread. What started off as good intentions to get an unit early so that I can do an early review and share it with everyone here to make informed buying decision, especially those who are on the fence on whether to upgrade or to stay put...I used my own hard earned money to buy a product and spend hours to calibrate and then come up with a review, all in the name of sharing knowledge and it turns out that my "action" literally became the "main topic on JVC and her dealership in Singapore. Frankly, as a customer, I don't really care who is/are the dealer(s) as long as he/she can deliver the goods I want and at a price I'm comfortable with.

As a customer in Singapore using JVC products for so long, I feel so embarrassed and utterly disappointed that it has to come to this state where it has to be a "zero sum" game here...for someone to win, someone else has to lose. This entire thread has turn out into a travesty which is better left alone lest more absurd accusations and finger-pointing down the road. And I'm not gonna play this game as I think I have better things to do in my life than doing review for projector. As such, I have decided not to review this new JVC N series product but I will answer some of the queries that members has along the way.

This is sad, I was expecting much of your review. Forum should keep as discussion of the projector function not for the war of dealership.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on February 04, 2019, 09:48
Some members asked me whether the new N series projectors support Dolby Vision (DV)...unfortunately the answer is no. It support HDR10, possibly HDR10+ and HLG.

HLG is supported since it's mentioned in the spec sheet. HDR10+ no news, but possibly firmware upgradable if it happens. I'm guessing maybe N7/9 might have the hardware capability to support it.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on February 04, 2019, 10:12


Any idea which are the compatible calibration tools?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 15:15
HLG is supported since it's mentioned in the spec sheet. HDR10+ no news, but possibly firmware upgradable if it happens. I'm guessing maybe N7/9 might have the hardware capability to support it.

A mistake on my part in the way I structured the sentence...I meant to say HDR10 and HLG support right out of the box...possibly HDR10+ through firmware update. HDR10+ is supposed to rival Dolby's DV at 12-bit. This projector does support full HDMI 2.0 specs at full 18gbps bandwidth which technically "should" support DV as well. HLG is pretty "useless" in my opinion as its more for broadcasting. Perhaps when MediaCorp or TV programmes go HDR, HLG is a whit elephant.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 15:19
  • Auto-Calibration Function using an optical sensor* is capable of optimizing essential elements in the image, including colour balance, gamma characteristics, colour space and colour tracking


Any idea which are the compatible calibration tools?

This is referring to the JVC collaboration with i1 Pro and Spyder Pro used for calibration of the JVC range of products. This collaboration has been going on since the advent of the X series for some time now. I have to say that it is pretty accurate as I've tested both Chromapure calibration s/w with the JVC calibration s/w kit with my Spyder Pro 5 and the results are very close. For ease of use, I recommend JVC autocal s/w which is much easier for beginners in the calibration world.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 15:29
This is sad, I was expecting much of your review. Forum should keep as discussion of the projector function not for the war of dealership.


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I will not comment on this and let the members decide for themselves what is right and what is wrong...To me, it is pretty pointless to delve into who is right or wrong. We are way beyond that. I have a certain set of principles that I adhere to for all these years when I post and moderate in this forum and chief among those is, "I will neither respond nor comment on absurd postings made by member(s) be it individuals or dealers. Once you cross that "line", you no longer command my respect...You will know who you are when I stop responding to your queries. Having say that, I will however, continue my role as the forum moderator and if there is ever a need for me to interact with that "member(s)", I will do so in the capacity as a moderator of this forum and nothing more.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 15:47
Well what ever it is there will be 2 year warranty from JVC Singapore , bring it back to service centre and they will have to attend to it .

The only part if there is issue  on the PJ than taking leave and waiting to the unit to be send back will be a painful. 


That's correct! This is ALL members need to know...there is simply no need for anyone to be concerned about dealership and JVC related issues. Just know that Econ AV is an authorised loca dealer for the new JVC N series projectors. As such, I urge members cast aside any negativity and continue to support Econ AV and please do place your order with them as there is absolutely no denying that they do offer the "best deal in town" right now -i.e. 2 yrs local support warranty by JVC Singapore. I did not, so I will have to live with my regrets. But life goes on...

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: char siew pau on February 04, 2019, 16:02
I’m interested in the JVC N5. Do you think with the Sony 295 zone convergence correction sofware off the Sony still cannot beat the JVC in overall image? Thanks.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: rock123 on February 04, 2019, 16:06


[/quote]
That's correct! This is ALL members need to know...there is simply no need for anyone to be concerned about dealership and JVC related issues. Just know that Econ AV is an authorised loca dealer for the new JVC N series projectors. As such, I urge members cast aside any negativity and continue to support Econ AV and please do place your order with them as there is absolutely no denial that they do offer the "best deal in town" right now -i.e. 2 yrs local support warranty by JVC Singapore. I did not, so I will have to live with my regrets. But life goes on...




Gurus salute you bro. Well said.
As consumers, we will always go for the Best Value deal out there.

When I joined this forum in Year 2002, Desray your reviews were always the best and so detailed well written.

Must really thanks the owner or those who moderate this HT Form us for us sharing HIFI passion, discussion,  " LOBANG" sharing, etc etc the fun.

So I urge us dont stop the sharing the positive sharing. Looking forward to a New 2019.
And I wish everybody Healthy Happy Blessing Chinese New Year.

Huat arrrr!

:)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 16:17
I’m interested in the JVC N5. Do you think with the Sony 295 zone convergence correction sofware off the Sony still cannot beat the JVC in overall image? Thanks.


Bro, I can't comment on that as I have not review Sony VW295ES. Again, it will be irresponsible of me to comment on other projectors, in this case Sony. Trust me, JVC projector ain't perfect either in certain areas when compared to Sony. But I will say this (based on my personal experience with Sony and JVC), if you are a serious movie buff and watch tons of movies, then JVC's hallmark black levels is second to none. But if you are looking for the "sharpest display" with near flawless motion interpolation, Sony is the BEST projector to get. JVC's Clear Motion Drive (or CMD) is nowhere near Sony's level. Sony also has the highest refresh rate for its SXRD panel and it is simply great for video content and playing high frame rate games like FPS genre. I'm not going to list down the pros and cons between the 2 brands, either one you get, you will not regret!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: char siew pau on February 04, 2019, 16:29
Understood! Thanks Bro! I’ll just wait to compare them two.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on February 04, 2019, 18:14
Bro, I can't comment on that as I have not review Sony VW295ES. Again, it will be irresponsible of me to comment on other projectors, in this case Sony. Trust me, JVC projector ain't perfect either in certain areas when compared to Sony. But I will say this (based on my personal experience with Sony and JVC), if you are a serious movie buff and watch tons of movies, then JVC's hallmark black levels is second to none. But if you are looking for the "sharpest display" with near flawless motion interpolation, Sony is the BEST projector to get. JVC's Clear Motion Drive (or CMD) is nowhere near Sony's level. Sony also has the highest refresh rate for its SXRD panel and it is simply great for video content and playing high frame rate games like FPS genre. I'm not going to list down the pros and cons between the 2 brands, either one you get, you will not regret!


Blackest black need the blackest room.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 18:57
Blackest black need the blackest room.

Not necessary. The JVC software has an Environment setting tweak which can help to compensate the ambient lights within your viewing space. But you are not wrong to say that for best results, a bat cave will always be preferred to showcase the best of JVC’s inky blacks.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on February 04, 2019, 23:35
Not necessary. The JVC software has an Environment setting tweak which can help to compensate the ambient lights within your viewing space. But you are not wrong to say that for best results, a bat cave will always be preferred to showcase the best of JVC’s inky blacks.



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Hope it works on my ALR screen. Finger cross.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 04, 2019, 23:50
Hope it works on my ALR screen. Finger cross.


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I wouldn't worry too much about it...it will work :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 05, 2019, 07:33
After having the former flagship JVC X series fauxK machine, I’m getting to the point where I no longer find black levels the be all and end all of picture quality.

In many respects I found the black levels and contrast levels of my older RS60 to be better. There is a need to boost brightness to get HDR to work properly and it comes at the expense of black levels. And once you do that, the technically better black levels on the JVC becomes less apparent.

The other realization I’ve had is that lumens aren’t necessarily the same. I’ve had the opportunity to experience the older Epson LS10500 and I have to say the colors and brightness on that machine felt more vivid and the brightness more impressive than its 1500 lumens would suggest. Ditto when switching from the 2000 lumens JVC X9500 to the Sony 760ES.

I think once you’ve experienced laser, it’s hard to go back. I think JVC needs to put a 2000-2500 lumens laser with the N7 to make a killer product.
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 05, 2019, 08:12
After having the former flagship JVC X series fauxK machine, I’m getting to the point where I no longer find black levels the be all and end all of picture quality.

In many respects I found the black levels and contrast levels of my older RS60 to be better. There is a need to boost brightness to get HDR to work properly and it comes at the expense of black levels. And once you do that, the technically better black levels on the JVC becomes less apparent.

The other realization I’ve had is that lumens aren’t necessarily the same. I’ve had the opportunity to experience the older Epson LS10500 and I have to say the colors and brightness on that machine felt more vivid and the brightness more impressive than its 1500 lumens would suggest. Ditto when switching from the 2000 lumens JVC X9500 to the Sony 760ES.

I think once you’ve experienced laser, it’s hard to go back. I think JVC needs to put a 2000-2500 lumens laser with the N7 to make a killer product.

Agreed with your observation and assessment of JVC really need to put in a laser light source for their next models to get the best PQ for HDR content. And you pointed out a valid concern that there is a need to boost brightness for HDR at the expense of black levels etc which really kind of screw up the whole PQ etc. However this year, JVC introduced the tone mapping feature which in my opinion is the right step forward for the projector realm. It suppose to retain the hallmark of JVC black levels while analysing the overall brightness level required to display the details and highlights in each progressive scenes based on the Master Display Info metadata of the 4K HDR content. This is the current and only solution for low lumen output display like projector which utilise lamp based as its light source. But it is better than nothing to tide us over until the price of a laser based projector comes to a level which can be considered reasonable for mass market adoption.

Back to current context...while I am not going to pretend that JVC N series 1,800 to 2,200 lumens using a lamp based module is bright enough to “wow” everyone over a long period of usage since brightness will decrease over time. But I have to admit that my last JVC projector, the X7000B which utilise the same bulb model that exist in the N series did remarkably well when it comes to light depreciation (drop) after 1,000hrs of usage. It remains pretty consistent and some members from other reputable HT forums attested to a drop in light output of only around 15% - 20% range after nearly 2,000hrs of usage which in my opinion is a very respectable numbers.

As always, I am still looking out for a laser based projector in the near future. But now, the N7 serves me well.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 05, 2019, 10:58
As always, I am still looking out for a laser based projector in the near future. But now, the N7 serves me well.


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you got the n7?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Jag on February 05, 2019, 11:28
Wouldn't high native contrast ratio be the holy grail spec that would satisfy the namesake of HDR (High Dynamic Range)?

High brightness and suffer from poor black levels. Low brightness and suffer from lack of image vibrancy.

Like Desray, at the current state of technology, laser might be the most promising illumination at the moment for HDR.

How do movie theaters do their HDR?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 05, 2019, 12:13
Wouldn't high native contrast ratio be the holy grail spec that would satisfy the namesake of HDR (High Dynamic Range)?

High brightness and suffer from poor black levels. Low brightness and suffer from lack of image vibrancy.

Like Desray, at the current state of technology, laser might be the most promising illumination at the moment for HDR.

How do movie theaters do their HDR?

Not even sure there is even one in Singapore...if there is, I guess the first projector brand pops in my mind is the revered Christie Projector used in Dolby and IMAX cinema chains.

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 05, 2019, 12:23
Wouldn't high native contrast ratio be the holy grail spec that would satisfy the namesake of HDR (High Dynamic Range)?

High brightness and suffer from poor black levels. Low brightness and suffer from lack of image vibrancy.

Like Desray, at the current state of technology, laser might be the most promising illumination at the moment for HDR.

How do movie theaters do their HDR?

Let's not forget to put bit depth -e.g. 10bit (for normal HDR) and 12bit (Dolby Vision) in the equation as well. 3 things will determine whether HDR is well implemented or not - Native CR, color gamut profile used (BT.2020) & the bit depth. All 3 must work in tandem to deliver good HDR PQ. Of course, all of which is still DEPENDENT on one factor (make or break) - brightness - which derives from the light source - Laser is still the preferred source but projector manufacturers needs to know how to harness those extra lumens effectively so that SDR and HDR will look at it best.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Wilber on February 05, 2019, 12:33
Wouldn't high native contrast ratio be the holy grail spec that would satisfy the namesake of HDR (High Dynamic Range)?

High brightness and suffer from poor black levels. Low brightness and suffer from lack of image vibrancy.

Like Desray, at the current state of technology, laser might be the most promising illumination at the moment for HDR.

How do movie theaters do their HDR?

Samsung Cinema LED. saw it personally, black is pure black and brightness is 10 times of standard cinema @ 500nits peak.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 05, 2019, 12:37
Samsung Cinema LED. saw it personally, black is pure black and brightness is 10 times of standard cinema @ 500nits peak.

Where can I see it? In S.Korea I suppose?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Wilber on February 05, 2019, 12:50
Where can I see it? In S.Korea I suppose?


watched a few shows in Bangkok. their cinemas are way better equipped than ours.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 05, 2019, 12:51
watched a few shows in Bangkok. their cinemas are way better equipped than ours.

I see...thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Poppie on February 05, 2019, 20:02
That's correct! This is ALL members need to know...there is simply no need for anyone to be concerned about dealership and JVC related issues. Just know that Econ AV is an authorised loca dealer for the new JVC N series projectors. As such, I urge members cast aside any negativity and continue to support Econ AV and please do place your order with them as there is absolutely no denying that they do offer the "best deal in town" right now -i.e. 2 yrs local support warranty by JVC Singapore. I did not, so I will have to live with my regrets. But life goes on...

You are very magnanimous and the bigger man. We are very lucky to have you as our forum moderator. I will miss your review of the NX7 though.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on February 05, 2019, 20:05
watched a few shows in Bangkok. their cinemas are way better equipped than ours.

In Singapore Cinema most atr Barco projector with DLP chip set
 . Second are Sony with SXRD chip set and Last one is Christie Digital DLP Chip set .
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 06, 2019, 07:54
Not even sure there is even one in Singapore...if there is, I guess the first projector brand pops in my mind is the revered Christie Projector used in Dolby and IMAX cinema chains.



https://www.dolby.com/us/en/dolby-cinema/locations.html

Not sure if updated or not but no Thailand leh :(

A few cinemas here also claim to be Dolby Cinemas but I doubt they are.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 06, 2019, 08:23
Samsung Cinema LED. saw it personally, black is pure black and brightness is 10 times of standard cinema @ 500nits peak.

watched a few shows in Bangkok. their cinemas are way better equipped than ours.

Bro Doggie, I think you mixed up with Wilbur's post (see quote) where he mentioned about Samsung's LED Cinema in Bangkok and my post lar :P
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Wilber on February 06, 2019, 08:34
https://www.dolby.com/us/en/dolby-cinema/locations.html

Not sure if updated or not but no Thailand leh :(

A few cinemas here also claim to be Dolby Cinemas but I doubt they are.


I believe thailand doesn't have Dolby Cinemas yet.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 09, 2019, 15:11
It seems that the new JVC N series, especially the first batch of NX9/RS3000 manufactured in Oct 2018 have been plagued with QC problem. Panel misalignment and now poor 3D image (dim). For the former issue, many attributed to the mishandling of the courier/delivery service which did not take great care to handle the projector in the box.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/JVC-RS2000NX7N7/i-FjDHp7b/0/ed1b1373/XL/JVC%20N7%20DEFECTIVE%20PHOTO%201-XL.jpg)

As for the latter issue, JVC somehow changed the orientation of the panel by 90 degrees which screwed up the 3D's luminance by 50%!!! While the 3D image has been great and free of ghosting and parallax error in the last couple of X series projectors, JVC screwed the 3D for these N series. :(
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 12:04
Let's see who is able to discern the differences in the 2 images posted below. One of the image is a source direct at 1080p and output at 1080p@24Hz @YCbCr 4:4:4 12 bits (BT.709) while the other is upscaled to 4K at 3840 x 4160@24Hz @YCbCr 4:4:4 12 bits (BT.709).

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/robin_hood_424.jpg)

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/robin_hood_422.jpg)

Can you spot the difference? Look closely and you should be able to pick up the nuances in details...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: bluepill193 on February 10, 2019, 12:40
Bottom image is the 4k 12 bit one. Pores are clearer, the individual hair strands on the temple and shades of gray/white more well defined.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 12:49
Haha...thanks bluepill193, I will reveal the results later today and see who got it right. :P
 ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: francis wu on February 10, 2019, 12:51
I prefer the top 1080p image, less noise ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on February 10, 2019, 12:55
Top is upscaled 4k ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 12:56
I prefer the top 1080p image, less noise ;D

How come you so sure it is 1080p?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: francis wu on February 10, 2019, 12:59
When you upscale, the noise level goes up too :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 13:02
When you upscale, the noise level goes up too :)

Haha...ok. Did you also take into account the way I shot this? Some video noise "may" also be attributed to the way I took the pictures...like ISO sensitivity, zoom in or crop from original image? etc...


Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on February 10, 2019, 13:13
This experiment highlights that we will not notice the difference when watching a movie.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on February 10, 2019, 13:13
Bottom one looks like the source direct 1080p, TOP one looks like upscaled to 4K
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: francis wu on February 10, 2019, 13:19
No, I assume the images were taken like for like.  Yes, you are right that any image manipulation like what you described will definitely change the outcome but it will also render the comparison moot! :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Boxerfan88 on February 10, 2019, 14:37
Top picture one softer (likely upscaled).

Bottom picture clearer, details intact, and subtitle text looks original computer generated (my guess is 1080 source direct)


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 15:58
No, I assume the images were taken like for like.  Yes, you are right that any image manipulation like what you described will definitely change the outcome but it will also render the comparison moot! :)

Good point! Let's just say that there is no manipulating or photography tricks at work here. What you see is what you get. Still your answer is the same - i.e. top image is 1080p (source direct) and not 4K upscale?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:04
This experiment highlights that we will not notice the difference when watching a movie.

Yes and no...yes, the difference may be negligible in certain respect. More importantly is how big and far away from the display you are looking at. The ability to "resolve" the pixels and resolution is less critical as the viewing distance becomes further away from the screen.

The image comparison is to showcase the ability of the new JVC N series projector's capability of doing source direct vs 4K upscaling of 1080p content to near 4K quality w/o the use of their renowned "e-Shift 4K" technology. This is something that many existing JVC X series users would like to know...While I may not release my review but I'll let picture speaks for themselves.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:06
Keep the guessing coming in...I will reveal the results at 6pm. See who has above 20/10 vision!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on February 10, 2019, 16:08
Keep the guessing coming in...I will reveal the results at 6pm. See who has above 20/10 vision!

I bet I have 1/20.
If I am right , you buy me drink
If I am wrong, you pay my drink

Deal !
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:09
Top is upscaled 4k ;D

I bet I have 1/20.
If I am right , you buy me drink
If I am wrong, you pay my drink

Deal !

So bro, this is your answer?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on February 10, 2019, 16:16
Top 1080p, Bottom 4K upscale,
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on February 10, 2019, 16:19
So bro, this is your answer?

Affirmative
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:23
Affirmative

Ah...noted. Either way, you will still get a drink.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on February 10, 2019, 16:29
Ah...noted. Either way, you will still get a drink.

It's a good deed to buy a drink to an old man.  Don't you agree !
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:36
It's a good deed to buy a drink to an old man.  Don't you agree !

Oh yes...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:38
Hint: If you have sharp eye, there are at least 3 spots you can spot the difference. I will circle them for you to make comparison with the other image later. If those who cannot spot, then 4K projector with upscaling capability may just be a gimmick for you. For those who can spot more than 4 "spots", then this JVC native 4K projector may just worth your time. :P
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 16:58
To prove that the 2 images are outputting different resolutions. See the info panes for details.

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/4K_upscale.jpg)
At 4K upscale from a 1080p source

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/2K_source.jpg)
At 1080p Source Direct - outputting 1080p

 ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on February 10, 2019, 17:05
Yeah yeah yeah

I bet on the right horse ;D I took 50-5 chance.

Now you owe me a drink.
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 18:20
The answer is the top image is 1080p source direct outputting at its native 1080p resolution while the bottom image is the result of 4K upscaled from a 1080p source. The upscaled image is pretty good imo.

Let’s spot the differences. The image shown below is the 4K upscaled image from a 1080p source. Compare this with the top image in the original post to see the difference in a much clearer light.

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/robin_hood_422-spot.jpg)

Quite a few of you guys got it right. Both bluepill193 and francis are good.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: BadEnglish on February 10, 2019, 19:10
Ah yeah yeah, 

So I'm wrong.  Geee, then you pay for my drink.

If I have to based on that 2 photos in my decision to buy JVC Nx Projector,  no way.....
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 20:03
Ah yeah yeah, 

So I'm wrong.  Geee, then you pay for my drink.

If I have to based on that 2 photos in my decision to buy JVC Nx Projector,  no way.....

Yes how right you are. If anyone just gonna purely based on the 2 shots I posted and use it to decide whether to get the N series projectors, then he is making a big mistake. I’m pretty sure our members are more discerning than we give credit to.

Actually the purpose of this post is just to make this thread a little more lively. In no way it is intended as a marketing gimmick to entice members here to get the N series.



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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 10, 2019, 20:13
Coming back to upscaling vs native 1080p source direct. There is a negligible difference or improvements to the overall picture quality that I can see. My take on this is for those currently using the X7900 or even the flagship 9900 models to give the N series a miss as the X9900 series already have very good optics and scaling capabilities to deliver very convincing and vivid 4K images. The native 4K panel in the N series is definitely a boon to the JVC lineup considering 4K is now more mainstream in the AV community but the advancement of and perfection of the e-Shift 4K in the last generation had surpassed the expectations of many users and already proved that it can render a 1080p content to near 4K quality without sacrificing details and highlights in most normal usage.

The upgrade to the N series will be more significant for members using the circa 2013 and 2015 models where HDR implementation was still a hit or miss. But for the last X series, it is near perfect.

Wait out for the laser based 4K projector next year or the following year. NX9 pricing is a telltale sign that JVC will be coming up with a more affordable native 4K projector that sports a laser based light source in the not too distant future. Perhaps it can be as soon as next year.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: bluepill193 on February 10, 2019, 20:36
Yay! But it's true that I probably wouldn't notice unless I was told there is a difference.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on February 11, 2019, 08:38
Coming back to upscaling vs native 1080p source direct. There is a negligible difference or improvements to the overall picture quality that I can see. My take on this is for those currently using the X7900 or even the flagship 9900 models to give the N series a miss as the X9900 series already have very good optics and scaling capabilities to deliver very convincing and vivid 4K images. The native 4K panel in the N series is definitely a boon to the JVC lineup considering 4K is now more mainstream in the AV community but the advancement of and perfection of the e-Shift 4K in the last generation had surpassed the expectations of many users and already proved that it can render a 1080p content to near 4K quality without sacrificing details and highlights in most normal usage.

The upgrade to the N series will be more significant for members using the circa 2013 and 2015 models where HDR implementation was still a hit or miss. But for the last X series, it is near perfect.

Wait out for the laser based 4K projector next year or the following year. NX9 pricing is a telltale sign that JVC will be coming up with a more affordable native 4K projector that sports a laser based light source in the not too distant future. Perhaps it can be as soon as next year.



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Nice, I could see that the bottom pic looks sharper in image and the one above it looked smoother, haha. I thought that was the upscaled version.

Nice sharing, great advice, I’ll wait out and check out other models again next year !
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 11, 2019, 13:20
I’m not sure what the screenshots were meant to demonstrate. Doesn’t it just show the difference in upscaling processing between the media player and the display? Since neither source were UHD in the first place.

I guess if you were using MadVR to output UHD at its highest quality settings and then compared the JVC doing its internal upscaling and the two images are virtually identical, it would be a testimony of how good JVC’s algorithms are.

Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 11, 2019, 13:28
I’m not sure what the screenshots were meant to demonstrate. Doesn’t it just show the difference in upscaling processing between the media player and the display? Since neither source were UHD in the first place.

I guess if you were using MadVR to output UHD at its highest quality settings and then compared the JVC doing its internal upscaling and the two images are virtually identical, it would be a testimony of how good JVC’s algorithms are.

Actually it’s more for “entertainment” over a lazy sun day afternoon rather than making a point at how good JVC N series projector does. Just want to make this thread a little bit more “lively” by introducing “where is Wally?” LoL

Using MadVR is a whole different story altogether. If I decide to return the HTPC route, I will post my comments but these days, I will rather leave it to the projector to do all the video processing work.

For me, another aspect comes with the source direct vs upscaling capability of 2K content to 4K. The difference from e-Shift 4K that used to do most of the upscaling work from 1080p to 4K as opposed now the new iteration where JVC utilise the native 4K panel. The difference between the 2 generations for upscaling of normal 1080p content is something worth looking especially for those sitting on the fence of whether to upgrade to the N series to see if there is a significant improvement or incremental kind.

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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: francis wu on February 11, 2019, 13:56
Frankly, i would prefer to go native than upscale.  The former's image will have little noise and a clean image will be more pleasing to the eyes. Up scaled images are generally sharper in details but the difference is not night and day and furthermore unnecessary artifacts are introduced such as more noise and aliasing to mar the overall quality of the image....as always YMMV.

Sexy8

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 11, 2019, 14:38
Francis if you are using a native 4K panel and your source is 1080p, you will always need upscaling. It just depends on where the upscaling is done. And which device does it better.

I find the Zappiti upscaling very good so I’ve been using it to upscale anything from 720p and 1080p to 4K even though the Sony Reality Creation does a good job with other sources. Most recommend using Source Direct on Oppo to send standard BluRays as 1080p
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 11, 2019, 14:43
Francis if you are using a native 4K panel and your source is 1080p, you will always need upscaling. It just depends on where the upscaling is done. And which device does it better.

I find the Zappiti upscaling very good so I’ve been using it to upscale anything from 720p and 1080p to 4K even though the Sony Reality Creation does a good job with other sources. Most recommend using Source Direct on Oppo to send standard BluRays as 1080p

Surprise to learn that a media player Zappiti does upscaling so well? MagicPixel? How is this chipset compared to the Realtek and sigma?


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: francis wu on February 11, 2019, 15:07
Francis if you are using a native 4K panel and your source is 1080p, you will always need upscaling. It just depends on where the upscaling is done. And which device does it better.

I find the Zappiti upscaling very good so I’ve been using it to upscale anything from 720p and 1080p to 4K even though the Sony Reality Creation does a good job with other sources. Most recommend using Source Direct on Oppo to send standard BluRays as 1080p

True! I m only highlighting my predicament as my 1st gen 5 years old Samsung 4K TV does not do a good job in up scaling neither does the Zidoo, hence I prefer native :)
Interesting to note that Zappiti can up scale close to the 4K image...any screen shoots for comparison?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on February 11, 2019, 15:29
I’ll try to take some photos but it’s not just still images. There’s less break up in motion too from what I recall.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on February 11, 2019, 15:32
It seems that the new JVC N series, especially the first batch of NX9/RS3000 manufactured in Oct 2018 have been plagued with QC problem. Panel misalignment and now poor 3D image (dim). For the former issue, many attributed to the mishandling of the courier/delivery service which did not take great care to handle the projector in the box.

(https://photos.smugmug.com/JVC-RS2000NX7N7/i-FjDHp7b/0/ed1b1373/XL/JVC%20N7%20DEFECTIVE%20PHOTO%201-XL.jpg)

As for the latter issue, JVC somehow changed the orientation of the panel by 90 degrees which screwed up the 3D's luminance by 50%!!! While the 3D image has been great and free of ghosting and parallax error in the last couple of X series projectors, JVC screwed the 3D for these N series. :(

Hi Des , this grey scale picture was taken on when ?
It is concerning to see the blue image on the bottom .
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 11, 2019, 15:55
I’ll try to take some photos but it’s not just still images. There’s less break up in motion too from what I recall.

Cool.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 11, 2019, 15:55
Hi Des , this grey scale picture was taken on when ?
It is concerning to see the blue image on the bottom .

That’s taken from a AVSForum member on his flagship NX9.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 17, 2019, 11:45
It seems like the new JVC N series projectors continues with bad QC control...now there is this halo effects (blooming) of white object against a black background on some N5 models. While this is not something uncommon for "blooming" to occur for some JVC projectors, it is a concern for new models since the N series sports a new 4K panel and things should improve from one iteration to the next. In addition, there is also this "ghosting" effects which are fairly apparent against a black background and the "ghosting" moves in tandem with the mechanical IRIS. Hopefully this is only one or two defective units that we are looking at and not something that will affect the whole production chain.

Follow the link here to read more from reviewers of N5: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3038288-official-jvc-rs3000-nx9-jvc-rs2000-nx7-n7-jvc-rs1000-nx5-n5-owners-thread-194.html#post57609508 (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3038288-official-jvc-rs3000-nx9-jvc-rs2000-nx7-n7-jvc-rs1000-nx5-n5-owners-thread-194.html#post57609508)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on February 17, 2019, 14:42
This is bad news to me, i have ordered N5


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 17, 2019, 17:28
This is bad news to me, i have ordered N5


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Don't worry, I'm sure it an isolated case... :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on February 20, 2019, 17:48
Hello All!

I have a JVC NX-5 up and running, do message me if you guys want to take a look at its picture quality!

Cheers
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 20, 2019, 18:43
Hello All!

I have a JVC NX-5 up and running, do message me if you guys want to take a look at its picture quality!

Cheers

Nice...do post your impressions and share with the members here :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Basshead on February 21, 2019, 08:49
Nice...do post your impressions and share with the members here :)

No problem, will compare with my previous projector as well.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: sypderman88 on February 21, 2019, 12:46
Hi,

 Can share what is previous PJ ? I am currently using 4k eshift 5 PJ. From what I gathered current N has worse contrast, worse brightness and black level  , polarizing issues in 3D while some units have image artifacts  but it is clearer and lack of eshift noise due to native panel. Please share your findings bro.

Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 23, 2019, 08:28
Hi,

 Can share what is previous PJ ? I am currently using 4k eshift 5 PJ. From what I gathered current N has worse contrast, worse brightness and black level  , polarizing issues in 3D while some units have image artifacts  but it is clearer and lack of eshift noise due to native panel. Please share your findings bro.

My advice, if you are currently using the last generation X series JVC projectors with 4K eShift 5, then probably you may want to wait for the next generation of the N series to get a more “significant” improvement to the overall picture quality.



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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on February 28, 2019, 18:57
Demo Session for the new JVC N7 native 4K Projector - Cancelled

For those interested to see the new JVC N7 in action, I will be setting aside 3 hours to showcase this projector this Sat (2 Mar) from 1pm to 3pm at my place. I will talk about the good, the bad and other things in between, I will also be touching on the HDR and auto tone-mapping for this projector...and last but not least, sharing my thoughts in general.

As the session will be focusing more on the projector itself rather than the audio aspect of home theater, I will allow a max of 2 members for every hourly session. Only 2 seats avail in my small man-cave.

For those interested, drop me a pm. As always, if response is not good, I will simply cancel it...

Take note, this is NOT a sales pitch for JVC as JVC didn't pay me a dime for this demo, it is purely a sharing session between home theater enthusiasts. For those interested, drop me a PM and I will get back to you.



My apologies to the 2 members. Due to last minute family matters that cropped up that requires my attention. I regret to inform that tmr session will be cancelled till further notice.

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 02, 2019, 12:07
Something to look forward to...https://mailchi.mp/c7615e96b103/28ktk2x74t/
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 03, 2019, 07:50
Static vs Dynamic metadata and why it is important for tone mapping to work...

For those who are getting the new N series (regardless of the models you picked), do take note that the advertised auto mapping feature is far from ideal. There are simply too many variables at play; be it the metadata MaxCLL/MaxFALL from the Display Master Info on the UHD 4K titles itself or the streaming app like Netflix or Amazon Prime Video. The “auto tone mapping” feature is unable to provide a consistent image quality every time we change to a very different source. Almost certainly that one will need to meddle with the tone mapping options like picture tone, dark and bright details control to get the best out of each sources.

The only viable solution for the new N series projectors seems to be the use of dynamic metadata instead of the poorly implemented static metadata that HDR10 provides at this point. And one of the solutions is to use MadVR which does analyse each frame in the movie scenes to produce the required nits (brightness) and contrast (shadow details and perceived blacks) and this require us to use HTPC. Coupled with some stating that these new N series JVC projectors will not receive a firmware update to accept the new HDR10+ metadata, it is a regrettable limitation as these projectors can actually produce very good HDR images if the auto tone mapping feature works “dynamically” to analyse each frames instead of relying on a static metadata.



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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 03, 2019, 12:03
Here's a look at JVC N7 auto tone-mapping. The scene here is from the Pilot episode of Jack Ryan in 4K HDR playing on Amazon Prime Video. The source is from nVidia Shield TV 4K. Can you spot the difference?

With auto tone-mapping "turned on"
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190303/a97138b07b2a1bb13cef2c2aa02c4727.jpg)

With auto tone-mapping "turned off"
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190303/c4eaf3a6f1422a837b8b8b7b816cfcc4.jpg)

Pay attention to the red hues of the helicopter's chasis and the highlights of the azure blue sky. The MaxCLL is 970 nits (brightest pixels in this episode) while the MaxFALL is 269 nits (average light output within a frame). The wider the difference, the more drastic is the picture tone (bright or dim picture) between a bright and dark scenes. This is the problem with static metadata. Dynamic metadata is preferred but JVC projectors (regardless of the models) will not be able to do it "dynamically" across each frames but rather, we have to rely on the source (e.g. Panasonic HDR Optimizer) or the use of MadVR filter on a HTPC to send over the "dynamic metadata" across to JVC projector.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: c722 on March 03, 2019, 13:13
I dun want to say "I told you so" but I remember saying "what if the hyped auto tone mapping fails to live up to expectation" :) 

If I read your comments correctly, JVC is using the static metadata to do re-mapping ? btw do you have Meg 4k ? the max is 10,000 nits if I remember correctly.  You are really supposed to be glared.  See how JVC tone map this ?

Frame by frame dynamic tone mapping is almost like a frame by frame re-encode, not to mention there are plenty of incorrectly flagged metadata.  It's not a simple map lookup. Are you beginning to become a believer that such ops should be done at source ? htpc or a SoC player ? (because it can store the previous frame/look ahead the next frame to compute/guesstimate the proper range)   It's almost like old dvd days, plenty of encoding errors/shortcomings requires player to do line by line correction by itself ("chroma upsampling error" and "motion adaptive compensation" remember).

Actually just taking out the tone mapping "feature" that doesn't work, the JVC N is still a good 4k PJ.  Now it's a fairer comparism between this and the Sony 4ks.  You can then talk about  contrast, brightness, sharpness, motion handling, etc.  One thing I personally felt is, Sony is somehow sharper than JVC, and somehow has smoother motion than JVC, but JVC has higher contrast.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 03, 2019, 13:41
I dun want to say "I told you so" but I remember saying "what if the hyped auto tone mapping fails to live up to expectation" :)   

If I read your comments correctly, JVC is using the static metadata to do re-mapping ? btw do you have Meg 4k ? the max is 10,000 nits if I remember correctly.  You are really supposed to be glared.  See how JVC tone map this ?

Frame by frame dynamic tone mapping is almost like a frame by frame re-encode, not to mention there are plenty of incorrectly flagged metadata.  It's not a simple map lookup. Are you beginning to become a believer that such ops should be done at source ? htpc or a SoC player ? (because it can store the previous frame/look ahead the next frame to compute/guesstimate the proper range)   It's almost like old dvd days, plenty of encoding errors/shortcomings requires player to do line by line correction by itself ("chroma upsampling error" and "motion adaptive compensation" remember).

Actually just taking out the tone mapping "feature" that doesn't work, the JVC N is still a good 4k PJ.  Now it's a fairer comparism between this and the Sony 4ks.  You can then talk about  contrast, brightness, sharpness, motion handling, etc.  One thing I personally felt is, Sony is somehow sharper than JVC, and somehow has smoother motion than JVC, but JVC has higher contrast.


If I don't get the projector in first and then try out this "feature" called auto tone-mapping on the JVC N series projector, you and I will never know whether it works or not. It is one thing to speculate, read from other people's experiences and another if you literally try it for yourselves and provide an affirmative answer to it.

I wouldn't say it is a complete failure for JVC auto tone-mapping. There are some redeeming quality in certain areas but I am not going to great details here. The problem with JVC's very own tone mapping is that the performance fluctuates with different content, be it 4K UHD discs or streaming a 4K movie from Amazon Prime Video or Netflix. If a product didn't fare well, you can be sure that I will report factually even though I owned the product. The idea is to let members know what they are buying so that they can tamper their expectations to a more realistic level (avoid huge disappointments). And yes, "dynamic" metadata as opposed to static ones is the way to go for ALL projectors that does HDR and that also include laser-based projector, not just lamp-based ones like the JVC N series. As long as we go anything beyond 120" image size, tone mapping is MANDATORY but it appears that source-based tone mapping is indeed a better approach in this scenario.

As I have not see the latest Sony 4K in action, I will reserve my comments on the sharpness and details but what I can tell you and everyone is that the image is sharp because this is JVC's first true native 4K panel instead of a native 1080p panel. But Sony definitely handles motion way much better than JVC (no doubt in my mind) as the Clear Motion Drive (CMD) of JVC is a total joke! Take note that I am basing my comparison based on my previous flagship Sony projector (VW500ES). JVC for this year has improved its DI a lot which really enhance the perceived Contrast ratio on screen, especially on 4K (SDR).
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on March 05, 2019, 07:10
https://www.avforums.com/review/jvc-dla-n7-rs2000-4k-dila-projector-review-first-look.15860
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 05, 2019, 07:42
https://www.avforums.com/review/jvc-dla-n7-rs2000-4k-dila-projector-review-first-look.15860 (https://www.avforums.com/review/jvc-dla-n7-rs2000-4k-dila-projector-review-first-look.15860)

I agreed with all the observations and comments made by the reviewer, Steve for the N7. except for two things that stood out to me when he mentioned this:

"I watched the IMAX movie Journey to the South Pacific and the BBC's Planet Earth II, and in both cases the native 4K HDR sources were often stunning, with some of the best projected images that I've seen. Since these documentaries use a 1.78:1 aspect ratio, I turned the Mapping Level back to zero, but I needed to move it up when watching 2.35:1 content like Passengers or Ready Player One."

What's aspect ratio correlates to Mapping level for HDR content? I think I will need to check with the reviewer what he meant by that.

Another one is:

"There's also no dedicated 3D picture modes, which means you essentially have to create one. After a degree of experimentation I eventually had a custom 3D mode that I was happy with and, when watching 1.78:1 3D movies like Avatar, I found the images to be bright enough in the low lamp mode. I also loved the level of detail and the complete lack of any crosstalk.

When I watched a 2.35:1 3D movie like Ready Player One, I found I needed to use the high lamp mode for the best results. Thankfully, the high lamp mode is fairly quiet so it wasn't a big deal, and in all other respects I was happy with the results..."

The N7 in high lamp mode is "loud"...definitely not what I would call, "at a comfortable" audible range. My SPL meter registered a high of about 28 - 29db and that is loud for those who have a small room and not your projector is not ceiling mounted. I believed the reviewer has the projector ceiling mounted.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on March 05, 2019, 08:43
High lamp mode usually loud enough to be audible  for most cases. Most likely as you said its a case of ceiling mount or long throw away from mlp.

In the case of tone mapping, imho the limitations mentioned are all as intended by design. I believe we should see newer movies being released with proper metadata values for tone mapping to work. The madvr will be very interesting option. Anyone tried that with your htpc? Im looking forward to envy release, but i believe it will cost us a grand or more. Wont come cheap.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 05, 2019, 20:05
High lamp mode usually loud enough to be audible  for most cases. Most likely as you said its a case of ceiling mount or long throw away from mlp.

In the case of tone mapping, imho the limitations mentioned are all as intended by design. I believe we should see newer movies being released with proper metadata values for tone mapping to work. The madvr will be very interesting option. Anyone tried that with your htpc? Im looking forward to envy release, but i believe it will cost us a grand or more. Wont come cheap.

It’s good to be optimistic.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: sypderman88 on March 07, 2019, 12:14
Hi,

 I have used madvr HTPC super high settings with the latest madvr auto tone map with X5900. Result is very good especially black and shadow level but there are some red color shift in bt2020 and lack of contrast pop I need to figure out. This is compared the 3 custom Avre curve I uploaded to the PJ.
 Thanks.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 07, 2019, 21:19
Hi,

 I have used madvr HTPC super high settings with the latest madvr auto tone map with X5900. Result is very good especially black and shadow level but there are some red color shift in bt2020 and lack of contrast pop I need to figure out. This is compared the 3 custom Avre curve I uploaded to the PJ.
 Thanks.

That’s the colour profile (HDR or BT2020?) and using PQ curve?



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on March 07, 2019, 21:24
It’s good to be optimistic.



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The video industry standards is a mess.
https://www.audioholics.com/hdtv-formats/4k-uhd-whatever-call-it
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 07, 2019, 21:26
The video industry standards is a mess.
https://www.audioholics.com/hdtv-formats/4k-uhd-whatever-call-it

Like I say...it’s “good” for anyone in the 4K HDR bandwagon at this moment to remain “calm and optimistic” even though it can be quite a mess. LoL



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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 08, 2019, 20:33
Demo Session for the new JVC N7 native 4K Projector - 9 & 10 Mar

For those interested to see the new JVC N7 in action, I will be setting aside 3 hours to showcase this projector this Sat (9 Mar) and Sun (10 Mar) from 1pm to 3pm at my place. For those who want to see how the first JVC true 4K panel perform as compared to the previous X series, this is your chance to see the PQ for yourself and make up your own mind on whether it is worth the upgrade. I will be playing some 4K HDR footages as well as 1080p upscaling to 4K. Take note there is no e-Shift 4K at work here...

Take note though, I can only accommodate a max of 2 members for each session.

For those interested, drop me a pm. As always, I may cancel the session(s) if I'm engaged but rest assured that I will notify you beforehand

Take note, this is NOT a sales pitch for JVC as JVC didn't pay me a dime for this demo, it is purely a sharing session between home theater enthusiasts. For those interested, drop me a PM and I will get back to you.



9 Mar 19 (Sat) - Session completed.
- ginamos
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 13, 2019, 23:00
Demo Session for the new JVC N7 native 4K Projector - 15 & 16 Mar

For those interested to see the new JVC N7 in action, I will be setting aside 2 hours to showcase this projector this Fri evening (15 Mar) at 7.30pm to 9.30pm and Sat (16 Mar) from 1pm to 3pm at my place. For those who want to see how the first JVC true 4K panel perform as compared to the previous X series, this is your chance to see the PQ for yourself and make up your own mind on whether it is worth the upgrade. I will be playing some 4K HDR footages as well as 1080p upscaling to 4K. Take note there is no e-Shift 4K at work here...

Take note though, I can only accommodate a max of 2 members for each session.

For those interested, drop me a pm. As always, I may cancel the session(s) if I'm engaged but rest assured that I will notify you beforehand

Take note, this is NOT a sales pitch for JVC as JVC didn't pay me a dime for this demo, it is purely a sharing session between home theater enthusiasts. For those interested, drop me a PM and I will get back to you.



15 Mar 19 (Fri) - Session full - Completed!
- Alf
- badbad2000


I am cancelling the Sat (16 Mar 19) session for this week.

Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 16, 2019, 06:35
Finally a new firmware release for the N series projector. Version 2.01. My stock firmware comes with 1.19.

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/

Those with Panny UDP-UB820/9000 will gonna love it as JVC added a new profile to optimise HDR image quality.

Damn. I think I may need to consider importing the Panny UB-820 Liao.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 16, 2019, 06:44
Going to be a busy day for me today. JVC also released a new AutoCal software update today version 2.00 to address some of the stability issue in relation to the primary colour calibration.

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000_calibrationsoft.html

Glad JVC is working on updates.


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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 16, 2019, 10:04
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190316/3bb6caa0b80fba06431643686be1c807.jpg)

Insert the flash drive to the USB port behind the projector. Then fire up the projector to initiate the update.

From ver 1.19 to ver 2.01

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190316/5d900eb4a0eb81ea26a9d6db5593c7da.jpg)
Before

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190316/747909f26110e8a787445e2a73dc728c.jpg)
Updating in progress dialogue box

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190316/4efaf2366080b566e3f44181036d9c49.jpg)
After

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190316/4878f274365670e6634baab4d73fe66d.jpg)
After update, see 2 more Color Profiles (High luminance and Low luminance) on Panasonic 4K UHD players been added.

An official statement from JVCKenwood regarding their 2 new custom tone mapping curve to suit the Panny 9000 players, applicable to 420 and 820 with HDR Optimizer feature.

Link: http://pro.jvc.com/pro/pr/2019/consumer/jvc_panasonic.html



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ginamos on March 16, 2019, 12:18
the poison is slowly creeping into my veins.  ;D
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 16, 2019, 13:42
JVC definitely made firmware update a much easy chore than the previous models.

Sent from my CMR-W09 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on March 16, 2019, 20:43
Demo Session for the new JVC N7 native 4K Projector - 15 & 16 Mar

For those interested to see the new JVC N7 in action, I will be setting aside 2 hours to showcase this projector this Fri evening (15 Mar) at 7.30pm to 9.30pm and Sat (16 Mar) from 1pm to 3pm at my place. For those who want to see how the first JVC true 4K panel perform as compared to the previous X series, this is your chance to see the PQ for yourself and make up your own mind on whether it is worth the upgrade. I will be playing some 4K HDR footages as well as 1080p upscaling to 4K. Take note there is no e-Shift 4K at work here...

Take note though, I can only accommodate a max of 2 members for each session.

For those interested, drop me a pm. As always, I may cancel the session(s) if I'm engaged but rest assured that I will notify you beforehand

Take note, this is NOT a sales pitch for JVC as JVC didn't pay me a dime for this demo, it is purely a sharing session between home theater enthusiasts. For those interested, drop me a PM and I will get back to you.



15 Mar 19 (Fri) - Session full - Completed!
- Alf
- badbad2000


I am cancelling the Sat (16 Mar 19) session for this week.

Thank you desray for the 4k hdr demo and explanation. Enjoy my time there.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 16, 2019, 21:07
Thank you desray for the 4k hdr demo and explanation. Enjoy my time there.


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Welcome.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 18, 2019, 07:39
Waiting to get my hands on the Panny UB-420 to try out the tone-mapping feature. I have been actively following the AVSforum thread on the JVC N series projectors and believe me, there are alot of questions and confusion in the way Panny bluray HDR Optimiser feature work with the JVC projectors at this moment. But in general, positive more than negative...but need to straighten out the facts first.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on March 19, 2019, 23:38
Latest review

https://hometheaterreview.com/jvc-dla-rs2000-projector-reviewed/?page=2


Comparison and Competition
Near the RS2000's price point, only one projector comes to mind that offers true competition to the JVC: the Sony VPL-VW695ES priced at $9,999. Like the RS2000, the Sony is a native 4K HDR capable projector offering, on paper, very similar performance and features. I was fortunate enough to have both of these projectors here at the same time and was able to do a shootout between them. The most obvious difference between these two projectors was in contrast performance on darker video content. The JVC simply has more apparent contrast and a much darker level of black. Beyond that, both projectors looked remarkably similar in terms of image sharpness, native motion handling, shadow detail, and color reproduction. While the Sony gives up a little in ultimate contrast performance, it makes up for it with better video processing. Sony's motion smoothing software, called Motion Flow, offers better subjective performance and more modes over the RS2000. Input lag on the Sony, an important metric for gamers, is more than 10 ms faster. I also think Sony's smart sharpening software, called Reality Creation, does a noticeably better job compared to JVC's smart sharpening software, called Enhance in the MPC menu, for those who like to artificially sharpen the image.

If you're someone who is primarily watching movies, I'd recommend the JVC. If you're someone who plans on gaming or watching a lot of sports, I think the Sony is a better fit. Both projectors offer good performance in all areas; however, each have a small lead in these specific areas. Choosing which to buy ultimately comes down to the type of content you view more.

Those looking to upgrade from a JVC e-shift model will be pleased overall with the RS2000. While falling a little behind in contrast performance from the previous mid-tier models, it's an upgrade in most areas. Even though it's using the same lens found on previous models, I found the increase in native resolution made a large difference in perceived sharpness, image stability and three-dimensionality. Especially with UHD and HDR10 content, the RS2000 possesses a level of image finesse that overtakes anything I've witnessed from previous JVC projectors.

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 20, 2019, 07:03
Latest review

https://hometheaterreview.com/jvc-dla-rs2000-projector-reviewed/?page=2


Comparison and Competition
Near the RS2000's price point, only one projector comes to mind that offers true competition to the JVC: the Sony VPL-VW695ES priced at $9,999. Like the RS2000, the Sony is a native 4K HDR capable projector offering, on paper, very similar performance and features. I was fortunate enough to have both of these projectors here at the same time and was able to do a shootout between them. The most obvious difference between these two projectors was in contrast performance on darker video content. The JVC simply has more apparent contrast and a much darker level of black. Beyond that, both projectors looked remarkably similar in terms of image sharpness, native motion handling, shadow detail, and color reproduction. While the Sony gives up a little in ultimate contrast performance, it makes up for it with better video processing. Sony's motion smoothing software, called Motion Flow, offers better subjective performance and more modes over the RS2000. Input lag on the Sony, an important metric for gamers, is more than 10 ms faster. I also think Sony's smart sharpening software, called Reality Creation, does a noticeably better job compared to JVC's smart sharpening software, called Enhance in the MPC menu, for those who like to artificially sharpen the image.

If you're someone who is primarily watching movies, I'd recommend the JVC. If you're someone who plans on gaming or watching a lot of sports, I think the Sony is a better fit. Both projectors offer good performance in all areas; however, each have a small lead in these specific areas. Choosing which to buy ultimately comes down to the type of content you view more.

Those looking to upgrade from a JVC e-shift model will be pleased overall with the RS2000. While falling a little behind in contrast performance from the previous mid-tier models, it's an upgrade in most areas. Even though it's using the same lens found on previous models, I found the increase in native resolution made a large difference in perceived sharpness, image stability and three-dimensionality. Especially with UHD and HDR10 content, the RS2000 possesses a level of image finesse that overtakes anything I've witnessed from previous JVC projectors.



This comparison in strengths/weaknesses between JVC and Sony has been revolving around the same set of arguments for years regardless of the models. As long as you are a movie buff, JVC is the way to go despite some of the kinks where most buyers are readily accepting it. Having say that, the recent N series models have something more up their sleeve that placed it slightly ahead of Sony in the 4K projection race...the native 4K panel. This makes a whole lot of difference.

The most value for money JVC N series projector right now is the N5 and I strongly recommend members to get their hands on the N5 over the N7 (even though I own it)...


:)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on March 20, 2019, 09:45
Desray - you ordered the UB420 from amazon uk? The review also mentioned it should be a good pairing with JVC.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 20, 2019, 12:50
Desray - you ordered the UB420 from amazon uk? The review also mentioned it should be a good pairing with JVC.

No bro, Thks to bro WIM. He helped to bring in a unit for me from Australia. Pending collection later or this week.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: econav on March 20, 2019, 15:42
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190320/e64278e302db1c23807128422160b48b.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190320/2e3b3d4cd582290117cccff1909a0953.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190320/3aac296ee67f4df5cb9f7cec329c3132.jpg)
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on March 20, 2019, 16:05
No bro, Thks to bro WIM. He helped to bring in a unit for me from Australia. Pending collection later or this week.


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Nice, wait for your feedback. I am very keen on the 820 myself  but if 420 is similar if performance for PQ then no need to spend more for the higher end model.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 21, 2019, 08:35
Just setup yesterday night. I will test the HDR Optimizer with the new JVC Color Profiles and report my findings soon.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190321/1e1fd74b7edde2fe3d2e57614674d107.jpg)


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 21, 2019, 18:31
Ok, spent some time in the afternoon with the Panasonic UB-420 player and I must say that the highly acclaimed HDR Optimiser feature does indeed worked on my JVC N7 nicely. For those who followed my post or AVSForum posts closely with regards to the new firmware (ver 2.01) which included 2 new color profiles - Pana_PQ_HL (High Luminance) and Pana_PQ_BL (Low Luminance), you will know JVC and Panasonic had recently collaborated to come up with the 2 new custom tone curves mapped to a low luminance display device like the JVC N series Projectors. The latest JVC projectors are what we termed as Low Luminance display as it barely hit 300 - 500 nits max for HDR content. Whether you like it or not, this is the trade-off for bigger picture. But don't let the low numbers fooled you as 300 nits if presented "right" can be very convincingly "good" for a near 2,000 lumens projector.

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser.JPG)

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_HDR10.JPG)

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_turned_on.JPG)

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_turned_off.JPG)

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_500nits_infopane.JPG)

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_Pana_PQ_HL.JPG)

If you have been following my views about the conundrums of the 4K HDR display, you will know the importance of a "proper" tone-mapping for the 4K UHD media source especially for low luminance display. A poorly implemented tone-mapping will result in dim image and loss of specular highlights and details in both bright and dark scenes. Unfortunately for Projector users like us, we have to live with static meta-data (MaxCLL and MaxFALL) for now. The main difference between Dolby Vision (DV) and HDR10 are the bit rate (12-bit vs 10-bit) and (static vs dynamic metadata). Static metadata will be captured at the the very instance when the movie is played and this will form the baseline for the highest to the lowest nit levels (e.g. 9902 nits/322 nits).

Panasonic HDR Optimiser does what it supposed to do - i.e. tone-map the nit levels from the media (i.e. 4K UHD bluray title) to a more manageable level to suit the display (i.e. JVC N7 projector in this case). To achieve that, we will need to select the HDR type to "Low luminance or Projector" (at 500 nits) option and then load in a 4K HDR bluray disc into the player (UB-420). Bu doing so, it allows us to invoke the HDR Options to gain access to the HDR Optimiser function of the player.

HDR10 PQ curve vs Panasonic PQ curve - Which is better?

This is the most important comparison - i.e. to pit the overall image quality between JVC's very own tone-mapping (i.e. HDR10 PQ) and Panasonic's very own tone-mapping. Both will have HDR Optimizer enabled by default. I have picked Antman and the Wasp 4K UHD bluray disc to test out the scenes. Why Antman and the Wasp? The reason I chose Antman and the Wasp was because this title does not have a MAxCLL and MaxFALL static metadata for JVC N7 to work on as such there is no way to activate the auto tone-mapping feature of the projector. With the HDR Optimiser turned off, the image was dim with a heavy overcast. Even in bright day scenes, JVC struggles to show the details of various scenes. Huge disappointment. When I enabled HDR Optimiser, the image suddenly comes to life with more brightness and highlights in the skin tones and the colors became more vibrant. I also realized that HDR Optimiser when enabled allowed JVC N7 to activate the auto tone-mapping and with the setting turned on, the JVC N7 performed a tone-mapping to scale its luminance level down to 500 nits (MaxCLL / oddly no MaxFALL info though).

I then switched to new Pana_PQ_HL (at 500 nits) which in this case will deactivate the JVC N7 tone-mapping feature so as to allow the UB-420 to take over the rein in tone-mapping. The image quality is very close between the HDR10 PQ curve (with JVC taking over the tone-mapping) and the Pana_PQ_HL curve (with UB-420 player taking over the tone-mapping). Upon closer inspection and playing through more scenes, I found that I actually preferred JVC auto tone-mapping over the so-called new Pana_PQ_HL custom curve. The HL curve simulates closely to the JVC HDR PQ curve as there is no engagement of a DCI-P3 color filter. However for some reasons, JVC auto tone-mapping did a much better job in most of the scenes compared to Pana_PQ_HL tone curve.

I will need to try out more titles to see if there is any more "significant" improvements in using the custom Pana_PQ_HL curve - for instance to load a disc with static metadata like Aquaman. I will report back with more findings...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 21, 2019, 23:08
Re-watched The Avengers Infinity War...and there are many scenes in this movie which really make the UB-420 shine. Here's an example of Loki holding on a Tesseract in his hand. Look at the glow with and without HDR Optimiser. The outline of the glow within the Tesseract is more visible with the HDR Optimiser was engaged. The strength of using Panny's HDR Optimiser is the fact that it DOES NOT affect the overall picture brightness but focus on the peak brightness in certain intra-scene and re-mapping the tone to make it work for a low luminance display (Projector) without losing the specular highlights.

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_off_Loki.JPG)
HDR Optimiser set to "off"

(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/HDR_optimiser_on_Loki.JPG)
HDR Optimiser set to "on"

I also discovered that some titles worked better with Pana_PQ_HL tone curve while others worked better with JVC's own tone-mapping engaged (e.g. Antman & the Wasp). In this case, The Avengers Infinity War have better contrast and black levels with Pana_PQ_HL curve.
In short, it will still very much depends on the content.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on March 24, 2019, 12:30
Nice impression from Panasonic ! Looks good for the price

How is the sound quality ? Is the ub420 able to playback iso files on its USB connections , as in full bd menu vis a usd3 hard disk
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 24, 2019, 21:17
Nice impression from Panasonic ! Looks good for the price

How is the sound quality ? Is the ub420 able to playback iso files on its USB connections , as in full bd menu vis a usd3 hard disk

Nope...BD-420 don't do BD ISO. Sound quality is fine...my Pioneer LX-500 is better in the sound department.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kikoman on March 25, 2019, 08:04
Nope...BD-420 don't do BD ISO. Sound quality is fine...my Pioneer LX-500 is better in the sound department.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGLEY_g7M64&feature=share
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on March 28, 2019, 17:55
The Pioneer LX-500 ‘s HDR>SDR BT2020 conversion produces some of the best picture quality in the JVC N7 I have seen. It is even better compared to the Panny UB-420 which I also owned.

But for HDR, the Panny UB-420/820/9000 with its proprietary HDR Optimiser is a league of its own. However do take note that The black floor in HDR presentation is raised somewhat which affects the black levels. This reduces the “pop” contrasty effects when viewing movies with dimly litter scenes. To reduce this effect, one will have to reduce the overall brightness of the projector by -2 to -3.

Pros and Cons of a slower DI in the new N series Projectors
This time round for the new JVC N series projector, JVC have improved the DI performance in terms of its speed in opening and closing the Iris which minimise the problem with “white subtitles or object” blooming or “pumping” effects against a black background. However the cons that comes with slower DI speed is the poor “fade to black” and vice versa intra-scene. This has a detrimental effect on the black levels since the Iris is unable to close fast enough for the swift and smooth transition from a bright scene to dark scene. And this can be rather apparent if one is susceptible to it.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: JayKrishna on March 29, 2019, 11:55
Hi Hero,
Just curious to know,
Have you got your unit?


Below is your message on 26th Jan.
Offline Hero
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Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
« Reply #43 on: January 26, 2019, 10:11 »
Quote
Looks to me like an irresponsible JVC seller giving out unsupported promises to secure more sales for himself is the root cause here.
 
On the brighter side, I am grateful that Econ AV has helped to secure and confirm a 2 year warranty for us buyers, and also give caution to potential buyers to be careful about ensuring your purchases are supported by local warranty.

Desray's well meaning posts was unfortunately caught in the crossfire.

Let's drop the negatives and move on with the positives ok
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Hero on March 29, 2019, 13:48
Not yet. I was just informed a few days ago by Econav of a delay due to new board production by JVC in April, and the new target date is now May 2019. I was given option of a full refund or continue to wait.

Since i currently have a working Epson 8350, i decided to wait. Also knowing i will be getting a more updated unit come May.  :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on April 06, 2019, 10:55
Today’s demo session for the N7 has been cancelled as I’m hosting some overseas guests later in the evening. Apologies to those who have expressed their interest. I’ll try to set up another session sometime next week.

Cheers.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on April 18, 2019, 08:59
The review for N9

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/jvc-dla-nx9-d-ila-projector-review
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on April 23, 2019, 23:37
Some have PM'ed me to ask about the performance of the 3D...and I'm happy to report that it works GREAT! You can use the normal RF glasses like the Samsung SSG series which came with the Samsung TV circa 2013-2014.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on May 14, 2019, 08:58
Shootout between the best JVC and Sony projectors, as calibrated by Kris Deering (who reviewed the NX9 in the link couple of posts above). Quite surprised at how close the NX7 is to the NX9 in terms of actual performance. Too bad they didn’t test the entry level NX5.

https://www.thescreeningroomav.com/single-post/2019/05/01/Initial-Results-From-Our-April-2019-Sony-and-JVC-4K-Projector-Expo-Shootout-Event
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on May 30, 2019, 15:45
New firmware version 2.07 for the NX series is out today

Download: https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/dl.html (https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/dl.html)

Changelog:
- Stability fixes.

 ;)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on May 30, 2019, 20:34
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/firmware_207.jpg)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on July 21, 2019, 00:43
“In a different league”

https://uk.jvc.com/files/images/_web/11/news/awards/HCC_298_JVC_pro_Reprint-LOW.pdf
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on July 25, 2019, 11:35
Received a tip-off that the stock for the new N series JVC projectors finally coming to Singapore soon. The difference between N5 and N7 lies with the P3 filter. If you are a person that values wider color gamut at the expense of 20-30% drop in overall light output (not an issue if your screen is not >120" imo) then the N7 model will be a good value proposition. However if you value light output over wider color gamut, then N5 will be a good choice and you also get to save a more $$$ which can be diverted to purchase more physical 4K UHD bluray discs or even a Panny UDP-820 to start taking advantage of the HDR Optimiser.


Looking forward to more members joining the club. :)

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on July 25, 2019, 13:40
Received a tip-off that the stock for the new N series JVC projectors finally coming to Singapore soon. The difference between N5 and N7 lies with the P3 filter. If you are a person that values wider color gamut at the expense of 20-30% drop in overall light output (not an issue if your screen is not >120" imo) then the N7 model will be a good value proposition. However if you value light output over wider color gamut, then N5 will be a good choice and you also get to save a more $$$ which can be diverted to purchase more physical 4K UHD bluray discs or even a Panny UDP-820 to start taking advantage of the HDR Optimiser.


Looking forward to more members joining the club. :)

Nice.

Desray, how do u find the tone mapping on the jvc N7?  How is the ST2084 tracking on the JVC N7?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on July 25, 2019, 13:48
Nice.

Desray, how do u find the tone mapping on the jvc N7?  How is the ST2084 tracking on the JVC N7?

Very good for a lamp based native 4K Projector imo.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on July 25, 2019, 14:02
Very good for a lamp based native 4K Projector imo.



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Very nice ! I Guess that’s the price you pay for the quality :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on August 24, 2019, 13:14
v2.08

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on August 24, 2019, 13:54
v2.08

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/ (https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/)

Ha...u beat me to it...I was about to post this new firmware :)

Too bad the changelog is as good as none...hope it can fix the 4:4:4 signal sent as 4:2:2 issue.


Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Djblackfm on September 06, 2019, 07:45
Found this on Facebook. Sharing it here. Hope it helps.

JVC Projector Firmware Update

Delivers Significantly Upgraded HDR Performance
New Frame Adapt HDR analyzes HDR10 content frame by frame
and automatically optimizes brightness.
LONG BEACH, Calif, September 5, 2019 – Underscoring its commitment to offer the best possible home theater experience, JVC today announced a firmware update for its line of Native 4K D-ILA projectors that delivers a significant advancement in HDR performance.

This feature forward update adds JVC’s new Frame Adapt HDR function, which dynamically analyzes HDR10 picture level frame by frame and automatically adjusts the brightness & color to optimize HDR performance for each frame.
Because content brightness varies, a fixed setting cannot deliver optimum image quality. JVC’s new Frame Adapt HDR solves this by instantly analyzing the peak brightness of each frame or scene using a proprietary JVC algorithm, and adjusting dynamic range to provide the best possible HDR image. Frame Adapt HDR works with any HDR10 content, even content that does not contain brightness metadata (Max CLL/Max FALL).
Main Features
Delivers images closer to reality

Compatible with all HDR10 content

Smooth gradation with 18-bit level gamma accuracy

Support for 16x9 content when using a Panamorph Paladin DCR lens (adds Anamorphic D). It is now possible to leave a Paladin DCR lens in position and view both ultra-wide and 16x9 content correctly.

Auto Calibration support for Spyder X sensor.

Adds new presets to screen adjustment function.

Dynamic range is adjusted in real time for optimal image projection. At the same time, saturation, hue, and brightness is analyzed and optimal corrections are made, which reduces color loss.
As a result, even within a single program, darker scenes have deeper blacks with enhanced color. Bright scenes have higher peak brightness without color loss while maintaining black level. All content is reproduced closer to what the human eye is capable of seeing.
Frame Adapt HDR adjustments are based on analysis of the input HDR10 signal. Therefore, it is effective on content with or without mastering information. As a result, all HDR10 content can be enjoyed with greater dynamic range and image quality than ever before.
The gamma processing accuracy, which in the past was based on 12-bit equivalent, has been improved to 18-bit and as a result gradation performance is dramatically improved. In any given scene, it reduces the banding effect in the bright portions and the crushing of dark portions. This provides accurate, smooth gradation along with higher average peak level brightness and increased color saturation, which has previously been a challenge with HDR content.
Other Improvements

The firmware will be available for download at no charge in October for the DLA-NX9, DLA-NX7 and DLA-NX5 as well as the DLA-RS3000, DLA-RS2000 and DLA-RS1000.

Link for download: https://www3.jvckenwood.com/projector/support/dla-v9r_v7_v5_update/ (https://www3.jvckenwood.com/projector/support/dla-v9r_v7_v5_update/)


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on September 06, 2019, 12:47
Dynamic tone mapping? That’s a potential game changer for those of us that can’t afford a Lumagen pro. Kudos to JVC for introducing this killer feature in their update!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 06, 2019, 13:15
This feature alone is worth a lot! Jvc is really leading the pack.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on September 08, 2019, 16:23
Anyone use the autocal? Can i use i1pro2?


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 08, 2019, 17:15
The new upcoming firmware (due to be released in Oct) will indeed be a game-changer...Yes, I'm talking about the "Frame Adapt HDR" feature which supposedly analyzes HDR-10 static metadata (MaxCLL & MaxFALL) dynamically and auto-adjust the brightness (specular highlights) & color (WCG) to optimize HDR performance for each frame! I'm looking forward to see how it will improve the overall HDR PQ when compared to the use of MadVR, Panasonic's HDR Optimiser, and the likes...I read that for those w/o or with wrong static metadata can also benefit from this new "Frame Adapt HDR" feature.

Other Improvements that caught my attention include:

+ The increase in gamma gradation from "12-bit to 18-bit" which frankly I'm clueless as to how they manage this engineering feat, to begin with. Anyhow if this holds true, that will mean a drastic reduction in banding for APL scenes, particularly in those overcast and bright scenes.
 
+ the new support for Sypder Pro X sensor which is meant for the laser-based projection system. This is good news for RS4500 users.

Source: https://hometheaterreview.com/jvc-upgrades-hdr-performance-with-new-projector-firmware/
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 09, 2019, 09:27
First look !

Direct translation  ;D

This has left a tremendous impression in the literal sense of many different sequences of "Aquaman" and film sequences made in Sicily, perfectly reproducing the HDR effect with the finest contrast nuances, as well as a very natural, dynamic image. The picture never seems too bright or too dark, always the balance is almost optimal. Even in complex scenes, such as when Aquman dives underwater into a cave, an extremely good differentiation ability is offered. The smallest brightness differences come out aptly, which leads to the fact that the viewer thinks in the middle of the action. Even with very bright images or strongly contrasting content, the DLA-N7 with its enabled Frame Adapt HDR always looks confident and conveys a very realistic image impression.

What made this "Frame Adapt HDR" develop?

HDR video is now available on many UHD Blu-rays and streaming services. However, some of the productions differ considerably in their brightness, some content seems too bright, others too dark. JVC therefore provided early on several workarounds for the most consistent representation of HDR content in projection, ranging from manual gamma adjustment for fine adjustment of brightness to "auto tone mapping", which automatically adjusts the brightness setting adapts the mastering information contained in the video (MaxCLL / FALL).

However, the Frame Adapt HDR feature included in the new firmware takes a significant step forward by using an algorithm developed by JVC to analyze each frame of the HDR10 content in terms of maximum brightness in real time and adjust the dynamic range for optimal image projection accordingly.

At the same time, the saturation, hue and brightness of the video data are inspected and also corrected in such a way that as few color losses as possible occur. As a result, even with the same content, darker scenes have deeper blacks and light scenes have higher maximum brightness without losing color. The reproduced images thus correspond much more to the human visual perception, which could not be realized in this way with previous projector technology.

Since the "Frame Adapt HDR" function makes adjustments based on the analyzed HDR10 input signals, not only will video data with built-in mastering information be corrected, but all other HDR10 content as well. The projection of the videos takes place in such a dynamic and high-quality quality as you have never seen before.

The new firmware also allows extremely fine brightness gradation with 18-bit accuracy. Instead of the hitherto customary color depths of 10 or 12 bits, brightness gradations with an accuracy of 18 bits are possible here in the future, which corresponds to more than 262,000 representable levels per color. This guarantees an extremely precise and uniform reproduction of all color shades from the deepest black to the brightest white.

Other enhancements included in the upgrade: The image settings can be made via a redesigned, clearer interface. In addition, the anamorphic lenses of the DCR series will be supported by Panamorph for the 16: 9 mode. The new free firmware version 3.10 for the JVC DLA-NX9B, DLA-N7B and DLA-N5B / W projectors will be available from November 2019 and will be made available for download on the global JVC support website.


https://www.areadvd.de/tests/xxl-special-jvc-praesentiert-frame-adapt-hdr-mit-d-ila-projektor-dla-n7-im-referenz-kino-auf-der-ifa/
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 10, 2019, 06:33
First look !

Direct translation  ;D

This has left a tremendous impression in the literal sense of many different sequences of "Aquaman" and film sequences made in Sicily, perfectly reproducing the HDR effect with the finest contrast nuances, as well as a very natural, dynamic image. The picture never seems too bright or too dark, always the balance is almost optimal. Even in complex scenes, such as when Aquman dives underwater into a cave, an extremely good differentiation ability is offered. The smallest brightness differences come out aptly, which leads to the fact that the viewer thinks in the middle of the action. Even with very bright images or strongly contrasting content, the DLA-N7 with its enabled Frame Adapt HDR always looks confident and conveys a very realistic image impression.

What made this "Frame Adapt HDR" develop?

HDR video is now available on many UHD Blu-rays and streaming services. However, some of the productions differ considerably in their brightness, some content seems too bright, others too dark. JVC therefore provided early on several workarounds for the most consistent representation of HDR content in projection, ranging from manual gamma adjustment for fine adjustment of brightness to "auto tone mapping", which automatically adjusts the brightness setting adapts the mastering information contained in the video (MaxCLL / FALL).

However, the Frame Adapt HDR feature included in the new firmware takes a significant step forward by using an algorithm developed by JVC to analyze each frame of the HDR10 content in terms of maximum brightness in real time and adjust the dynamic range for optimal image projection accordingly.

At the same time, the saturation, hue and brightness of the video data are inspected and also corrected in such a way that as few color losses as possible occur. As a result, even with the same content, darker scenes have deeper blacks and light scenes have higher maximum brightness without losing color. The reproduced images thus correspond much more to the human visual perception, which could not be realized in this way with previous projector technology.

Since the "Frame Adapt HDR" function makes adjustments based on the analyzed HDR10 input signals, not only will video data with built-in mastering information be corrected, but all other HDR10 content as well. The projection of the videos takes place in such a dynamic and high-quality quality as you have never seen before.

The new firmware also allows extremely fine brightness gradation with 18-bit accuracy. Instead of the hitherto customary color depths of 10 or 12 bits, brightness gradations with an accuracy of 18 bits are possible here in the future, which corresponds to more than 262,000 representable levels per color. This guarantees an extremely precise and uniform reproduction of all color shades from the deepest black to the brightest white.

Other enhancements included in the upgrade: The image settings can be made via a redesigned, clearer interface. In addition, the anamorphic lenses of the DCR series will be supported by Panamorph for the 16: 9 mode. The new free firmware version 3.10 for the JVC DLA-NX9B, DLA-N7B and DLA-N5B / W projectors will be available from November 2019 and will be made available for download on the global JVC support website.


https://www.areadvd.de/tests/xxl-special-jvc-praesentiert-frame-adapt-hdr-mit-d-ila-projektor-dla-n7-im-referenz-kino-auf-der-ifa/

Thanks for sharing this.  Definitely very positive outlook so far for this new Frame Adaptive HDR feature. I thought we are getting this new firmware next month but I guess JVC decides to delay the launch till Nov.

(https://www.areadvd.de/images/2019/09/jvc_frame_adapt_hdr.jpeg)

The “acid test” will be those notorious titles from Disney Marvel movies without proper metadata or the lack of. If this new feature can improve the overall HDR PQ without the need to use custom curve etc, then this is gonna be a real gem for me.

Eagerly looking to it.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Jag on September 12, 2019, 14:59
The madvr will be very interesting option. Anyone tried that with your htpc? Im looking forward to envy release, but i believe it will cost us a grand or more. Wont come cheap.

Some early indications show there will be a base model and a pro model for MadVR envy.

Initial estimates put the base model MSRP price to be US$5,499. Pro model to be US$9,979.

Converted to SGD, you might be able to buy a HTPC AND a 4K pj and still have loose change after that.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 12, 2019, 20:11
Some early indications show there will be a base model and a pro model for MadVR envy.

Initial estimates put the base model MSRP price to be US$5,499. Pro model to be US$9,979.

Converted to SGD, you might be able to buy a HTPC AND a 4K pj and still have loose change after that.

Adopt the wait-and-see approach at this point...JVC new firmware may be a good trade-off combined with Penny HDR Optimizer.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 12, 2019, 21:49
Dont know how to spend 5.5k usd on a video optimiser ...
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: kaydee6 on September 12, 2019, 23:02
Dont know how to spend 5.5k usd on a video optimiser ...
Dont know how to spend 5.5k usd on a video optimiser ...

Already at 5.5k usd, bite the bullet and go for the pro at 10k usd.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on September 13, 2019, 07:25
Adopt the wait-and-see approach at this point...JVC new firmware may be a good trade-off combined with Penny HDR Optimizer.

Agree. I’m sure the MadVR Envy will be better than JVC DTM, but the latter will be coming free with all JVC NX series projectors. That’s great value and may be better off just buying a projector outright.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on September 13, 2019, 15:25
Update from AVSforum user on the JVC demo at Cedia:

Quote
Cedia update from just a regular user

So let me just say CEDIA was as a whole Mehhh. Meaning nothing really blew me away. Some things were good but nothing amazing.

The JVC Demo was with the RS3000 and goodness gracious it would be nice if they calibrated it better......

The DLP was not impressive to me at all.

DTM actually I think will be great for 90% of the people. There was standing room only for the demo I was in. You can tell the difference (they did a A/B comparison) and it did enhance the picture. It is not MadVR quality however It was better than the panni and JVC settings. The Panni guy was there and he said the new DTM will work well with the players. You will have the option of having firmware w/o DTM if you need pin cushion.

Again, I am not sure yet if I would spend 5K or 10K to get 10% better HDR if that is the case. You will like it if the demo holds true to what I saw. But they did do it with an animated movie and I would like to have seen it with some real people to see what it looks like.

They did say the release date for the new firmware is a soft date but end of October.

See the picture of the menu for DTM. They did not go through all the setting but it does look like there are some options.

RS3000 let me say, I will keep my RS2000 with the DCR lens. It was good however it did not blow me away for the extra cost.

(https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=2614474&d=1568329260)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: InnocentBlood on September 13, 2019, 15:46
had a chance to see the N7 in action 2 days ago and I was very impressed. for those of you guys who are using the N7, would it be advisable to ceiling mount them given the black beast is about 20kg heavy?
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 13, 2019, 16:11
I would think any solid built mount should do fine. Lots of ceiling mount examples in avsforums. Make sure drill into ceiling is properly done.

Yes its huge. I like to call it the BMW of projector world. :)

So far those who visited me, all got seriously poisoned. None survived.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190913/1b33ee2b702a78d3ed704a29c3cfbed1.jpg)

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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on September 15, 2019, 01:31
had a chance to see the N7 in action 2 days ago and I was very impressed. for those of you guys who are using the N7, would it be advisable to ceiling mount them given the black beast is about 20kg heavy?
I direct mounted to ceiling


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on September 15, 2019, 01:32
Do you watch in HP or eco mode? I find the HP mode contrast is much better.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: rock123 on September 15, 2019, 02:44
I would think any solid built mount should do fine. Lots of ceiling mount examples in avsforums. Make sure drill into ceiling is properly done.

Yes its huge. I like to call it the BMW of projector world. :)

So far those who visited me, all got seriously poisoned. None survived.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190913/1b33ee2b702a78d3ed704a29c3cfbed1.jpg)

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk


Gorgeous )
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on September 15, 2019, 08:24
Do you watch in HP or eco mode? I find the HP mode contrast is much better.

I have quite a large screen, so I watch HDR content in high lamp, and SDR in low lamp.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 15, 2019, 18:00
From cedia on the jvc new tone mapping (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190915/685006a350b48122de8bc984d3c8b286.jpg)

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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Doggie Howser on September 16, 2019, 10:58
Damn. I’m envious

The 760ES will get dynamic iris and new digital focus for edge sharpening on the corners. But I’d rather have dynamic tone mapping.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on September 16, 2019, 18:58
From cedia on the jvc new tone mapping (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190915/685006a350b48122de8bc984d3c8b286.jpg)

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Great job from JVC, dynamic tone mapping is the way forward for HDR !!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: InnocentBlood on September 17, 2019, 13:34
I direct mounted to ceiling


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would you mind sharing with me the details of your ceiling mount please? you can PM me if that's better for you, thanks :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 17, 2019, 19:58
Damn. I’m envious

The 760ES will get dynamic iris and new digital focus for edge sharpening on the corners. But I’d rather have dynamic tone mapping.

LoL...switch to JVC or better still keep VW760ES and get JVC as a secondary projector. :)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 17, 2019, 19:59
Great job from JVC, dynamic tone mapping is the way forward for HDR !!

I will definitely putting the "new" HDR Adaptive feature to its pace...and report back whether it is indeed a game-changer or just another hyperbole.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on September 20, 2019, 12:45
I will definitely putting the "new" HDR Adaptive feature to its pace...and report back whether it is indeed a game-changer or just another hyperbole.

Looking forward to your input , if it’s really worth it and works as intended, I might take the route of switching to the N7
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 22, 2019, 19:59
Looking forward to your input , if it’s really worth it and works as intended, I might take the route of switching to the N7

Trust me, u don’t need me to prove anything for JVC projectors. The adaptive HDR frame feature is icing on the cake and even w/o it...it will not affect the purchase decision imo.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on September 22, 2019, 21:39
would you mind sharing with me the details of your ceiling mount please? you can PM me if that's better for you, thanks :)

You will need hdmi and power on the ceiling and a projector mount can support 20kg.

Bring the 20kg up on ceiling is not easy task, so get a projector mount with quick release will be prefer.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 22, 2019, 21:56
More from cedia showcasing new firmware

Scene from The Meg

Before and after
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190922/6ad118e5dc945613f092e2028f2fe7df.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190922/5fa19b252c76ae6841ff27a22c30ca47.jpg)

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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 22, 2019, 22:48
More from cedia showcasing new firmware

Scene from The Meg

Before and after
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190922/6ad118e5dc945613f092e2028f2fe7df.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190922/5fa19b252c76ae6841ff27a22c30ca47.jpg)

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Wow. Looks promising. Can’t wait till end of Oct to early Nov for the official firmware to release.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on September 22, 2019, 22:56
really looking forward to this free upgrade by JVC.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on September 23, 2019, 07:53
Yes, perfect example , the meg, this is the movie to test for HDR brightness and tone mapping quality , a lot of PJ will project a wash out image if tone mapping feature is not good enough

The other movie would be blade runner 2049, if it’s too dark it’s also the tone mapping being the culprit

Very impressive indeed from the N7
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: tsammyc on September 23, 2019, 22:05
Roni, can you take a picture of that frame on the BenQ
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on September 24, 2019, 08:48
Pick your poison

Frame by frame

Or

Scene by scene

:)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190924/731ca348806d52a15c49e816802d6f7c.jpg)

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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 25, 2019, 19:52
A member has asked me about the model of the Samsung 3D glasses which is compatible with the N series. This is the one I’m using and it worked flawlessly. Make sure it is using RF.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190925/a5a0b1d36161759517fbea233547f635.jpg)


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on September 25, 2019, 19:55
Pick your poison

Frame by frame

Or

Scene by scene

:)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190924/731ca348806d52a15c49e816802d6f7c.jpg)

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Brilliant. Can’t wait for the new firmware to drop!!!



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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 04, 2019, 16:43
I’m getting all hyped up as I read the soon to be released JVC N series firmware 3.10 which feature the debut appearance of Adaptive HDR frame rate.  The new firmware not only improves the specular highlights of HDR when it needed the most but also seems to eliminate the “yellowing” issue with the Auto Iris.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3089022-jvc-announces-major-hdr-update-4k-d-ila-projectors-8.html#/topics/3089022?

Can’t wait for end of Oct to early Nov for this new firmware.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on October 04, 2019, 20:42
Early impressions of DTM on the new firmware from guru Kris Deering.

Quote
Hello Everyone. I've been evaluating the upcoming firmware for the last few days and will be working on an online article about the update. Early impression is excellent! I think people using the standard static tone mapping in the JVC are in for a big treat with the frame by frame. JVC's per frame performance is MUCH better than I was expecting going in. More soon!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 05, 2019, 06:57
Early impressions of DTM on the new firmware from guru Kris Deering.

Wow...with Kris Derring positive experience on this new upcoming firmware. Now that’s something.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on October 05, 2019, 12:27
Does it apply yo all jvc N model?


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on October 05, 2019, 13:24
DTM is activated for all N series.

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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on October 05, 2019, 14:06
A member has asked me about the model of the Samsung 3D glasses which is compatible with the N series. This is the one I’m using and it worked flawlessly. Make sure it is using RF.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190925/a5a0b1d36161759517fbea233547f635.jpg)


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In order to use other RF 3D glasses you will still require to buy the RF emitter unit .

The difference is the JVC glasses has better contrast than most RF glasses .

There are dealers who sell the new current RF emitter and RF glasses ( rechargeable type ) .

Alternative option is to buy Used IR emitter and Used IR Glasses which uses replacement battery 3025 type .

Hope that helps 
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 05, 2019, 15:05
In order to use other RF 3D glasses you will still require to buy the RF emitter unit .

The difference is the JVC glasses has better contrast than most RF glasses .

There are dealers who sell the new current RF emitter and RF glasses ( rechargeable type ) .

Alternative option is to buy Used IR emitter and Used Glasses which used replacement battery 3025 type .

Hope that helps

Yes, Alf is right. U need to have a RF emitter, use a JVC RF emitter (whenever possible for compatibility) to be installed at the rear of the projector itself.




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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: badbad2000 on October 05, 2019, 15:49
How much is the emitter and glasses cost? My sony tv 3d glasses or panasonic or epson glasses can reused?


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 05, 2019, 20:33
It seems like we maybe getting the new firmware 3.10 earlier than expected...probably next week ?!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on October 07, 2019, 17:19
(https://i.ibb.co/ZcYh81N/jvc-pk-ag1-glasses-emitter-most-3d-1-5efc7899269a4fa470b12489a8041e06.jpg)

This is the old ir type which is still available in used units ( for those just want for having fun once a while )
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: alf on October 07, 2019, 17:23
(https://i.ibb.co/g4NrQ48/images-WGCYWUOK.jpg)

This are the new rf type with rechargeable type . Available new only unless some guys from forum here is selling off .
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 08, 2019, 06:43
Some more good news on the upcoming firmware release. It appears that JVC new Frame Adapt HDR feature does not need static meta data (MaxCLL & MaxFALL) to work its magic because it is using its own proprietary algorithm to analyse each frame/scene to provide the best PQ. If this is indeed the case, then this is great for those with normal 4K Blu-ray player owners who don’t own an Oppo or Panasonic UB-820 player.

Rumours has it that the firmware to be dropped this week...likely from mid week onwards.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Count on October 08, 2019, 08:55
Yup. Seems like the best way is to just use a player to output as source direct. And then let the projector do it’s magic. Looks like no need for the Panasonic HDR Optimizer anymore, for those with JVC.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on October 09, 2019, 12:10
The package has landed !

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/download/dla-nx9_dla-nx7_dla-nx5_dla-n7_dla-n5_dla-n11_dla-n8_dla-n6_dla-rs3000_dla-rs2000_dla-rs1000/

Video link
https://www.facebook.com/564344827403356/posts/712448685926302/
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on October 09, 2019, 22:12
Haven't updated mine. Positive reviews from users so far. Fact that it is comparable to MadVR (which costs few thousands $$) speaks a lot on this free upgrade.  :o


(Google Translation)

FIRST COMPARISON: FRAME ADAPT HDR vs. MADVR

The weekend was over. A home cinema friend from Hamburg visited me. In the luggage a ready made ready made Media PC. Price: 3500, - Euro.
We wanted to find out how Frame Adapt HDR, which provides JVC as a firmware update for free (!), Can prove it in the A / B comparison.

Excerpts from the following films were used:
- Sully
- The Martian
- Tomb Raider

Preparation:
The JVC DLA-N7 was connected via an HDMI input. The image signals from the Media PC and Panasonic DP-UB9004 went first into the Marantz SR7011 and from there to the projector. The projector is calibrated, the color temperature is 6505 Kelvin (D65). Color is set to 10 to add a bit more brightness to the mottled colors without "bleeding out" in the films. HDR level (for Frame Adapt HDR) is high.
The Media PC was optimally adjusted according to the specifications of the dealer. No changes were made to that. In the Panasonic DP-UB9004 there were also slight adjustments in the picture menu, so that the sharpness was perfectly exploited on the basis of sharpness test images.
The projector has turned off all noise filters and blur.

All three films were previously ripped from the 4K Blu-ray from the Media PC and "read" via madVR. That took about 20 minutes per film. We did not use the live feature because the owner of the media PC did not use it.

First impressions of the picture:
Sully:
1. While the plane is flying over Central Park (Chapter 1), the paths are clearly visible on the snow. The sky offers a light blue course in the backlight. On the road between the skyscrapers, individual cars can be seen.
MadVR represents everything true to the original. Paths, gradient in the sky, cars. Everything seems very natural.
Frame Adapt HDR is in no way inferior here. Paths, gradient in the sky, cars. Everything looks very similar. Notable differences can not be seen here.

2. The plane hits the building. A flash explosion can be seen. In the background, the sun shines on a building and the blue sky can be seen behind it.
MadVR shows a very fine explosion. Sky and building elements are well differentiated.
Frame Adapt HDR is also no nakedness. However, the explosion seems a bit fuller. Sky and buildings in the background are also optimally differentiated.

3. Sully strolls through New York at night (Chapter 5). All around him are pictures and texts on all displays. The US flag shines in beautiful blue and red.
MadVR shows almost all the details here. The picture is crisp. Only the "Mitsubishi" logo outshines white. As Sully heads for a side street, there is a shadow of a building far away in the darkness.
Frame Adapt HDR brings out the flacons (back left) from the advertising a bit more detailed. Even the red of the US flag lights up a bit fuller. The blue lettering in the background is a trace blue. The Mitsubishi logo is completely displayed. The picture is as bright as from madVR. As Sully turns off towards Nebenstraße, the shadow in the dark background turns out to be clear as a building. Here, Frame Adapt HDR performs much better with the same black level.

The Martian
Already the beginning scene is a real touchstone, because the film no HDR metadata are stored. You can see behind Mars the slowly rising sun, a few lens flare effects and the flight over the surface of Mars. Later, the actors will be added. In the control room, two scientists monitor the work on the surface of Mars.
MadVR shows a really rich black in space. Individual stars are clearly visible. As the sun emerges behind the planet, the picture really shines magnificently. The surface of Mars is shown crisp, dark contents have a lot of drawing. The control room is of course mapped. Neon lights shine, skin colors look natural.
Frame Adapt HDR can do a better job. The black space is comparably dark, but there are significantly more small stars to see, which also shine (teilise) a trace brighter. The red on Mars is a less colorful and darker elements have significantly more drawing. At madVR, it is no doubt that details in black are drunk here. The control room also looks natural via Frame Adapt HDR. However, with Frame Adapt HDR, the hair of the scientist has more drawing. For the neon lights seem a bit darker.


Tomb Raider
Lara Croft is looking for her father. There is a lot of action and very warm filtered colors. Panoramic shots are crisp.
madVR also leaves a very good impression here. Of course, the colors look natural, the panorama shot of Hong Kong shows some small windows crisp. Unfortunately, there were repeated slight picture shakes in pans and turbulent scenes. When Lara signs the contract, a hoodie and a leather jacket run into each other in the shade. There is a little missing the tracing.
Frame Adapt HDR makes the colors seem a bit stronger. The panoramic view of Hong Kong looks similar. After repeated switching back and forth but shows that madVR still a touch appears sharper. If this was adjusted via the focus controller in Panasonic, this leads to slight double contours (white edges on high-contrast edges). Image jerking never occurred with the combination of Panasonic DP-UB9004 and JVC DLA-N7 with Frame Adapt HDR. Everything is reproduced very cleanly. Also, the shadow area in the contract signature is visibly better drawn. Hooded polo and leather jacket feature Frame Adapt HDR for all the details.

First conclusion:
The differences are extremely low at a very high level. Without direct A / B comparison, each of these films seems very natural.
It is noticeable that Frame Adapt HDR produces more drawing in both light and dark scenes, with the same black and identical maximum brightness. Moreover, the colors are a bit lighter and fuller.
Anyone who owns madVR can continue to use software and media PC on the JVC DLA-N7. If you're considering a new acquisition, you can opt for a lower-priced 4K Blu-ray player. With Frame Adapt HDR, any HDR-10 content can be optimally projected in real time. The long ripple and readout times (about 20 minutes) of madVR are eliminated. With Frame Adapt HDR, 4K Blu-ray movies as well as Netflix HDTV and Amazon Video HDR10 content can be played - virtually plug & play."


Pros and cons
+ minimal better sharpness with madVR
+ clearly visible better throughput with Frame Adapt HDR in bright and dark scenes with the same black level and maximum brightness
+ Somewhat brighter and brighter colors via Frame Adapt HDR

http://www.hifi-forum.de/viewthread-94-15753-14.html

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 09, 2019, 23:00
Exciting times ahead for me...I'm doing the update now as we speak. I will report with more findings and see if it is indeed that good. The fact that it is able to anlayze frame-by-frame and scene-by-scene w/o the need to rely on static meta-data is a huge upgrade!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 09, 2019, 23:10
Update completed. I will be doing more testing this weekend and do a calibration one more time.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191009/cb78ab17f366a67fcf7bfafe18678f36.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191009/9d2b17eff0b101f6f9762a386a4d2b16.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191009/1766eb8bdc0b81aedbb6e27238c1a615.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191009/aabf5cbcf118e24afa774afb2a4a7100.jpg)


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Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 09, 2019, 23:14
Updating is a breeze. Took about 18mins.

Quick impression. Start up time seems a tad faster now. I will see whether the “iris pumping” which resulted in “yellowing” of white text/object against black/darker background has been improved with this latest iteration of the firmware.



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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ronildoq on October 10, 2019, 08:24
What a fantastic “free” upgrade from JVC, looking forward to your feedbacks
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 11, 2019, 09:13
Without saying too much...let the screenshots speak at this point. Pay attention to the details of the cloud (i.e. specular highlights) and the differences in color gradation (WCG) for the 2 different HDR processing modes - i.e. normal HDR (PQ) and the "new" Adaptive Frame HDR.

Frame Adapt HDR (On)
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/frame_adapt_hdr.JPG)

Normal HDR10 (HDR PQ On)
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/hdr_PQ.JPG)

Frame Adapt HDR (On) - Cloud at close-up
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/frame_adapt_hdr_cloud.JPG)

Normal HDR10 (HDR PQ On) - Cloud at close-up
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/hdr_PQ_cloud.JPG)

Frame Adapt HDR (On) - With Cinema Filter set to "Normal"
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/frame_adapt_hdr_normal_filter.JPG)

Frame Adapt HDR (On) - With Cinema Filter set to "Wide" (P3 colors)
(http://xtremeplace.ddns.net/images/misc/jvc_n7/frame_adapt_hdr_wide_filter.JPG)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 11, 2019, 09:16
Interestingly, the Adaptive Frame HDR processing mode disallowed JVC's very own calibration s/w from performing any kind of calibration. Is this a bug or intentional...Hmmm...

More testing to come...

- Playback some 4K UHD titles (physical disc)
- Playback using with and without Panny's HDR Optimizer (Kris Deering recommends to drop double processing - meaning use one or the other but not both)
- Playback 4K mkv files (with and without static metadata - MaxCLL/MaxFALL)
- Any difference between Frame-by-Frame and Scene-by-Scene - cursory checks shows almost negligible difference based on my 30 mins playback of the Samsung 4K footages
- Further testing required to see any "yellowing" from the "Iris-pumping" (need more testing at this point)

Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 11, 2019, 14:47
I'm happy to report that the "yellowing" issue has been resolved with this latest firmware. Thumbs up to JVC for nailing it!
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: ralfale on October 11, 2019, 15:04
Really excited! This projector just gets better n better! Wonder what the next firmware update will bring ;)
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: tsammyc on October 12, 2019, 20:49
The normal HDR colors look more natural though.... Might be the camera
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 13, 2019, 07:49
The normal HDR colors look more natural though.... Might be the camera

I’m using an iPhone XS Max to shoot and the image has been compressed to optimise for both loading and web viewing. Hence it is not the true representation of how good the HDR image looks. I will try to take some time later today to watch some 4K UHD titles to make some meaningful comparisons with and without the Frame Adapt HDR.


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Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 13, 2019, 13:48
@Jag - Still on the fence about it? Frankly I think it is a good time to upgrade your ageing Sony Projector to one of the new JVC N series now. I can safely say that it is the best all-rounder HT projector for 2019. Get back that killer blacks and contrast that you've been missing all these times.
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: Jag on October 13, 2019, 14:00
I've been waiting for soooooooo long that the newer 2020 models are just round the corner. My Sony 55ES is still my workhorse and I still have a BNIB lamp for it.

I'm wondering what JVC has for 2020.....
Title: Re: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 13, 2019, 14:55
I've been waiting for soooooooo long that the newer 2020 models are just round the corner. My Sony 55ES is still my workhorse and I still have a BNIB lamp for it.

I'm wondering what JVC has for 2020.....

Not sure...but definitely waiting for the laser hybrid to become more affordable in the mainstream market. Judging from the past few years - especially on the Optoma UHZ65 with laser light source and within the $6K range. We can expect a more affordable laser based native 4K projector within the next 2 yrs...maybe not next year at the CES in Jan/Feb 2020 but likely in the following year. Combine this "new" Dynamic tone Mapping feature that they called "Frame Adpative HDR" with a laser light source...the only challenge JVC will be facing going the laser route is to have the technical know-how on how to balance black levels and APL scenes...Laser slight source is no joke and especially hard to "tame" in low APL scenes...as it may inevitably raise the black floors which robs us of that "JVC" black levels.

We shall see...but STILL, laser light source for a true 4K native HT projector is still the way to watch HDR content. :)
Title: Official Thread: JVC N Series Native 4K Projectors
Post by: desray on October 14, 2019, 06:30
Watched the first few minutes of Thor Ragnorak which I perceive to have greater highlights and details but marred by the lack of static metadata for JVC projector to work wonders. As you see from the pic below. There is no MaxCLL and MaxFALL. Hence; there is no tone mapping been applied.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/4d4a9c70cb3b8e301f24a0de377c40d7.jpg)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/03a1727836a67bd81dcf9fbe02434656.jpg)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/3ad99417f5bfc9da91b25224a415efd7.jpg)


(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/4f640d51f98b189494b8a7bf56971dee.jpg)

With Frame Adapt HDR (Off)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/c746a3ea40eaf3aec1ae239471588ac7.jpg)


With Frame Adapt HDR (On)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/5e25d67514adda9ee0d09b50c0ae1910.jpg)

With Frame Adapt HDR (On)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/5cf43e135dcc97d9d8b0e86967633c8b.jpg)


Without Frame Adapt HDR (Off)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191013/7b02eaea141a94138479e7e9dbbb1190.jpg)

Noticed the whole image becomes brighter with better skin tones and hues with Frame Adapt HDR feature turned on and set to High setting.

Pardon the soft iPhone images due to compression.

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