XtremePlace Forum

AV Galaxy => Planet Audio => Topic started by: jelt2359 on March 27, 2017, 18:46

Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on March 27, 2017, 18:46
Can't really find a thread for this but I know that there are many local supporters so thought I'd open a thread.

Heard the Blu2+ Dave combi at Canjam and it was incredible. Just came out of the Smyth realiser's 11.1 channel demo, and this- out of headphones!- was just as immersive, expansive and real.

The Hugo2 also sounded very nice- the filters really made a surprisingly big impact on the sound.

What do other owners think?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on April 01, 2017, 07:02
Quite a few other Chord threads actually… (including some you've posted in :P)

http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=240397.0 (http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=240397.0)

http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=188259.0 (http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=188259.0)

http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=220028.0 (http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=220028.0)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: BlurRhino on April 01, 2017, 08:38
Though some folks have been using chord products in hifi setup but they are still primarily headfi stuff.. and headfi stuff somehow don't generate much discussion here in xtremeplace, other than the one and only headfi appreciation thread. :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on April 01, 2017, 09:59
Yes the Hugo, Mojo and Poly are. But I actually think the Dave sounds even better on speakers than on headfi setups! If you haven't tried it, the soundstaging is really something awesome to behold, especially with great imaging speakers!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: dXter on April 01, 2017, 23:25
2qute is missing. I am using 2qute as stereo dac. Loving the chord sound.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: plasmasiao on April 02, 2017, 15:06
2qute is missing. I am using 2qute as stereo dac. Loving the chord sound.
How's 2qute compared to similarly priced DACs like Benchmark, Mytek,Yulong, any bros have experience to share?TIA
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on April 02, 2017, 15:22
With Chord.... resale value is so bad... i simply wont buy after a bad experience selling QuteHD dac.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on April 02, 2017, 17:18
With Chord.... resale value is so bad... i simply wont buy after a bad experience selling QuteHD dac.

i've not owned the QuteHD before but I did own the original Hugo. I bought it for 1.9K in April 2015 & managed to sell it for 1.7K in March last year. i wouldn't say that the resale value for Chord products are bad :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: dXter on April 02, 2017, 22:02
How's 2qute compared to similarly priced DACs like Benchmark, Mytek,Yulong, any bros have experience to share?TIA

Yulong is cheaper and is also a headphone amp, pre-amp and comes with balanced out. imo, the 2qute does beat it comfortably as a dac (retrieval of detail, and speed => all those microdetails). I still use the yulong da8 in my pc rig. the 2qute is with the main stereo rig.

With Chord.... resale value is so bad... i simply wont buy after a bad experience selling QuteHD dac.

dj, I think it's the qutehd itself ba. chord liked to half-baked their usb input. that change as hugo came out. Although I think most dac resale values dropped significantly if some critical tech is introduced.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on April 03, 2017, 09:03
yeah, maybe its just me.  ;D ;D ;D the buyer for my QuteHD was nasty. that was when the resale market was still good. now most buyers qoute thousands hot cash take it or get stuck with it.  :(
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on April 03, 2017, 11:09
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=249718.0;topicseen

clock starts now.  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on April 04, 2017, 23:50
surprise. thread no more... sold?  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on April 09, 2017, 19:01
Hello
I have owned a Chord Hugo for a year , and used it with HD800 , and HD650 (as a headphone amp)
Then I used it as a DAC , feeding my headphone system (Violectric v281 , Auralic Aries Femto , with Coax ou USB out to the Chord) : EXCELLENT
I tried the Hugo in my main system : WOW , for such a small piece of Kit
Verdict
SUPERB DAC , and unfortunately not suited to my taste for the HD800

Then , I had the chance to listen to the DAVE
Saved some money , and bought it for my main system
I guess that this is the last dac I'll ever have
It's PHENOMENAL .. natural , foot tapping , good bass , no harsh treble , and exceptional sound stage
You really know all this , when you take it out of your system

BUT it's either you like the chord sound or not

Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on April 23, 2017, 13:44
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=250840.0

Who the hell is eng siang? Tell him eat it lah.  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Saycheese78 on April 23, 2017, 14:32
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=250840.0

Who the hell is eng siang? Tell him eat it lah.  ;D

After Eng Siang eat it, another brother will complain ganna open box unit. No end.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: supabayes on April 23, 2017, 15:11
After Eng Siang eat it, another brother will complain ganna open box unit. No end.
Open box then can give more discount lah.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: silencer13 on April 23, 2017, 15:40
...
...
...
I guess that this is the last dac I'll ever have
It's PHENOMENAL .. natural , foot tapping , good bass , no harsh treble , and exceptional sound stage
You really know all this , when you take it out of your system
...
...

Hehe! unfortunately, in the world of DAC, it won't ever be the "last DAC you'll ever have".
The tech moves so fast, it'll be obsolete in a few years and you'll be looking at a new one soon after.  ;D  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on April 23, 2017, 15:50
Hehe! unfortunately, in the world of DAC, it won't ever be the "last DAC you'll ever have".
The tech moves so fast, it'll be obsolete in a few years and you'll be looking at a new one soon after.  ;D  ;D
Bro u not correct but Kan correct.
Yes tech move so kin your product obsolete within mths dah....
But impt enjoy the music....dah... Huat ah.

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on April 23, 2017, 17:22
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=250840.0

Who the hell is eng siang? Tell him eat it lah.  ;D

Eng siang = AVone
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on April 23, 2017, 18:15
Chey. Then buyer only buy 1 Dave. Why does he need to lose $$$$$ buying  a 2nd set. Dun understand
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on April 23, 2017, 20:08
Any bros here hv the Hugo2 or tried before.  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on April 24, 2017, 06:31
Any bros here hv the Hugo2 or tried before.  ;D

I think the retail units haven't reach our shores yet.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on May 02, 2017, 23:53
Dave owners who use it with an external amp- if you've ever used it with headphones from its hp out directly and set crossfeed, that crossfeed setting remains even after you unplug the headphone from the hp out.

Rob Watts uses crossfeed 1 in this way with his external speaker amps, although I also know of people who accidentally set crossfeed in this way and were wondering why their speakers sounded strange.

I personally now use crossfeed 3 with all my external headphone amps being fed by the Dave :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on May 03, 2017, 16:40
Dave owners who use it with an external amp- if you've ever used it with headphones from its hp out directly and set crossfeed, that crossfeed setting remains even after you unplug the headphone from the hp out.

Rob Watts uses crossfeed 1 in this way with his external speaker amps, although I also know of people who accidentally set crossfeed in this way and were wondering why their speakers sounded strange.

I personally now use crossfeed 3 with all my external headphone amps being fed by the Dave :)

i use cross-feed 3 setting straight out of the headphone out of the DAVE too and it sounds pretty good to my ears :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on May 03, 2017, 17:00
i use cross-feed 3 setting straight out of the headphone out of the DAVE too and it sounds pretty good to my ears :)

Yes that was always an option- the new thing here is that I did not know that this setting remains even after you unplug the headphones. So now I've been trying it with all my external headamps too :D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on May 03, 2017, 19:11
didn't like using crossfeed since hugo, and didn't use it in dave also.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on May 04, 2017, 22:51
For those using the DAVE in a 2-channel system, do you run it direct into a power amp (by passing the pre amp)? 

If you run direct, have you tried with and without pre amps?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 05, 2017, 09:48
...
Rob Watts uses crossfeed 1 in this way with his external speaker amps, although I also know of people who accidentally set crossfeed in this way and were wondering why their speakers sounded strange.
...

I wonder why Rob would want to do that? To each his own, but… I can’t imagine why he'd want to further mix the channels with speakers in a room beyond how the artist(s) intended their music to be heard. :P


For those using the DAVE in a 2-channel system, do you run it direct into a power amp (by passing the pre amp)? 

If you run direct, have you tried with and without pre amps?

If you don't get any response, I'll let you know in a couple of weeks... (a buddy promised to bring his DAVE to my place for a shootout ;))
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on May 05, 2017, 10:04
I used the DAVE direct to the BHK Stereo. As you'd expect there is more transparency and greater detail vs putting my Audio Research Ref 5SE in the chain - but I preferred using the DAVE thru the Ref5SE - because there was better sense of space in the soundstage - in terms of depth and width.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on May 05, 2017, 12:05
For those using the DAVE in a 2-channel system, do you run it direct into a power amp (by passing the pre amp)? 

If you run direct, have you tried with and without pre amps?

Yes. Tested with a few different preamps, including one that goes for 15K$USD. The Chord Dave direct (using the inbuilt digital pre) was better.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on May 05, 2017, 12:06
I wonder why Rob would want to do that? To each his own, but… I can’t imagine why he'd want to further mix the channels with speakers in a room beyond how the artist(s) intended their music to be heard. :P


If you don't get any response, I'll let you know in a couple of weeks... (a buddy promised to bring his DAVE to my place for a shootout ;))

He says it gives him more depth. I imagine it's very dependent on the specific speakers and room.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on May 05, 2017, 12:59

If you don't get any response, I'll let you know in a couple of weeks... (a buddy promised to bring his DAVE to my place for a shootout ;))

Look forward to the comments. 

I used the DAVE direct to the BHK Stereo. As you'd expect there is more transparency and greater detail vs putting my Audio Research Ref 5SE in the chain - but I preferred using the DAVE thru the Ref5SE - because there was better sense of space in the soundstage - in terms of depth and width.

Thanks.  Would you say that the dynamics, drive and body/warmth was better too? 

Yes. Tested with a few different preamps, including one that goes for 15K$USD. The Chord Dave direct (using the inbuilt digital pre) was better.

Would you mind elaborating on the areas which were better when running the DAVE direct? Thanks.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 12, 2017, 22:19
Couple of excellent presentations from the Chord guys on Hugo2, Blu Mk.2, and Poly … (the Mandarin translator is pretty annoying though, but easy to fast forward ;D). The Blu Mk.2 M Scaler section is especially interesting.

http://www.youtube.com/v/2mFYHrEILYQ&fs=1

http://www.youtube.com/v/LxYnV5rh8vc&fs=1

http://www.youtube.com/v/JZ0JodpvYxk&fs=1
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on May 13, 2017, 11:32
the Blu MkII is some kind of wonderful - especially when it is paired with the DAVE. i had a chance to demo this combo during the recent CanJam and I was struck by how vibrant, immediate and "in your face" my music was. this is stuff that I've been listening to since 1991 and it was quite a revelation to me. i can see myself getting the Blu MkII in the near future. to me, it's definitely much more than just a glorified CD player. it should be available for demo in our local shops soon so i'd urge those of you interested to simply give it a try. you may be pleasantly surprised ☺️

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 15, 2017, 23:42
DAVE is in da’House! Buddy just dropped it by for a couple of weeks ;D… Will post a review.

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/Dave_zpserlcb5og.jpg~original)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on May 16, 2017, 00:24
$13k sitting there. enjoy.  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on May 16, 2017, 02:17
$13k sitting there. enjoy.  ;D

Is that the street price?  AV1's pricing is...
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: karhoul on May 16, 2017, 14:46
I guess every resellers have their own walk-in promo mechanics ;D

Hugo2 casework in production.  ;D
https://www.facebook.com/chordelectronics/videos/1060362084063812/
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on May 16, 2017, 20:38
DAVE is in da’House! Buddy just dropped it by for a couple of weeks ;D… Will post a review.

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/Dave_zpserlcb5og.jpg~original)

This one chin swee ah :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on May 17, 2017, 14:20
Is that the street price?  AV1's pricing is...

on the secondary market, the cheapest I've seen is SGD11,500 - i think there's one for sale on Carousell.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on May 17, 2017, 17:18
on the secondary market, the cheapest I've seen is SGD11,500 - i think there's one for sale on Carousell.

sold by the same person related to the one sold here.  :-X
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 17, 2017, 19:22
This one chin swee ah :)

No denying that, it's a real cutie! ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on May 19, 2017, 09:56
(http://i754.photobucket.com/albums/xx183/maro73/All%20dacs%20USB_zpstom4z30b.png) (http://s754.photobucket.com/user/maro73/media/All%20dacs%20USB_zpstom4z30b.png.html)

Part of this is on the Melco thread

The purpose of the testing was
1. To know whether my spendings were out of purpose
2. Share my experience and have your opinion
3. In no  case , i have some vested in the stuffs here , neither am I a reviewer

Tracks used for testing (CD tracks ripped via dbpoweramp to Flac uncompressed)
1. Adele : Set fire in the rain
2. Massive attack : Blue line (Bass)
3. Gossip : Heavy cross
4. Rodrigo y Gabriela : Live in Japan : Take five
5. Ella & Louis : April in Paris
6. Sia : Chandelier (Piano version)
7. Hugh Masakela : Stimela : Drums , fine recording
8. Nils Lofgren : Keith don’t go
9. Daft Punk : Giorgio Moroder

Conclusions of the DAC shootout
This is just for the sake of comparing
The DAVE is still a unbeatable for my ears , there's nothing to criticise about it
Fun , smooth detailed , instrument separation second to none

The DDDAC is the DAC of a great versatility , especially sounding full with the Sowter
The BC DAC 3.7 is an upgrade , and sad to say that it's not to my taste . It is powered with the LNS , and yelds to some nice music , good soundstage (bettering the DDDAC) ...but there is something missing
However , the BC Dac 3.7 sounds in a different league to the Eximus in terms of soundstage and detail
I can easily live with both the Eximus and the BC , the former being a good headphone amplifier (and good pre amp)

Overall
The DAVE is my favorite DAC today , music really really suits my taste when delivered via AES EBU (Tested with Auralic Aries , needed to be tested with the Lumin U1)
The DDDAC is a fantastic value for money , highly capable , without any competitor at 6000 euros




Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Ratatouille on May 19, 2017, 11:37
"lucky" av1 cannot sell 100 of these in SG. boss will have suddenly strike toto.
price is nowhere near the average commoner, still if any millionaire in SG were to read this. just get the Dave. its a top notch DAC.
nevertheless an excellent personal review.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: RAYRAY on May 20, 2017, 12:30
Hi Andrew, awaits for your Dave review and thanks in advance.

DAVE is in da’House! Buddy just dropped it by for a couple of weeks ;D… Will post a review.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 27, 2017, 22:48
Spent roughly the last 2 weeks listening to the Chord DAVE on and off compared to my home reference DAC, here’s my take;

Part 1 of 3

The BURNING QUESTION
On the back of my extremely positive experience with the Chord Mojo (my constant travel buddy), there was one burning question that really drove me to want to test out DAVE; How does it sound and is it a “giant killer” against the likes of my dCS Vivaldi DAC? So, as you read on, please keep in mind this is really a comparative review against arguably the top dog... So, YMMV ;D

On its own DAVE sounds simply fantastic! In direct A-B comparisons against my dCS though, differences are quite readily audible. DAVE doesn’t sound as top-to-bottom neutral as the dCS does; the bottom end is very robust and well nuanced, but it’s mid-range seems slightly accentuated - which isn’t necessarily a bad thing - some highly compressed pop/rock tracks arguably sound more palatable/more musical through DAVE than the dCS. “Replica” and a couple of other tracks on The xx’s “I See You” (Young Turks, 96/24) for example actually sound better through DAVE (in somewhat the same way some pop & rock tracks sound better over your car stereo than it does in your home reference kits).

The top-end on good recordings is missing some of the “air” that often surrounds the singing and instruments, especially around female vocals, strings, and cymbals/high-hats. Very noticeable on Keb’ Mo’s excellent “Keb’ Mo’” (Epic, DSD64), and then I couldn’t not notice it on more and more well recorded high-rez tracks. Initially it was a little tricky to tell if the "air" via the dCS is just HF noise, but on closer listen, especially the "zing" around cymbals and plucked strings, there's fine details that are missing on DAVE, giving it a slight more "though-a-plane-of-glass" rather than "you’re-there-live" sonics of the dCS. In fact, I recognise this exact sonic signature on the Mojo as well (mentioned in my Mojo review elsewhere on X’Place) where the effect is more pronounced. It sounds like the digital stream is ever-so-slightly “over processed”, or where the digital interconnect cable is straddling a power-cord and the bitstream is losing some of its most delicate nuances. That said, had my listening comparisons been before my Vivaldi 2.0 upgrade, I suspect they'd be neck and neck in top-end transparency. Stereophile’s measurements of the two - dCS Vivaldi (https://www.stereophile.com/content/dcs-vivaldi-digital-playback-system-measurements), Chord DAVE (https://www.stereophile.com/content/chord-electronics-dave-da-processor-measurements) - doesn’t provide any clues. If anything, DAVE seems to measure almost better, especially when compared to the dCS with Filter 5 which is what I use most times (minimum phase, no pre-ringing, early roll-off).

Some female vocals on PCM tracks on DAVE seem to take on a slightly nasally tone compared to the dCS - Emilie-Claire Barlow “The Very Thought of You” (Naxos DXD) for example… I think maybe that comes with the perceived pronounced mid-range. In John Atkinson’s DAVE review he found Piano tracks to sound great, I on the other hand found them to sound a little wooly, less realistic than via the dCS - Bill Evan’s excellent “Live at Art D'Lugoff's Top of the Gate” and “Some Other Time” (Naxos, DSD128) albums for example. Also, Brass instruments occasionally seem to lack a bit of bite (even in PCM) - like on a couple tracks off of Jazz at the Pawn Shop (Naxos, DXD), despite DAVE having source material bitrate "advantage" in a few instances where I wasn't quite comparing apples-to-apples; for example, Bill Evans “Some Other Time”;  on the dCS @ DSD128 versus DSD256 on DAVE. The Vivaldi still pulls ahead slightly.

Like most people seem to suggest, DAVE does exceptionally well with redbook tracks (but then so does dCS actually). Still, it surprised me the couple of times when I actually preferred redbook albums played back via DAVE than dCS. Michael Kiwanuka "Love & Hate" (Tidal redbook stream), is just fantastic (repetitive lyrics aside). As was Tove Lo's "Lady Wood" (Tidal redbook stream), and Bob Moses "Days Gone By" (Tidal redbook stream) with its thumping bass and hypnotic rhythms. DAVE's got serious PRAT!

Keep in mind however, the scale of the differences I’m describing above between DAVE and the Vivaldi DAC are actually relatively small (though readily audible in direct side-by-side comparisons). No doubt I’m sonically biased, being too accustomed to listening with a dedicated upsampler with minimum-phase impulse response filters etc., I think if I’d listened to DAVE in complete isolation or over a prolonged period, it’d be impossible to detect any real “deficiencies”! ;)

Testing DAVE’s Headphone output, I only listened via a couple of my IEMs. As a headphone system/Amp, I think DAVE is only just ok, nothing special (but I'm not really a headphone guy anyway). My impression is that headphone listening via DAVE is likely better when it's coupled with a proper dedicated balanced headphone Amp, but it could get tricky … (read on in the technical bits).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 27, 2017, 22:49
Part 2 of 3

TECHNICAL BITS
Cosmetically, I think DAVE looks gorgeous, compact, yet with the right heft, a really nice design. Feature wise DAVE is really minimalist, very rudimentary, which can be both good or bad, but it certainly doesn’t have anywhere near the flexibility of the dCS system. In this day and age, the lack of an Ethernet port for streaming is a big disappointment... though understandable if they couldn't make it sound as good if it corporates built-in Ethernet (just like they couldn't incorporate the "M Scaler" that's in Blu Mk II). Maybe Chord will rectify this with a native Ethernet interface on the Davina - the upcoming reference class ADC - perhaps. I also have to wonder about the choice of not including an external reference clock port, especially considering the other components that are intended to be interconnected to DAVE; relying solely on PLLs for bitstream clock recovery can't be a good idea in a Blu-DAVE-Davina configuration?

As it stands though, DAVE performs quite well with sources connected over its galvanically isolated USB input. Pretty much all of my listening impressions where with the Melco N1A and MacBook Pro as USB sources, and with an Intona US isolator in-between; subjectively sounded a little better, but I haven’t had time to take any measurements with/without the Intona. I didn’t do any listening to DAVE with S/PDIF inputs, nor fed streams from my dCS Upsampler over dual-AES interfaces to DAVE for that matter; which will be very interesting - imagine dedicated Upsampling with minimum-phase digital filtering (including MQA hardware decoding) coupled to DAVE’s WTA reconstruction filter…;D (Could it compete with Blu Mk II’s M-Scaler? TBD)

I was slight shocked when I looked at DAVE's USB configuration data through Apple's USB Prober utility; the serial number of the unit was identical to the unit John Atkinson reviewed in Stereophile - “413-001”!! O). Turns out the actual serial number affixed to the bottom of the unit is quite different ;D. Clearly Chord doesn’t bother to burn the correct individual serial number into the USB port data (neither does dCS for that matter).
(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/USB%20Probe%20shot_zpstzggnsih.png~original)
The one thing that I don’t like about DAVE is its rather high full-scale output voltage. Specs wise DAVE puts out 3V (unbalanced) / 6V (balanced), RMS. JA/Stereophile measured it way higher; 4.37V (unbalanced) / 8.75V (balanced) @ 1kHz, "0dB" volume setting on DAVE - that's slightly more than double the common 2V line-level voltage. Most Amps have input sensitivity between 1V-2V. The net effect of this will be system matching trickiness. If connecting DAVE directly to a stereo or headphone Amp ("Digital-Pre” mode on DAVE), you’ll end up having to listen to music with DAVE’s digital volume turned down low. Or if connecting to a Pre-Amp with DAVE in “DAC mode” (fixed full-scale output), then having to turn the Pre-Amp’s volume control closer to its maximum attenuation. The Mojo has the same issue (as documented in JA/Stereophile’s Mojo measurement (https://www.stereophile.com/content/chord-electronics-mojo-da-headphone-amplifier-measurements) back in Jan’16), and I believe likewise Hugo. As a comparison, the dCS Vivaldi DAC has 4 configurable full-scale output voltage level settings; 0.2V, 0.6V, 2V, or 6V! So, it’s easy to mix and match the dCS with Pre-Amps and Amps of varying sensitivity and gain.

Fortunately, DAVE’s volume control appears to have little negative sonic impact - I believe the implementation is an evolution of the Hugo’s architecture; via a combination of the FPGA WTA filter core, the cross-feed DSP engine, and the output noise shapers/dithering - so, it’s not traditional binary truncation based, i.e. it doesn’t suffer from decreasing resolution with decreasing volume …  Thus, not a show-stopper, but still, it requires “special care” or you risk impacting sonics, or even worse, over-driving your Amps.

I tested DAVE directly into both of my Amps; a stereo amp, and a pair of SET monoblocks; I no longer have any analogue Pre-Amp in my system. My SET monoblocks (1V sensitivity, unbalanced) in fact has individual passive attenuation controls, so I was able to listen to DAVE in “DAC mode” (fixed full-scale) while I controlled listening volume directly on the monoblocks - this configuration superb sonics. For my stereo Amp (1.3V sensitivity, balanced), I added a pair of passive in-line 20dB attenuation pads to DAVE’s balanced outputs and set it to “Digital Pre” mode before connecting to the Amp. Even that wasn’t quite enough though, having to playback DAVE’s volume control at around -10 to -15dB range for my regular listening level, would have preferred to be in the -10 to -5dB range for good DSD recordings. Worst of all though, sonics was impacted with the attenuation pads in-place (wasn’t surprised, they’re crappy ones), so, not a good idea. A little surprised JA/Stereophile doesn't specifically mention this issue considering his review was based on DAVE in "Digital Pre" mode and connected directly to his Amp without any Pre-Amp in between. All of my listening test though were with my SET monoblocks and DAVE set to "DAC mode” fixed full-scale.

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/XLR%20attentuation%20pads_zpstrsixytb.png~original)


DAVE has 2 specific FPGA configuration modes - “PCM Plus” and “DSD Plus” for dealing natively with PCM or DSD streams. Switching between modes is manual, "cumbersome", and takes at least 20 seconds during which time audio output is automatically muted. I’m not sure why the switching couldn’t be made automatic? Clearly DAVE can recognise the varying input streams, including DoP.  DSD material played in DSD+ mode clearly sounded the best IMHO; Pink Floyd DSOTM (EMI SACD/DSD64 rip) was simply fantastic. I’m not sure if thats just a manifestation of my DSD sonic biases ;D.

While I actually like DAVE’s minimalist style, it doesn’t make for good usability scores. Speaking of which, especially annoying is the screen blinks when configuration changes are made. DAVE’s screen blinks once each time anything is changed, including increasing it’s volume control ! There are report online of DAVE's screen blinking nonstop under some circumstances of the incoming transport signal.

http://www.youtube.com/v/j126Tse5-1Q&fs=1

The remote-control that comes with DAVE does it’s job, but its a shockingly simplistic piece of plastic, hardly worthy of a S$10K DAC. IMHO, they should have a proper Remote orderable separately for people who want one (maybe they do, I haven’t checked if the proper remote that comes with Blu Mk.ii is separately orderable).

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/Chord%20DAVE%20Remote_zpslpht3ksp.png~original)

GLITCHES
Just once, when I connected my MacBook Pro to DAVE, with both units powered on, it triggered a logout on my Mac!! Strange!

Occasionally if I switch between DSD+ and PCM+ mode with music continuing to stream, after the unit has come out of Mute (i.e. mode change complete), the audio is garbled. I needed to stop the playing track, allow DAVE to blink, and then re-start the track for proper output to resume.

With some DSD256 tracks… there’s a stutter in the first 2-3 seconds of the start of the track, but I only experienced this on Jazz At The Pawnshop “Late Night” (Naxos, DSD256), no issue with Bill Evans “Some Other Time” (Naxos, DSD256).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 27, 2017, 22:50
Part 3 of 3

FINAL VERDICT
Honestly, this is about the best DAC I’ve heard in a long time (since after my dCS Vivaldi DAC from 2013!). I’m not sure if it matches most people’s sonic palate, but if excellent sound quality and musicality are your only concerns, then the Chord DAVE is a no brainer! It doesn't feature many bells & whistles, but it kind of gets everything right sonically. Unsurprisingly perhaps, it reminds of me of my Linn Sondek CD player ... focuses the listener on the music, without distraction. A very British piece of electronics in that way.

Overall, DAVE's just lacking a bit of sonic finesse in comparison to the Vivaldi DAC, but on its own, against pretty much every subjective sonic attribute - transparency, extension, soundstage, 3-dimensionality, etc., and especially musicality, I think DAVE does one helluva job! At about just 30% of the price of the dCS DAC unit (US$ MSRP), DAVE is a steal! If you’re the sort that spends S$2-4K on the next fashionable DAC that comes along every 18months or so, or thinking of buying some other DAC south of S$8K, don’t. I'm pretty sure sonically DAVE blows those machines away, so, save up a little more and get this state-of-the-art machine and stick with it for the long haul, you'll likely end up saving money, time, and effort. As it turns out my buddy's off-loading his unit (he’s moving up to dCS!)... and I’ve just acquired his DAVE, at a steal, for my bedroom system! ;D, can't give it any higher a praise. A highly recommended buy obviously!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on May 27, 2017, 23:26
Nice review, but surprise that you got different remote than what i have, do you have the HF filter on and crossfeed set to 0?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Tiktokape on May 27, 2017, 23:47
Thanks for the insights over DAVE! In any case  that you decide to get Blu2, do share further. I think the next up task for you should be Linn Katalyst DAC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on May 28, 2017, 00:42
Tks for the in depth review andrewC.

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 28, 2017, 08:26
Nice review, but surprise that you got different remote than what i have, do you have the HF filter on and crossfeed set to 0?

Ironically, high-Rez tracks sound better with the HF Filter On; overall musicality and dynamics seems better, but there was no difference in the perceived lack of “air” with the HF filter on or off… (bugged me a little, I was hoping with it off, I’d get back something at that very top). There was less of an impact on Redbook tracks with HF filter on or off… So I mostly just left it on.

Yup, crossfeed at zero… I don’t like the sound when set at any other level with my IEMs, it sounds holo and fake.

Interesting about the remote! Do you have a pic? My buddy’s DAVE was one of the earliest shipped units I believe…  could be they’re supplying new units with newer remotes? Last night I was researching the current 2nd-hand market price of DAVE when saw a unit on sale on Audiogon (https://www.audiogon.com/listings/da-converters-chord-electronics-ltd-dave-in-bitchin-black-w-acoustic-revive-tb-38h-2017-05-23-digital-98117-seattle-wa--2), has the same remote as mine.


Thanks for the insights over DAVE! In any case  that you decide to get Blu2, do share further. I think the next up task for you should be Linn Katalyst DAC


Nah… :P… been partial to Linn in the past, I’ve moved on since and won’t go back.


Tks for the in depth review andrewC.

You're welcome!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on May 28, 2017, 08:29
Go back office check my piggy bank whether hv enuf for Dave ha ha

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on May 28, 2017, 09:26
this is my, my is later badge.

(http://positive-feedback.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/2016-01-15_Chord-Dave_004.jpg)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 28, 2017, 19:24
this is my, my is later badge.
...

That's the remote that comes with Blu … Maybe they’re shipping all DAVEs with this now? Lucky you! :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 28, 2017, 19:28
I poked around a little more with the DAVE,

Part 4 of 3 (?)

FOLLOW-UP TECHNICAL BITS

I only just read the manual, they actually tell you to stop playing music before switching modes FPGA filter modes ;D… So, scratch that as a “glitch” in my part 2… must remember to RTFM before playing with stuff next time.
Quote
Before changing modes please stop music playback and mute your amplifier to allow the clocks to resynchronise and avoid incorrect playback.


HF Filter - I wanted to take a closer look at this; with it On, the filter kicks-in well beyond the audio band with the -3dB corner frequency somewhere between 50-60kHz (green trace). With it Off (red trace), the cut-off goes well beyond 80kHz before a rather steep dive. The HF Filter doesn’t immediately appear to have any impact on the audio band itself, albeit I’m not really using professional measuring kit. In any case, things generally sound better with HF Filter left On.

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/HF%20Fil%20On%20Off_zpsyyg9w8j4.png~original)

USB Galvanic isolation - I also wanted to see how well DAVE’s USB port was galvanically isolated by measuring a 1kHz tone with/without Intona.

EDIT:
I remeasured with and without the Intona isolator inline, and a 1kHz tone as well as a 19kHz tone. As it turns out, in both cases, there was virtually NO difference at all in the measured response (see coincidental green and red traces in the graph below). In other words, contrary to my earlier “findings”, there was in fact no difference with or without the Intona USB isolator, at least objectively (the previous graphs were an error in the FFT analysis windowing selection).

So, it does appear that DAVE’s USB galvanic isolation is doing it’s job!  That said, while well under the hearing threshold, DAVE does seem to generate odd-order harmonics (and some funky stuff at the HF Filter cut-off frequency).

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/WIth%20and%20without%20Intona%20remeasure_zpslvr2twtt.png~original)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on May 28, 2017, 20:35
Interesting,How u measure them? I'm interested how well those streamer with galvanic isolation do, would like to measure them.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on May 28, 2017, 21:24
Interesting,How u measure them? I'm interested how well those streamer with galvanic isolation do, would like to measure them.

ADC to digitize DAVE's analog output, and resulting .wav files reviewed on Adobe Audition :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on May 29, 2017, 07:02
this is my, my is later badge.

(http://positive-feedback.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/2016-01-15_Chord-Dave_004.jpg)

Yes, this is what I have too and I got mine last June.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on May 29, 2017, 16:26
i was told AV1 sold alot of Daves....  ;D good for them if its true.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: dXter on May 29, 2017, 17:33
Wish I can afford. ;D
Hope for 2nd hand ones. ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on May 29, 2017, 17:40
I ask av1 "chord Dave on sale liao and v hot" reply "no lei where u heard fr ah"

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on May 29, 2017, 17:42
Wish I can afford. ;D
Hope for 2nd hand ones. ;D
2nd hand 1/2 price?  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on June 03, 2017, 21:26
Hello
Thanks for the nice review of the Chord Dave
Highly professionnal review , and I totally agree with your findings
Regarding Intona , may be with the USB REGEN or W2S recovery it would be different , who knows
Thanks again for sharing
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2017, 15:12
Hello
Thanks for the nice review of the Chord Dave
Highly professionnal review , and I totally agree with your findings
Regarding Intona , may be with the USB REGEN or W2S recovery it would be different , who knows
Thanks again for sharing
Cheers

You're welcome  :)

On the issue of USB devices, in fact, since testing DAVE, I’ve had time to think about and further test this very point. IMHO, other such USB re-clockers/isolators like Uptone etc., are not going to make any difference.

Here’s why;

These devices do not change the actual USB bitstream; 1s remain as 1s and 0s remain as 0s. This can be proven objectively beyond any doubt thanks to MQA and it’s bitstream Authentication! All you need to do is test with/without any such USB device plugged in between Tidal/Audirvana+ and any MQA DAC like the Meridian Explorer2 DAC or AudioQuest Dragonfly. Play any MQA Authenticated track - if the Blue (or Green) “MQA Authenticated” light comes on, it’s bit perfect, no bits have been changed by these devices! Same thing goes for Ethernet cables or isolator devices, one can verify that the bitstream is being  delivered error-free using Roon and it’s RAAT protocol which imbeds checksums to verify bit perfect connectivity between the Computer and the DAC with or without these devices. So, we can objectively prove, for a fact, that these devices/cables don’t change bits! :)

These solutions also claim to provide re-clocking of the bitstream to ensure precise timing. However, once again this is quite unnecessary especially in the case of Asynchronous USB or Ethernet streams because these are packetised bitstreams that are asynchronous in nature, meaning they don’t rely on synchronous clocking signals to interpret bit states the way that say the S/PDIF signals on Transport and DAC requires a precise 44.1k/48k clock. Additionally, if the bits are being misinterpreted due to clocking/timing errors, the MQA decoder or Roon/RAAT will fail! So once again we can objectively validate that re-clocking is not required!

https://www.meridian-audio.com/en/products/dacs/usb-dacs/explorer/ (https://www.meridian-audio.com/en/products/dacs/usb-dacs/explorer/)
Quote
1x LED glows white for PCM, green to indicate MQA playback and blue to indicate MQA Studio playback. MQA indications will not show if the bitstream is altered in any way

Here’s an MQA Mastered track from 2L, “Mozart: Violin concerto in D major - Allegro (Marianne Thorsen / Trondheim Solistene)”. The Blue light on the Explorer2 signifies “MQA Studio Authenticated” perfectly unaltered bitstream between my Mac and the Meridian Explorer2.

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/With%20Intona%20Full%20MQA%20Decode_zpsrjar4qnd.jpg~original)  (http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/WIthOut%20Intona%20Full%20MQA%20Decode_zpsud8vpuzk.jpg~original)


However, these USB re-clockers/isolator devices do provide electrical clean-ups; lifting the bitstream signal’s current and voltage levels to full spec, and even more importantly, providing isolation of the USB power & ground between the source platform and DAC; which is the most important part as USB sources (e.g. Computers) are quite electrically “noisy” which could affect the sonic output of a DAC (showing up as distortion). Ethernet by default is a galvanically isolated interface, so ground noise impact is eliminated without adding anything. Which leaves just USB where electrical isolation becomes important.

If you read ComputerAudiophile reviews of these USB devices, some showcase cleaned-up bitstream (oscilloscope digital bitstream eye-patterns); problem is, they are quite irrelevant really because;
(1) whats more important is the bitstream interpretation by the DAC itself, and as explained above, MQA or RAAT can prove  bit perfect delivery with or without these devices! and
(2) the electrical noise flowing from the source to the DAC, and for that, galvanic isolation tackles the issue. With DAVE’s galvanically isolated USB port, this issue is measurably addressed, hence the zero measured difference with and without Intona, and unlikely to make a difference with others!

Here’s the bottom line — I’m not saying these devices don’t work, I’m saying these USB re-clockers/isolators only really work well in setups where the source/DAC power & grounding is inherently deficient to begin with. So, if someone experiences a “Wow!!!” difference, you know their setup is “less than ideal” in the first place and requires this kind of “fix”. For components like DAVE, where these issues are addressed in their design, these re-clockers/Isolators devices don’t bring any benefits ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 04, 2017, 15:56
Interesting, in CA there is group modified their computer, network switches and streamer with better clock to improve the SQ, especially for Romaz which have Dave for this setup. Lucky I'm not with SOTM product  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: durianlover88 on June 04, 2017, 19:26
I have tested Dave and lately Blu2 in my setup for coming to 2 months.....the ethernet isolation and Dave USB galvanic isolation though good, still not up to mark. '1 is 1, 0 is 0' there are more to it.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 04, 2017, 19:42
Wah... how the blu? So it work better with the uptime reclocker?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2017, 22:21
Interesting, in CA there is group modified their computer, network switches and streamer with better clock to improve the SQ, especially for Romaz which have Dave for this setup. Lucky I'm not with SOTM product  ;D

You know what they say... ;)

(http://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7c/41/d3/7c41d3872ec9516c81b6ac38f6673182.jpg)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 04, 2017, 22:35
Haha, that why must try   ::)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on June 04, 2017, 22:46
I have tested Dave and lately Blu2 in my setup for coming to 2 months.....the ethernet isolation and Dave USB galvanic isolation though good, still not up to mark. '1 is 1, 0 is 0' there are more to it.

Interesting.  Was not aware that you had moved on to DAVE/Blu 2.  More to your taste than the PS?

Rob Watts claims that the USB input is galvanically isolated but mentioned that its not 100% (somewhere in the head fi thread). Hence, USB isolation is not required. Yet, on his battery powered laptop source, the AQ Jitterbug (or two) has a positive effect.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: durianlover88 on June 04, 2017, 23:40
I think you get the gist of it....

Anyway, felt pain when I sold the Directstream DAC today....I thought I could at least hear the Huron firmware upgrade...

Not bought any DAC yet...the loaner was returned....still waiting see any voices or call to lead me to next one. I know I have to do something different to have another radical level up, but this time more prudent to make sure I sell first before I buy (house stacking up till no space)....and thinking very carefully this time the next step...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2017, 23:40

Interesting.  Was not aware that you had moved on to DAVE/Blu 2.  More to your taste than the PS?

Rob Watts claims that the USB input is galvanically isolated but mentioned that its not 100% (somewhere in the head fi thread). Hence, USB isolation is not required. Yet, on his battery powered laptop source, the AQ Jitterbug (or two) has a positive effect.

IIRC you’re referring to the post where Rob talks about the 2pf coupling capacitance on DAVE’s USB galvanic isolation, which has an impact when noise in the GHz range from AC powered Laptop stray into the USB port. i.e. deficiency in the setup, addressed via better source components like the Melco ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on June 05, 2017, 02:26
IIRC you’re referring to the post where Rob talks about the 2pf coupling capacitance on DAVE’s USB galvanic isolation, which has an impact when noise in the GHz range from AC powered Laptop stray into the USB port. i.e. deficiency in the setup, addressed via better source components like the Melco ;)

Yes, that's it. Remember reading it a while back.

romaz's adventures on CA are interesting but puzzling. The USB input on the DAVE is asynchronous. I can understand that better isolation, removal of noise, etc can help but better clocks prior to the USB input takes some understanding.

Then again, I don't believe he is using the Melco (which reportedly employs an NDK femto clock).  He is using a PC with bridged LAN ports - hmmm, sounds familiar but have no idea if the Melco uses bridged LAN ports - which he apparently has customised to employ the SOtM ultra clock.

On a side note, have you tried the Melco Series 2 with the dedicated USB output, and does it make a difference with the DAVE?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on June 05, 2017, 02:30
I think you get the gist of it....

Anyway, felt pain when I sold the Directstream DAC today....I thought I could at least hear the Huron firmware upgrade...

Not bought any DAC yet...the loaner was returned....still waiting see any voices or call to lead me to next one. I know I have to do something different to have another radical level up, but this time more prudent to make sure I sell first before I buy (house stacking up till no space)....and thinking very carefully this time the next step...

Oh... was wondering why the Aurender was put on the market.  Difficult to decide what to buy. More difficult to let go.

Didn't know that AV One did home loans.

Good luck with your search but afaik you tried a number of good ones before deciding on the PS.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: durianlover88 on June 05, 2017, 07:28
Nah....loaner was courtesy of a good Ansuz buddy....I wholly appreciate his kindness and generosity to let me test the Dave inside out, and along the way we learnt how much more it can be optimised.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Quest on June 05, 2017, 08:51
I think AV1 does do home trials with supervision, not really loans.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: kiat on June 05, 2017, 10:49
Anyway, felt pain when I sold the Directstream DAC today....I thought I could at least hear the Huron firmware upgrade...

Was very inspired by your posting on DirectStream, that trigger my evaluation on the same DAC.  What's the shortfall in the DAC that made you want to move on?  Especially now that new new firmware is coming in
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: durianlover88 on June 05, 2017, 11:56
Boy I was a bit distraught selling the Directstream yesterday, I hope the buyer did not see tears welling in my eyes....seriously I was wanting for Huron update to come a couple days back but it did not materialise. So when the offer come, there is no point to turn down as buyers are hard to come by. I am still awaiting the lucky buyers for my other items on sale...

In short, nothing wrong with the Directstream, they are perfectly fine and performing mightily. I questioned myself if I truly will sell it why not put into bedroom, but I also remind myself since I am trying to pursue a radical step change, I need to burn my bridge....this feeling I dunno if Bros here can understand...I am selling everything before the Grand Stereo and ASI Tango R Diamond speakers, and also upgrading to the latest Titanium Sound Application conditioner. It is 'unfortunate' Ansuz dealership change hands but I have to count my blessings.

Enough of off-topic....I apologise for the intrigue I had caused to Bros here...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: domho8 on June 05, 2017, 11:59
Boy I was a bit distraught selling the Directstream yesterday, I hope the buyer did not see tears welling in my eyes....seriously I was wanting for Huron update to come a couple days back but it did not materialise. So when the offer come, there is no point to turn down as buyers are hard to come by. I am still awaiting the lucky buyers for my other items on sale...

In short, nothing wrong with the Directstream, they are perfectly fine and performing mightily. I questioned myself if I truly will sell it why not put into bedroom, but I also remind myself since I am trying to pursue a radical step change, I need to burn my bridge....this feeling I dunno if Bros here can understand...I am selling everything before the Grand Stereo and ASI Tango R Diamond speakers, and also upgrading to the latest Titanium Sound Application conditioner. It is 'unfortunate' Ansuz dealership change hands but I have to count my blessings.

Enough of off-topic....I apologise for the intrigue I had caused to Bros here...
Wa bro your story touching ah 1 tear drop down fr eyes dah.
Bro lulian whatever u doing impt can make u more song can liao

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 09, 2017, 16:13
...
romaz's adventures on CA are interesting but puzzling. The USB input on the DAVE is asynchronous. I can understand that better isolation, removal of noise, etc can help but better clocks prior to the USB input takes some understanding.

Then again, I don't believe he is using the Melco (which reportedly employs an NDK femto clock).  He is using a PC with bridged LAN ports - hmmm, sounds familiar but have no idea if the Melco uses bridged LAN ports - which he apparently has customised to employ the SOtM ultra clock.

On a side note, have you tried the Melco Series 2 with the dedicated USB output, and does it make a difference with the DAVE?

Aside from Power, Grounding, and Noise isolation through these USB isolation devices, on the impact of re-clocking; within the digital domain, i.e. the packet data/the 1s & 0s, pretty much all of what these experimenters and “golden ears” claim can now be completely debunked objectively thanks to bitstreams nonrepudiation via embedded protocols like MQA, RAAT (Roon), NAA (HQPlayer), & RAVENNA (Merging). In fact, IIRC, even Rob Watts has posted multiple times that the bits are not changing with these external re-clockers for the USB interface. Here’s a post from Roon COO just yesterday on a very similar topic; https://community.roonlabs.com/t/sq-comparison-rock-vs-windows-os-on-roon/26747/21 (https://community.roonlabs.com/t/sq-comparison-rock-vs-windows-os-on-roon/26747/21) (these guys know digital bitstreams, better than anyone on X’Place thats for sure ;) );

(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a436/andrewc888/DD%20Post_zpskph6cfrz.jpg~original)

The same however doesn't apply to synchronous interfaces like S/PDIF, SDIF2/3, AES/EBU, I2S, HDMI etc., where clocking is of vital importance... So people should know/understand that before they generalise whether re-clocking can make a difference or not, and can be objectively proven so beyond hearsay (pun unintended ;D).

Melco does use bridged Ethernet ports, but when switched to “Direct mode” it disconnects bridging and is effectively a dedicated Ethernet port to the DAC/Player. That said, even if left on "Network mode" (like I do), 100% galvanic isolation can be achieved via fibre Ethernet connectivity;  in my main system at home, streaming audio is exclusively via Melco’s Ethernet port - which even though is quad pulse-transformer & choke coupled, per TDK’s specs it has 35pF of interwinding capacitive coupling, but that’s easily galvanically isolated via Ethernet over single-mode fibre to my Upsampler/DAC with a Media converter and a custom Military-grade regulated LPSU (which has a magnitude better PSRR performance than common "audiophile" LPSUs ;) )

No, I haven’t tried any of the new Melco boxes, I’m not a big fan of USB interfaces for audio (even if Neutrik USB); in the case of my DAVE though, USB is the only highrez interface, but it's only for casual listening in my bedroom anyway, plus I’ve got something else new planned which I’ll be testing in a couple of weeks.


To the PM queries;
On the 2nd-hand price of DAVE; IMHO you should expect to pay between S$8-$10K depending on condition and how desperate the seller is (and lower still if from a friend  ;D). AudioGon bluebook doesn’t have a price guide for DAVE yet, but Hifishark has price points in Europe which is generally 10-15% higher than Singapore; https://www.hifishark.com/search?q=chord+dave (https://www.hifishark.com/search?q=chord+dave)

On Power Conditioner/Power-cord/Interconnect cables I used with DAVE; see PM responses (a bit of “tail wagging the dog” price wise if you know what I mean, so I’d rather not post publicly :P).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on June 10, 2017, 11:34
I'm enjoying my Blu2 + Dave combination a lot. Feeding it with a rednet 3 -> mutec 3+ USB. The rednet 3 beat my sms200, so I sold the latter. The blu2's USB input is not galvanically isolated unlike the Dave so maybe that's a factor. Who knows.

Surprisingly adding the Blu2 to the Dave does not make the sound more sharply detailed. Instead, the sound is smoother, more organic, more real. It is now more layered, more nuanced, and has more shades of Colour. Edges do not sound more sharply-defined or digital in any way. It's like the difference between film-like and HD. This is much more film-like.

I demoed it for a friend, who then sold his dac that weekend and is now looking to get this combination :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 10, 2017, 11:52
I'm enjoying my Blu2 + Dave combination a lot. Feeding it with a rednet 3 -> mutec 3+ USB. The rednet 3 beat my sms200, so I sold the latter. The blu2's USB input is not galvanically isolated unlike the Dave so maybe that's a factor. Who knows.

Surprisingly adding the Blu2 to the Dave does not make the sound more sharply detailed. Instead, the sound is smoother, more organic, more real. It is now more layered, more nuanced, and has more shades of Colour. Edges do not sound more sharply-defined or digital in any way. It's like the difference between film-like and HD. This is much more film-like.

I demoed it for a friend, who then sold his dac that weekend and is now looking to get this combination :)

Interested with your setup, mind to share your setup? Computer>network>red net > BNC > blue > BNC > Dave? Which software you are using?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on June 10, 2017, 12:20
This is my setup:

Computer (Roon) -> (via Dante, not RAAT) Optical Fiber Media Converters fed by LPS-1 -> Rednet 3 (modded to use LPS) -> AES -> Mutec 3+ USB (modded to use LPS) -> BNC -> Blu2 -> double BNC -> Dave
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 10, 2017, 13:06
Wow very Long chain, I'm confused with the rednet, I thought it was a streamer but after looking into the product details and your setup.. I'm totally lost haha.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on June 10, 2017, 14:16
If I were using an SMS-200, it would be a drop in replacement for my rednet 3, since I was using it in bridged IP mode direct from PC.

Rednet 3 is a ethernet to AES or coaxial device using a pro audio protocol, Dante, to send audio over the ethernet cable.

Some stuff like the optical fibre media converters is optional, I have it there to break the copper chain between computer and my rednet 3 just because my computer is not optimised electrically for audio (repurposed a gaming laptop by installing audio optimiser, process lasso, and fidelizer; but did not change the power supply).

The Mutec 3+ USB is also optional, I could just use a coaxial to bnc cable to go from rednet 3 -> blu2. But it sounds better with the Mutec in so that's what I'm using. This Mutec 3+ USB has USB input as well so I could also just as well be doing SMS-200 -> Mutec.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 10, 2017, 14:29
interesting, wish I could listen to my our setup someday.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 10, 2017, 15:11
This is my setup:

Computer (Roon) -> (via Dante, not RAAT) Optical Fiber Media Converters fed by LPS-1 -> Rednet 3 (modded to use LPS) -> AES -> Mutec 3+ USB (modded to use LPS) -> BNC -> Blu2 -> double BNC -> Dave

Just read up on Rednet3, I’m guessing your Roon Core is connecting to DANTE's Virtual ASIO soundcard interface drive software installed on your Laptop?

I have to wonder though, whether the benefits of just the DANTE transport outweighs all the drawbacks; Roon Core to Virtual Sound card. No higher bit rate than 192K PCM, which likely means you can also only do DoP based DSD64, nothing higher. Plus the additional AES-to-USB Mutec conversion point. And all the interconnects to go in-between…

Thats a whole lot of "stuff" compared to a super clean and simple RAAT connection straight from your Laptop Roon Core over a dedicated Ethernet link to the SMS-200 or better still, the Sonore microRendu, and USB out to DAVE (with no other limitation)!

You might want to re-evaluate which path actually sounds better ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on July 07, 2017, 02:47
First (?) review of the Chord Blu 2 + Dave in Hi Fidelity Poland:

https://translate.google.com/translate?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=pl&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=http://www.highfidelity.pl/%40main-3061%26lang%3D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on July 09, 2017, 16:32
Hello
Big question : how to get more from the DAVE ?
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jigster on July 09, 2017, 17:37
Hello
Big question : how to get more from the DAVE ?
Cheers

Blu2?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 13, 2017, 17:23
Hello
Big question : how to get more from the DAVE ?
Cheers

Start with not sticking to just the AES input  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on July 13, 2017, 23:56
Blu2?

Agreed  ;D, sound much better with blue 2.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on July 14, 2017, 17:22
Hello
Using the Blu 2 .. yeah , but i have barely no cds now
Then I can understand the USB and BNC , where I can Stream direct
I don't get the point though :
BLu2 + DAVE .. for double DAC , with different specs ?
BLU2 as a DAC : roon ready ,and better than DAVE .. ?
To say that I'm lost for the price
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 14, 2017, 18:39
Hello
Using the Blu 2 .. yeah , but i have barely no cds now
Then I can understand the USB and BNC , where I can Stream direct
I don't get the point though :
BLu2 + DAVE .. for double DAC , with different specs ?
BLU2 as a DAC : roon ready ,and better than DAVE .. ?
To say that I'm lost for the price
Cheers

If you're not interested in Blu2's CD playing capability, think of it as a digital upsampler; so USB into Blu2. 1M tap length of WTA filtering done in Blu2. Digitally streamed into DAVE via dual BNC where it's digital-to-anaog converted. :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on July 14, 2017, 19:18
Hello
Is the Chord Upsambling as good .. because fundamentally , 44.1 files are going to be upsampled ?
But I am curious about the gain in musicality
It should be good
That paves way sooner or later to a DAVE 2
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 15, 2017, 12:59
...
Is the Chord Upsambling as good .. because fundamentally , 44.1 files are going to be upsampled ?
...

Every bit rate is upsampled, not just redbook. Only caveat is that DSD streams into Blu2 are transcoded to equivalent PCM rates, so DAVE see exclusively PCM streams (via the Dual BNC) from Blu2.  ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 15, 2017, 13:07
Chord’s Poly User manual just made an appearance… here’s an interesting twist that I wasn’t aware or expecting! ;D

Quote
16 MQA
Poly will seamlessly play back most audio formats, including MQA files. When playing back MQA files Poly will perform a first stage software decode.

It’ll be interesting to compare Poly’s hardware decode to Tidal’s software decode with both coupled to Mojo. I wonder if this could be why Poly’s still not out in the market yet (i.e. MQA licensing and certification delays).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on July 21, 2017, 06:31
Hello
Has anyone tried the DAVE with some mains conditionners ?
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 21, 2017, 06:49
...
Has anyone tried the DAVE with some mains conditionners ?
...

When I first tested DAVE it was through my mains conditioner, like the rest of my audio system. But my current regular DAVE listening is un-conditioned, and it still retains all of it's character without any real distractions  :)...  (although, my audio systems, including in my bedroom, have a completely separate AC mains, unconnected to the rest of the house. So no Fridge, TV, Aircon, other appliances etc. connected anywhere near my audio system mains ;D)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on July 21, 2017, 08:18
I think very system depended, like andrew mentioned, dave is good on it power supply but if your home AC is very noisy then conditioner definitely recommended, so the answer is get some home demo and decide. You can try to add footer too, it definitely improve the sound and its very cheap to implement, and blue2 is definitely great improvement haha.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: malsound on August 07, 2017, 22:29
http://www.youtube.com/v/sSGaqH3VXd8&fs=1
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: malsound on August 07, 2017, 22:30
http://www.youtube.com/v/GvAUU8tYMiU&fs=1
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on August 22, 2017, 15:18
Hello
I have been using the DAVE with the Plixir BAC 400 for a month now
Overall it's a good gain for my system
In my system , I have the Lumin U1, the Melco N1A , and the Aurender N100
There is a noticeable gain with the Melco and the Aurender on the PLIXIR
To be honest the Lumin does not benefit from the PLiXIR (no change in sound)
The DAVE tends to be more transparent , and pleasant
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Audio on August 22, 2017, 16:00
.......although, my audio systems, including in my bedroom, have a completely separate AC mains, unconnected to the rest of the house. So no Fridge, TV, Aircon, other appliances etc. connected anywhere near my audio system mains ;D)

You got 2 phases coming into your house?   Otherwise I don't see you having 2 separated power lines because they are still connected at the distributor.

(Audio)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Tiktokape on August 22, 2017, 16:18
Hello
I have been using the DAVE with the Plixir BAC 400 for a month now
Overall it's a good gain for my system
In my system , I have the Lumin U1, the Melco N1A , and the Aurender N100
There is a noticeable gain with the Melco and the Aurender on the PLIXIR
To be honest the Lumin does not benefit from the PLiXIR (no change in sound)
The DAVE tends to be more transparent , and pleasant
Cheers
I beg the difference on it. I'm using BAC 500 Gen 1 to power my Lumin A1, it does have impact on it - powercord is more dramatic though. Also, Elite BAC is pretty neutral so I don't expect a tonality change so to speak.

Just a suggestion, give Elite BAC 1.5k a try vs 400 you had.
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on August 22, 2017, 17:22
The U1 afaik uses the same power supply as the S1, which is an upgraded version of that used in the A1.  Perhaps the impact may be less discernible.

Having said that, when I had the Lumin A1, changing from the Plixir BAC 1200 to BAC 3000 (Mk 1 versions) made a big difference.  Soundstage expanded and the bass was more extended (but not bloated). This was despite the total system power requirement being less than 600W. Guess headroom is important.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on August 22, 2017, 17:51
You got 2 phases coming into your house?   Otherwise I don't see you having 2 separated power lines because they are still connected at the distributor.

(Audio)

Yes actually, I’ve got two separate incoming AC main feeds into the house on different phases (“Y” and “R” - not sure what the designations are). Each into completely separate DB panels, with their own MCBs/RCCBs etc. One mains for my Audio system exclusively, the other for everything else. I believe the only common point is the Low-Tension 400/230V distribution point somewhere on the street :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: eze73 on August 22, 2017, 21:18
I beg the difference on it. I'm using BAC 500 Gen 1 to power my Lumin A1, it does have impact on it - powercord is more dramatic though. Also, Elite BAC is pretty neutral so I don't expect a tonality change so to speak.

Just a suggestion, give Elite BAC 1.5k a try vs 400 you had.

I'll have a talk with James
Loads of money to lose  :o :o :o
Cheers
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: supabayes on August 22, 2017, 23:07
I'll have a talk with James
Loads of money to lose  :o :o :o
Cheers

you should but don't just stop at Elite BAC1500, go full measure to Elite BAC3000. I was surprised how DAVE continues to gain after each upgrade of BAC from first gen BAC1200 :-)



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on August 22, 2017, 23:15
I was surprised how DAVE continues to gain after each upgrade of BAC from first gen BAC1200 :-)


Could you elaborate on the gains as you moved up the ladder?  Thanks.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Tiktokape on August 23, 2017, 09:22
If one has the 'budget is no objection", Elite 3k is the way to go, the additional headroom does help in overall aspects. The reason why I felt Elite 1.5k is right for DAVE - the sounding is more vivid and has more energy in Elite 1.5k. May consider swapping the US receptacle out with Furutech NCF or non NCF series - I'm sure James is willing to do it.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: supabayes on August 25, 2017, 01:27
Could you elaborate on the gains as you moved up the ladder?  Thanks.

Gen 1 BAC1200 is more lively, warmer while both both Elites are more neutral and smoother, which i prefer for power conditioner. Elite noise floors are lower. Bass, treble are more extended and detailed.

The improvement are even more pronounced for me when moving up to 3000v. More effortless presentation of dynamics and transients of 1812 Overture. 3000v made the normally laid back HE1000 headphone sounded like a different beast. Utopia noticeably faster and tighter with extended bass. I could unplug the subwoofer previously used to supplement low end to the KEF LS50. I also found myself listening at lower volume compared to previous level and still able to enjoy the full dynamics and details.

Gears: Chord DAVE/Yggdrasil/Ragnarok/HE1000/Focal Utopia headphones/KEF LS50 speakers/Monitor Audio Sub.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on October 21, 2017, 08:27
Rob Watt’s excellent RMAF’17 presentation; Turns the whole pre-ringing/minimum-phase filter/MQA camp on it’s head! ;D

http://www.youtube.com/v/84Lb2qQBoMM&fs=1

ps: That’s Ted Smith of PS Audio fame sitting in the front row learning from Rob! … I'm guessing some of Rob’s ideas may start appearing in PS Audio products before long… kekekek ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on October 21, 2017, 18:11
Looks like Poly is about to start shipping. The updated manual no longer has any reference to MQA decoding… so much for that :P

http://www.youtube.com/v/4wt1fDXV1TM&fs=1
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on October 25, 2017, 10:03
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171025/f93e275aa3612e9b3f98b926fac3dbdf.jpg)

it’s here!!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on October 25, 2017, 22:29
Congrats! Impressions please!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on October 26, 2017, 09:30
First impressions - not so good.

a. the iOS app to control the unit isnt out on the App Store yet. So you need to use the SIM replacement tool (comes with the Poly) to "reset" the Poly into AP mode that you need to join so you can configure it. Considering it is an Airplay compatible device, iOS actually comes with an incredible utility built in that sets up an Airplay speaker, connecting it to your existing WiFi networks (in your iCloud keychain) without you keying in the SSID/passwords. The Marantz 2016 AVRs all had similar methods of configuring and it's a breeze to set up.

b. The whole idea of getting this was for Roon compatibility. Right now it appears as a uncertified Roon device. And for the life of me, I can't configure it for DSD playback. Every DSD file I sent gets converted to PCM.

c. Like a few others, I have encountered DSD files not playing back fully. I get 10 seconds and poof. Music stops. Then again this could be the DLink modem/router/AP. This morning, I am hooking it up to my office mesh network and there doesnt seem to be an issue.

Looks like a work in progress.

But otherwise, it sounds great.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on October 26, 2017, 10:48
Zeppelin Audio is having a sneak preview of the Poly this week Saturday - anybody going?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on October 26, 2017, 14:22
ps in the Chord video, the two guys in the front row? might be Ted Smith and Cookie Marenco. They might both have speaking slots afterwards.
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on October 26, 2017, 17:26
Its interesting that the Poly is dedicated to the Mojo only.  John Franks has said elsewhere, "Sorry guys it won’t be possible to use poly with anything other than a Mojo. As Poly reads usb back data from Mojo in order to enable itself. We will be bringing out a comparable unit for Dave and Hugo2 and even the TT too in due course."

Looks like there will be a streamer solution for DAVE in future? Wonder what the form factor would be like and if it will incorporate the M-Scaler function
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on October 26, 2017, 21:38
Listening to the MojoPoly combo via Roon. Listening to some HDTracks Bocelli with my old UE11Pro custom IEMs and it’s pretty damn impressive.

The DSD drop outs after 10secs I encountered seems to be gone after I switched from my router/modem WiFi to the Linksys mesh WiFi. My office mesh WiFi also worked fine with the Poly

Of course it still resamples DSD to PCM with Roon for now.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on October 27, 2017, 11:16
Nice! Such a shame it cannot work with Hugo or Dave, though.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on October 28, 2017, 05:18
First impressions - not so good.
...
Looks like a work in progress.

But otherwise, it sounds great.

Interesting!! Can't wait to get my hands on one!  ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on October 28, 2017, 12:05
So looks like MQA is still on the table

From John Franks Chord

Yes we are now getting so much valuable feed back such as Poly’s use with many combinations of player and phones this is allowing our software guys to refine the software in some detail
Regarding loading times we’ve tested the 400 Giga byte SDCard and with the present operating system it takes about eight minutes not the twenty nine minutes previously stated so we think there are other issues however We feel eight minutes I’d still far too long. So in a few days we will be sending out a major software update to all of the poly’s to allow them to load far faster almost instantly even with massive SD cards There will be many enhancements that we will be switching on too. I will outline them here now and we will put out full notification formally later.
r additional code and connectivity required for the new app to function.
Update to Roon mode to include new features (DSD and MQA support)
Modification to the WiFi SSID and password to accept special characters and increase password length to 63 characters.
Improvements to the music database build to increase micro SD card access and loading speed especially for high capacity cards.
Fix DSD visibility via DLNA server.
Rebroadcast of available services when changing WiFi networks.
SMB connectivity.
There will also be other minor bug fixes and tidying up of the operation and configuration.

Some of this is still in test so we will confirm the availability of all the changes when the update is released.
A further update may be required to enable all features. I hope all of you can see that we are working to make Poly a really wonderful product that is great to use with what ever payer or control device your using with it.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on October 28, 2017, 23:56
Interesting!! Can't wait to get my hands on one!  ;)

Me too ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Audio on October 29, 2017, 00:58
"Avoid at all cost"...MQA!!   LOL   :)

(Audio)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on October 30, 2017, 08:53
So looks like MQA is still on the table
...
Update to Roon mode to include new features (DSD and MQA support)
...

Interesting though that he would mention MQA in the context of a Roon update... I wonder if they're waiting for Roon's implementation of MQA Decode and to sub-license it from them (instead of going the direct MQA route).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on October 30, 2017, 11:28
i think some of us may have our MojoPoly as early as Nov 14/15 - when you get your hands on yours, please report how well it plays with Audirvana. I would like to know how MQA streaming works when Audirvana is "shooting" MQA files to the MojoPoly :D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: karhoul on November 10, 2017, 15:14
Hi Folks,

Drop by next Tuesday 14th Nov if are around Suntec area for the Poly launch. Chord representative will be available from 6 to 7pm to answer questions and collect feedback.

Best,
kh

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171110/8b21f31526143c579fa70f98d6870f33.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: ballhead on November 10, 2017, 15:28
what's the launch price? any promo?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 20, 2017, 20:14
Picked up a Chord Poly on my way back from London this past weekend (for a tidy saving ;D). Only got a chance to test it out late last night. None of the Poly reviews available online describe any of the little nuances of operating this pretty sophisticated little thing, so here’s a couple of technical notes… (not so much on how it sounds just yet).



Access Point mode;

(http://i67.tinypic.com/2v9ccue.png)



Network mode;

(http://i67.tinypic.com/ad0mt3.png)(http://i65.tinypic.com/dxk01v.png)


(http://i66.tinypic.com/2h6rj87.png)  (http://i64.tinypic.com/14aht3d.png)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 20, 2017, 20:17
Part 2

Decided to see if Poly would reveal any secrets, so I did some network probing;

(http://i64.tinypic.com/1hz1h0.png)(http://i64.tinypic.com/qs5s0z.png)

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 20, 2017, 23:57
mine is currently ready for pickup @ Zeppelin Audio but since I'm currently out of town, it will be next weekend till I have it in my hands. really hoping for the GoFigure app and firmware update to be released by then. for now I am tracking the user experience over @ Head-Fi.

what sd card are you using by the way?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 21, 2017, 19:18
mine is currently ready for pickup @ Zeppelin Audio but since I'm currently out of town, it will be next weekend till I have it in my hands. really hoping for the GoFigure app and firmware update to be released by then. for now I am tracking the user experience over @ Head-Fi.

what sd card are you using by the way?

You're going to have lots of fun :)

I don’t have a micro-SD card yet… I’ll probably pick-up a 128GB Sandisk and test it with MPDelux or something.  Good point, I hadn’t thought to follow Chord Poly news on head-fi… I just took a quick glance through the last 2-pages, seems like some people are having problems.

I tested Roon today. I initially had occasional drop-outs even on 44.1/16 material, which I didn’t experience with Audirvana. But once I updated my Roon from 1.3 Build 248 to the latest 276 build (which has specific performance improvements for RAAT over WiFi), no more drop-outs! Even 352.8/24 (DXD) streams were perfect!
(http://i65.tinypic.com/24v8sax.png)

This is despite Roon saying Chord Poly is “Uncertified”…

       (http://i66.tinypic.com/1fidl0.png)

Pretty awesome when you consider the DXD track is literally a sustained 16.9Mbps stream over a 2.4G 802.11n WiFi connection. Albeit, I’m getting a 65Mbps throughput WiFi connection with Poly to my Access point, so a DXD bit-stream should be no problem.

(http://i66.tinypic.com/2mcvs55.png)


PS: I’m not sure why Roon shows its DSP Engine in the chain (post Poly RAAT), even when I’ve got the bloody DSP Engine Disabled… In my experience, Roon’s DSP Engine negatively impacts sound quality.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 21, 2017, 22:44
John Franks has indicated that the app and firmware update will be rolled out by end of Nov so when that happens, a lot of the issues faced by the early adopters on head-fi will vanish. I've got an upcoming biz trip to shanghai during the 2nd week of Dec so I'm looking fwd to taking the MojoPoly on the road.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 22, 2017, 19:45
Except for the Configuration hassle, Poly works quite well and pretty much exactly "as advertised" actually :)... The only update I'd need immediately is Tidal Connect; everything else isn't important in the context of a portability and sound quality.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on November 22, 2017, 20:39
I'd like DSD from Roon and MQA
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on November 23, 2017, 10:19
Next week...

Quote
Ok so a quick update for everyone.
The first of three firmware updates will happen next week.
I will post again when I know the exact day and also give instructions on how the update process works.
The first update will be as follows:

1. Communication Update

Update to Manage Networks in Access Point Page
MAC address, Bluetooth MAC Address and firmware version visible on Access point page
Airplay improvements
DLNA Operation on Certain routers resolved
DLNA SD Card Database management and speedup of indexing
MPD Update to support m4a and ALAC

We will then roll out the next update shortly afterwards:-

2. Audio Update to fix file playback issues and update Roon

Finally

3. Update to provide integration to GoFigure App, ( soon to be released )

Please bare with us whilst we continue to work and test these updates. We are working as quickly as we can and also taking onboard
your feedback to fix additional issues along the way.

Matt
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 23, 2017, 14:17
looks like the app itself will probably make it sometime in December...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on November 24, 2017, 10:23
Damn. Got a 256GB Samsung Evo Plus and it's still not enough for my DSD collection.

400GB would only cover about a third.. and that's crazy expensive.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 24, 2017, 11:54
Damn. Got a 256GB Samsung Evo Plus and it's still not enough for my DSD collection.

400GB would only cover about a third.. and that's crazy expensive.

i bought the 400GB sd card @ amazon since it was about $50 cheaper than the price @ SITEX.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 24, 2017, 11:56
@Andrew - when you are outdoors without any wifi, what's the best mode of connection when you want to listen to Tidal offline & hi res files stored on your iPhone X and the sd card? i'm pretty sure it's not bluetooth right? is it the hot spot mode that gives you the best sound in this scenario?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on November 24, 2017, 12:58
You can put your phone into hotspot mode. And get the Poly to connect to it and it will appear as an AirPlay compatible device.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 24, 2017, 13:11
You can put your phone into hotspot mode. And get the Poly to connect to it and it will appear as an AirPlay compatible device.

thanks for that :) until they release the GoFigure app, I see myself doing alot of offline Tidal playback to the MojoPoly and playing stuff directly on the sd card using an app like MPDluxe.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on November 24, 2017, 13:19
https://www.amazon.com/Sandisk-Ultra-200GB-Micro-Adapter/dp/B073JY5T7T/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1511500431&sr=8-2&keywords=micro+SD+400GB

HOOT AH!!

2 hours only $50 for 200GB.

But I read the SanDisk Ultra got a lot of issues (the old Ultra.. not sure if this is new or old).. so that's why I got the Samsung 256GB. And was surprised MacOS reported 256GB free!! Usually it is like 240MB only.

Paid $175 at JB HiFi yesterday. Normally $229 but I got them to price match another shop.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 24, 2017, 13:23
this is a good deal :) I've used 2 x 200GB of this particular model before with my onkyo dp-x1. i had no issues with it.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 24, 2017, 16:10
@Andrew - when you are outdoors without any wifi, what's the best mode of connection when you want to listen to Tidal offline & hi res files stored on your iPhone X and the sd card? i'm pretty sure it's not bluetooth right? is it the hot spot mode that gives you the best sound in this scenario?

When out and about, like DH suggests, use your iPhone X as the Access Point, instead of flipping Poly between modes. I’ve configured my Poly with both SSIDs of my home Wireless Access Point and my iPhone. So, when I’m outdoors, Poly automatically connects to my iPhone as soon as I turn the iPhone’s HotSpot mode on (bit of a battery drain of course). 

As for portable sound quality, in order of best to worst;

1. SD card media playback; Controlled via MPD over BlueTooth
2. Tidal via MConnect player (https://itunes.apple.com/sg/app/mconnect-player/id503760460?mt=8) (mobile DLNA) over WiFi; ideally this shouldn’t be necessary if/when Chord implements Tidal Connect
3. Tidal via AirPlay over WiFi
4. Tidal over BlueTooth to Poly - strangely via BT, the background is quite noisy, needs firmware fixing

I’m curious to know how they’re going to trigger a firmware update without GoFigure, there’s nothing in the Captive Portal in access point mode, nor in network mode that I could see to trigger an update maybe some magic combination of button press ;D...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 24, 2017, 23:26
thanks Andrew for the detailed answers. according to Matt from Chord, all you need to do is to keep your Poly turned on and the update just happens over the air... you will then be able to verify the update via the splash screen on your mobile device.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 25, 2017, 08:34
thanks Andrew for the detailed answers. according to Matt from Chord, all you need to do is to keep your Poly turned on and the update just happens over the air... you will then be able to verify the update via the splash screen on your mobile device.

I’m interested in the actual mechanics of it… It's going to be slightly more complicated than Matt made it to be ;D...

Since Poly sits behind our home Access Point (usually behind NAT and possibly built-in Firewalls), there’s no way to update the firmware unless first “Poly phones home” so to speak and initiates the download. Chord servers can’t spontaneously reach out to your Poly in your home, even if it’s turned on, unless Poly reaches out first in some way. (If it could, that'd be a major privacy/security issue! ;) )

I briefly scanned my network to see if Poly reaches out externally anywhere, doesn’t seem like it does, so, I presume there has to be some trigger before it does. Other than advertising itself via SSDP (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_Service_Discovery_Protocol), Poly doesn’t seem to do very much else while on the network during my brief look ;D

ps: Poly runs on a modified Linux 4.1.32 kernel (released Sept'16) if anyone's interested to know.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on November 25, 2017, 13:34
i was watching an unboxing video for the Poly last night and realized that Chord cheaped out by not providing a proper charger and just included a USB cable instead. is this the same case for the Mojo as well?

what charger are you guys using for both your Mojo and Poly? would plugging them to the charger that comes with the iOS devices work? i was also planning on plugging them to my macbook pro touch ID when i need to charge them. i'm planning to charge them together, as a single unit.

some folks on head-fi have been having trouble with their various 3rd party chargers such as Anker and it's quite perplexing... why the fork would you not even include a charger in your original package?! i remember the original Chord Hugo came with one.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on November 26, 2017, 22:55
...what charger are you guys using for both your Mojo and Poly? would plugging them to the charger that comes with the iOS devices work? i was also planning on plugging them to my macbook pro touch ID when i need to charge them. i'm planning to charge them together, as a single unit.

...

Yup, the Macbook USB-C charger works great with MojoPoly combined, it’s what I use (with a USB-C to USB-A pigtail). In fact, any of the Apple power adapters work well, including the 12W USB-A iPad power adapter (I believe anything above 2W works for MojoPoly combination).

I’m not fussed Chord didn’t include a power adapter, most people have too many of them laying around anyway, no? ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on November 29, 2017, 14:57
My iPhone X was limited to 64GB when I was picking one up - that means I am kinda limited in my travel music choices unless I use the microSD option on the Poly and I got the 256GB Samsung card the other day.

But without the GoFigure app, playing from the uSD card required some DLNA app. The Glider app (now in beta) is supposed to do exactly that so I signed up for a beta.

First impressions are pretty easy to use - but with one caveat. Everytime I turn on the Poly as a DLNA server (to play songs from the uSD card), the app crashes. Playing from our NAS DLNA - no issue.

Dare I say, it sounds pretty good too. I'd say it sounded as good as Roon.

Then since I had the Poly in the non-Roon mode, I decided to test out Airplay. Again no issues but it was the worst sounding version.

Ended up switching back to Roon mode since that is how I tend to listen to my music.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 02, 2017, 08:01
...
But without the GoFigure app, playing from the uSD card required some DLNA app. The Glider app (now in beta) is supposed to do exactly that so I signed up for a beta.
...

I think you meant MPD (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Player_Daemon) (rather than DLNA)  :P... I still haven't had a chance to test out playback via the micro SD card.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on December 02, 2017, 08:21
I think you meant MPD (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Player_Daemon) (rather than DLNA)  :P... I still haven't had a chance to test out playback via the micro SD card.

Nope I meant DLNA.

JRiver sees the Mojo as both a renderer and a server. And I’ve been testing out Glider to do the same thing.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on December 02, 2017, 08:21
Anyway new firmware is out.

Supposedly now Roon gets DSD native!
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on December 02, 2017, 08:22
Updating firmware is a bit of a bugger tho.

Turn on. Leave on for 30 min.

Power off.

Wait for Poly light to go off

Turn on.

Leave for 20 min.

Freaking me out.

8 min more to go on step 1
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on December 02, 2017, 08:37
How to update Poly:


Important: Poly must be connected to a Wi-Fi network ( P Status light on and solid colour ) with internet access and be switched ‘on’ or be on charge

1. Poly must be off initially to begin the update process.

2. Switch Poly ‘on’ for at least 30 minutes to connect to the update server and download the update

3. After 30 minutes, switch Poly ‘off’ (or unplug from the charger) and wait until the ‘P-status’ light goes out

4. Switch Poly ‘on’ and wait until the ‘P-status’ light comes back on. Poly has now installed the new firmware. Wait 20 minutes.

5. Switch Poly back ‘off’ and wait again until the ‘P-status’ light goes out

6. Switch Poly back ‘on’. Poly is now ready to use.



The update includes:


Wi-Fi MAC and Bluetooth MAC address visibility on the Access Point page
Access Point Wi-Fi Manage Connections page, delete networks resolved plus Access Point special character handling for Wi-Fi SSID and password added
DLNA FLAC file gapless playback
Restart of services when joining a new network
SSID 32 characters and password 63 characters max
Router DLNA services visibility
AirPlay updates
SD card database management improvements: If the SD card has space for database then the database will be stored on the SD. Therefore, Poly will only index the SD once, if the content has not changed. If there is insufficient space on the SD card, then the database will be created each time Poly is switched on.

Please be patient. We have a large number of Polys to update. If it doesn't work for you at first then wait and try again another time.
You will know it has been successful as the config page will show the firmware version 1.0.6.

(https://cdn.head-fi.org/a/10036472.png)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on December 02, 2017, 10:04
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171202/7a9c8df2322081da6cd7787329b00398.jpg)

Success!!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 03, 2017, 07:34
Anyway new firmware is out.
...

Updating firmware is a bit of a bugger tho.

Turn on. Leave on for 30 min.

Power off.

...

No wonder I didn’t see Poly phone home, too brief a look it would seem… Will have to update when I get home and can see how the update actually happens  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 04, 2017, 23:58
These Chord guys are tricky!!

Somehow, despite Mojo/Poly being left OFF, the thing upgraded itself! :o Seems like Poly’s not really off when it’s supposed to be (Edit: albeit plugged into the power socket)... I didn't do any of the "required" firmware upgrade steps or anything. Quite disconcerting that it's connecting across the ‘net and upgrading itself without any notification. I’ve just instituted a filter on my home router to prevent Poly from ‘net access again without me explicitly allowing it. And when traveling only Poly HotSpot mode for me ::)

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 06, 2017, 06:42
Confirmed it yesterday; Within minutes of plugging power into Mojo/Poly, even with Mojo still Off… Poly connects to the configured home network!  ::)  Matt Bartlett (Chord) also just confirmed it on Headfi (https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-☆-poly-☆-wireless-microsd-module-for-mojo-☆★►useful-info-on-1st-page-◄★☆.831347/page-294#post-13894161).  But Poly’s still quite elusive about who it talks to on the ‘net… thought I saw a glimpse of chatter to disignupdate.com (resolves to an AWS host), but I could be wrong (the wireless connection makes it tricky to see exactly).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on December 20, 2017, 17:28
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171220/6a9f0c68d8758b3f0747c648bb065d57.jpg)

It’s gonna be an awesome Christmas and a fantastic New Year ❤️



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 21, 2017, 06:06
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171220/6a9f0c68d8758b3f0747c648bb065d57.jpg)

It’s gonna be an awesome Christmas and a fantastic New Year ❤️

Congrats!! :)

Well?!! Come on!! How’d you describe the sonic difference with and without M Scaler?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Kiek on December 21, 2017, 09:27
Congrats!! :)

Well?!! Come on!! How’d you describe the sonic difference with and without M Scaler?

double dark!  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on December 22, 2017, 14:42
Congrats!! :)

Well?!! Come on!! How’d you describe the sonic difference with and without M Scaler?

my experience is consistent with what I first experienced and posted here back in May 2017: with the M-scaler, I found my music to be vibrant, immediate and "in your face". I apologize for not using audiophile-friendly vocabulary but if I can draw a comparison to home theater, then I would say that with DAVE alone, it's like watching a very well authored Blu Ray which has top notch sound and pic quality. with the M-scaler, it's like watching a UHD of that same movie - everything on screen is just amplified 16 times in terms of image detail, resolution and "depth". my music just sounds that much more realistic to me, if that makes sense.

i don't have any measurements to backup my claims - i only depend on my ears. and i trust my ears :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 28, 2017, 05:33
my experience is consistent with what I first experienced and posted here back in May 2017...

Nice! (though I can’t quite appreciate the Home Theatre/BRray-UHD analogy, but sounds like you’re noticing a stark difference for the better! :))
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 28, 2017, 05:35
Chord put out a new Poly firmware, version 1.0.10… and this time around I had a chance to take a closer look at the "Automatic" upgrade process ;D

Poly does a DNS query for the host disignupdate.com (an AWS host located in Dublin, Ireland), after which it establishes a secure encrypted TLS session with the host. The firmware download happens via HTTP over TSL (port 443 @ host). As the payload was completely encrypted, I couldn’t tell a damn thing about the firmware itself, but the download seems to have taken just under 2mins from the host site, making the firmware feel a lot more like a Mobile App (probably Linux kernel modules).

It’s still unclear what triggers Poly to initiate the disignupdate DNS query, seems to be an arbitrary idle time… which probably explains Chord instructions to wait 20mins after connecting to the net. Wish it’d be a little more deterministic, like maybe depressing the mode button while powering on initiates a firmware update or something  :P
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on December 28, 2017, 11:20
Nice! (though I can’t quite appreciate the Home Theatre/BRray-UHD analogy, but sounds like you’re noticing a stark difference for the better! :))

yes the difference is immediate the moment you start listening. if you get some time, it's worthwhile bringing your fave CDs to AVOne to give the BluDave combo a try. while you're at it, play some files via the USB input and you would be pleasantly surprised as well. i've not really done a comparison on my personal setup but some folks on head-fi are reporting that with some TOTL USB source such as the Innuos Zenith MKII SE (which I have not personally heard) the USB playback can be better than the CD playback on the BluDave.

my current USB source is the ultraRendu, powered by the LPS-1, connected via Curious Cable to the ISO Regen, which is powered by the stock power supply that came with it and then connected via the USPCB" USB A>B adapter to the Blu MkII. in this current setup, I'm already hearing obvious differences.

this is an interesting review of the Innuos Zenith MKII SE:
http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2017/10/richer-sounds-with-the-innuos-zenith-mkii-se/
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on December 28, 2017, 11:42
Chord put out a new Poly firmware, version 1.0.10… and this time around I had a chance to take a closer look at the "Automatic" upgrade process ;D

the 2nd firmware update didn't do much for me. while I'm home, I prefer using Audirvana to connect to the MojoPoly via wifi. for some reason, my music still gets disconnected sometimes. my best experience with the MojoPoly is when I am out and about and using the “Poly Hybrid Hotspot Mode” to stream Tidal offline content. i think I can still hold out for the official app for SD card playback. I am using MPDluxe and the app won't work in the “Poly Hybrid Hotspot Mode”. if I go with the regular hotspot mode, I would then lose internet connectivity on my iPhone which is unacceptable to me.

by the way Andrew have you see this?
http://www.map-pin.com/wiki/doku.php?id=chordpoly#known_issues_and_bugs
http://www.map-pin.com/wiki/doku.php?id=chordpoly-issues-index
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jelt2359 on December 28, 2017, 13:49
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171220/6a9f0c68d8758b3f0747c648bb065d57.jpg)

It’s gonna be an awesome Christmas and a fantastic New Year ❤️



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sick. Congrats!! How does it work in Video mode btw? Heh
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 29, 2017, 07:36
yes the difference is immediate the moment you start listening. if you get some time, it's worthwhile bringing your fave CDs to AVOne to give the BluDave combo a try. while you're at it, play some files via the USB input and you would be pleasantly surprised as well. ...

Very tempting... but theres' no way I'd buy Blu2, I'll just wait for Davina, it's ADC will be far more useful to me than Blu's disc spinner ;).


the 2nd firmware update didn't do much for me. while I'm home, ...

by the way Andrew have you see this?
http://www.map-pin.com/wiki/doku.php?id=chordpoly#known_issues_and_bugs
http://www.map-pin.com/wiki/doku.php?id=chordpoly-issues-index

I actually almost never use MojoPoly while at home… And while on the go, I still prefer hardwire connecting my iPhone to just Mojo (I don’t generally like putting my iPhone into Hotspot mode nor WiFi tethering it to Poly in Hotspot mode). About the only time Poly sees any use is when I’m in a hotel room and the iPhone’s charging ;D

Yeah, I did see Jeremy’s Wiki, but as I was away on vacay I haven’t really had a chance to take a close look at it... I notice he uses Wireshark as well to see what Poly's doing (albeit only broadcast messages over WiFi... I had to snoop behind my AP to see everything that Poly's doing). In fact, I haven’t even had a chance to re-test Poly since the latest upgrade.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on December 29, 2017, 16:50
What bnc are you using between the blu-dave? Have you tried clamping ferrite cores which seems to be the rage now on blu thread in headfi?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on December 29, 2017, 20:50
What bnc are you using between the blu-dave? Have you tried clamping ferrite cores which seems to be the rage now on blu thread in headfi?

i'm using the stock BNC cables that came with my unit. i think i'll stick with those for now. i have no plans to use any ferrites as I'm happy with the sound. one thing that bugs me is a static kind of sound whenever i start playing music via the USB input with Roon. i have to skip to the next track, where the static will be gone and then skip back to the first track to resume normal playback. i don't know why this is happening...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on December 30, 2017, 06:23
were the bnc connections touched in any way? I find them quite finicky as even a slight touch will cause some static/dropout. sometimes can even see the d.bnc box on the dave blinking.

But leaving them alone is fine.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on December 30, 2017, 12:05
were the bnc connections touched in any way? I find them quite finicky as even a slight touch will cause some static/dropout. sometimes can even see the d.bnc box on the dave blinking.

But leaving them alone is fine.

no i did not touch the BNC cables. once i connected them, i just left them alone. the incident i described only happens for USB playback.

there is also no blinking on the DAVE when I choose the BNC input.

i have a ISO Regen connected just before the Blu MkII so I'm unsure if that could be a contributing factor...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on December 30, 2017, 14:28
the blinking only occurs if I mess with the cables while both are on and connected. not sure if it's due to the cables.

I got a pair of belden 7731 w/ canare bnc from robert and will be trying out to see if it's a cable issue.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on December 31, 2017, 07:31
the blinking only occurs if I mess with the cables while both are on and connected. not sure if it's due to the cables.
...

IIRC, there are quite a few posts on headfi about Blu2/DAVE's sensitivity on the BNC interfaces, including some people who have to use BNC pairs 3 & 4, coz 1 & 2 are too unstable. I think Rob Watts had an explanation for it... He's also the one who recommended the use of Ferrite clamps on the BNC, so definitely give it a try I'd say.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on January 02, 2018, 07:45
with the 7731+canare bnc, no more blinking or funny issues but the cables are thick and unwieldy.

Soundstage seems to be wider. Yet to try ferrites but I'm happy with the results now.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on January 10, 2018, 10:27
A new standalone dac based on Hugo2 architecture from Chord https://chordelectronics.co.uk/product/qutest/
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: dXter on January 10, 2018, 12:32
Available in February, looking forward to availability locally and, knn, hopefully don't price too high
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on January 10, 2018, 19:22
Interesting that Chord feels the need for yet another DAC category? (if it's offering the same/similar performance as Hugo2... 'cept fo the Dual-BNC?)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on January 10, 2018, 19:46
Interesting that Chord feels the need for yet another DAC category? (if it's offering the same/similar performance as Hugo2... 'cept fo the Dual-BNC?)
I had bad experience with hugo1's batt, so this is a welcome addition.

It'll probably end up as a replacement/upgrade of 2qute.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: plasmasiao on January 11, 2018, 01:15
Interesting that Chord feels the need for yet another DAC category? (if it's offering the same/similar performance as Hugo2... 'cept fo the Dual-BNC?)
It is a direct replacement for 2qute, Chord said
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on January 11, 2018, 18:31
It is a direct replacement for 2qute, Chord said

Right, got it.

For a desktop model, interesting that the power input appears to be a 5V micro-USB. I’m guessing they don’t intend to provide a Power Supply unit with this?… I suppose that makes sense; anyone willing to buy a Chord DAC will likely be looking to put in an after-market PSU anyway ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: plasmasiao on January 11, 2018, 22:29
Right, got it.

For a desktop model, interesting that the power input appears to be a 5V micro-USB. I’m guessing they don’t intend to provide a Power Supply unit with this?… I suppose that makes sense; anyone willing to buy a Chord DAC will likely be looking to put in an after-market PSU anyway ;D
For 2qute, the designer advised in another forum not to use 3rd party PSU. He could nor hear any difference when testing using car battery, and those PSU may shorten the line of Chord DAC. Save me some $$$
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on January 13, 2018, 07:34
Winning accolades even before it's out the door  ;D

https://www.whathifi.com/news/stars-ces-2018-best-audio-products-ces (https://www.whathifi.com/news/stars-ces-2018-best-audio-products-ces)
Quote
Stars of CES 2018: The best audio products of CES
...
Chord Qutest

When it comes to desktop DACs and headphone amps, you can't really argue with anything Chord Electronics turns out. So of course we're happy to see a new addition to the family. The Qutest (no comment) is designed solely as a link between digital source and amplification, rather than as a headphone amp, and acts as a direct replacement for the 2Qute. It uses the same DAC architecture, software coding, frequency-shaping filters and input selection controls as the Award-winning Hugo 2 (£1800), but ditches the headphone amplifier and rechargeable batteries that make the Hugo 2 portable. Hence the lower price of £1195. With tweaks on the inside and out, Chord is promising performance gains, too.
...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: amakusaray on February 16, 2018, 23:57
I use power pack on my HUGO 2 sound better  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: DJQ on February 28, 2018, 13:50
forget the QuteHD2
just get this one.
http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=267573.0;topicseen
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: cstanxpl on March 15, 2018, 07:55
WHF? review for the cutest Qutest.

https://www.whathifi.com/chord/qutest/review

Ya, it's WHF?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Kiek on March 15, 2018, 09:20
WHF? review for the cutest Qutest.

https://www.whathifi.com/chord/qutest/review

Ya, it's WHF?

What is "WHF?"? "Wxxx Have Fxxx"?
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: karhoul on March 19, 2018, 16:05
Hi Guys,

Rob Watts and Chord Electronics reps will be in town this Thursday 22/3 645pm to 745pm at our showroom to present and discuss Qutest and other Chord DACs.

Visit below link for details:
https://www.facebook.com/events/1745706265467789/?ti=icl

Due to overwhelming response and venue capacity, we can squeeze in another 10 more pax. Light refreshments will be served.

PM me if keen.

Thank you and see you at the event!

PS: Alternatively, catch him at Canjam Singapore seminar @ PanPacific Hotel over the weekends.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180319/a6eb53a99c4f009fd8790cf444ef76b8.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 03, 2018, 07:31
After nearly a year of testing out streamers to pair with my Chord DAVE, from among all the usual suspects I finally pulled the trigger on the one that really blew me away sonically.  Blu 2 is probably the best sonically, but was never a real contender due to the unnecessary (for me) disc transport, and poor streaming services support - but the dCS Network Bridge really hit the spot; totally sublime sounding, and top marks for usability.

(http://i66.tinypic.com/nvokz.jpg)

It also supports dual-AES for high-rez PCM thats compatible with Chord’s implementation, interfaced via XLR-to-BNC adapters (Neutrik (http://www.neutrik.com/en/accessories/aes/ebu-impedance-transformers/naditbnc-f) works well), and superb native support for streaming services like Tidal, Spotify, and a home NAS.

(Dual-AES active over BNC1/2 input)
(http://i66.tinypic.com/29vf3ps.jpg)

The cherry on top is MQA first-unfold support. Just a month since dCS' official release of firmware to support MQA, this thing completely blows-away software-based decoders like Tidal’s native App, Audirvana+, and even Roon MQA decode; day and night difference and I have absolutely no idea why (well… actually I do, but that’s a story for another day ;D)

(Nick Mulvey in MQA 96/24)
(http://i66.tinypic.com/28gw5rs.jpg)

I won’t be posting a detailed review, but lets just say there’s streamers and then there’s Audiophile streamers; the difference is not subtle, YMMV ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 03, 2018, 10:19
Not using upscale from blue2? I went back to CD after compare streaming quality. My streamer now in sleep mode for almost half a year.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 03, 2018, 10:59
@Andrew - congratulations on your new toy 😁

@stvc - don't give up on the USB input of the Blu2 just yet ;) what streamer did you have connected to the Blu2 before you retired the streamer? i'm currently using ultraRendu, powered by the LPS-1 and i'm quite happy with it. some folks @ head-fi forum have reported better performances with the Innuos Zenith SE while some others have reported significant, positive differences by attaching ferrite clamps to their existing BNC cables.

as with everything that you read on the internet, you have to take all of it with a pinch of salt and let your ears and wallet decide :p

i'm personally tempted to find out what the fuss is all about with the upcoming Innuos Zenith Statement.


Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 03, 2018, 11:26
I’m using ultrarendu with Sonore LPS, no doubt they are good if you don’t compare to CDs. The only down side for blue CDs is sometime it cannot read the CD properly, need to re-sit the CD for few time to have it read properly.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 03, 2018, 11:45
Anyone here using ferrite to the BNC cable? I’m keen to compare the between with and without ferrite. If you willing to let me demo yours :).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 03, 2018, 19:26
Not using upscale from blue2? I went back to CD after compare streaming quality. My streamer now in sleep mode for almost half a year.

Nope, mainly because DAVE’s my bedroom system, not my main setup where I’ve already got a dCS Vivaldi transport+Upsampler (which Blu2 can’t touch sonically, or for flexibility/usability for that matter ;D)

The biggest negative against Blu2 IMHO is it’s lack of an Ethernet port, that pretty much kills it for streaming; USB isn’t anywhere on-par with Ethernet streaming done well. Plus USB requires yet another upstream device, pretty much defeats what a simple clean bedroom system is supposed to be. There’s so much new music available via streaming, it’s not an option to not have it run smooth. CDs are fine for focused listening in my dedicated audio room, but thats not what I do in the bedroom ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 03, 2018, 19:29
@Andrew - congratulations on your new toy 😁
...

Thanks!  :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 03, 2018, 19:31
I’m using ultrarendu with Sonore LPS, no doubt they are good if you don’t compare to CDs. The only down side for blue CDs is sometime it cannot read the CD properly, need to re-sit the CD for few time to have it read properly.

Yikes! Points to disc mech design issues or something... it shouldn't be doing that for it's price.


Anyone here using ferrite to the BNC cable? I’m keen to compare the between with and without ferrite. If you willing to let me demo yours :).

I intend to test it out soon.... they're like a dime a dozen at Sim Lim Tower... or about $2-5 each for better ones at RS Components.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 04, 2018, 07:39
the off the shelf ferrites from SLT don't do much.

FairRites makes the sound darker.

Chord (and I believe RW himself) uses Wurth. Saw them on the cables at Chord's setup in canjam sg.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2018, 08:08
the off the shelf ferrites from SLT don't do much.

FairRites makes the sound darker.

Chord (and I believe RW himself) uses Wurth. Saw them on the cables at Chord's setup in canjam sg.


Thanks, good to know!!  :) I'll try and secure some Wuth from Digi-Key - looks to be about $6-10 each.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 04, 2018, 10:06
Nope, mainly because DAVE’s my bedroom system, not my main setup where I’ve already got a dCS Vivaldi transport+Upsampler (which Blu2 can’t touch sonically, or for flexibility/usability for that matter ;D)

The biggest negative against Blu2 IMHO is it’s lack of an Ethernet port, that pretty much kills it for streaming; USB isn’t anywhere on-par with Ethernet streaming done well. Plus USB requires yet another upstream device, pretty much defeats what a simple clean bedroom system is supposed to be. There’s so much new music available via streaming, it’s not an option to not have it run smooth. CDs are fine for focused listening in my dedicated audio room, but thats not what I do in the bedroom ;)

Interesting as you buying upscaler and not using it function.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 04, 2018, 10:43

Thanks, good to know!!  :) I'll try and secure some Wuth from Digi-Key - looks to be about $6-10 each.



these were the ones recommended to me by Rob when we spoke during Can Jam SG '18:

http://sg.element14.com/wurth-elektronik/74271633s/ferrite-core-split-8mm-100-ohm/dp/1635622

http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-signal/psg00542/bnc-to-bnc-plug-gold-2m/dp/AV14131

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 04, 2018, 11:14
To reference RW's post on headfi
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-blu-mk-2-the-official-thread.831343/page-87#post-13696537

But YMMV.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 04, 2018, 11:22
Anyway having tried multiple BNC cables, I rate them as (worst to best)

stock->belden 1694->belden 7731->belden 4794->canare 12g->clearer audio
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jerome_the_lang on June 04, 2018, 12:13
so is placing ferrous material near cables a good thing or a bad thing?
(reference to that cable lifter thread)



Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 04, 2018, 12:51
if u believe what RW says then putting ferrites on digital does no harm, but analogue is another matter.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jerome_the_lang on June 04, 2018, 13:18
Digital is very high freq analogue transmission
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2018, 14:37
Interesting as you buying upscaler and not using it function.

Not sure I understand what you mean... If you meant my dCS Upsamplers, I am using it's upsampling functions of course (among it's other functions); all PCM (from disc or streams) gets upsampled to DXD, and DSD to DSD128, for my main audio room that is (which is exclusively dCS based).

For my bedroom system, I've paired DAVE with the dCS Network Bridge, it doesn't upsample, just streams native PCM/DSD to DAVE.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2018, 14:38
these were the ones recommended to me by Rob when we spoke during Can Jam SG '18:

http://sg.element14.com/wurth-elektronik/74271633s/ferrite-core-split-8mm-100-ohm/dp/1635622

http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-signal/psg00542/bnc-to-bnc-plug-gold-2m/dp/AV14131

Thanks for the Wurth link on E14 :)... I'll need to find ones with the right internal diameter for my cables - Digi-Key (SG) (https://www.digikey.sg/) has a significantly wider selection though.

As for the BNC cable though, I'd highly recommend using something better than generic BNC cables; the impact is audible. For the DAVE-dCS combination, I'm using Oyaide's pure-silver directional DB-510 (http://www.oyaide.com/ja/products/audio_cable/digital_cable/db-510) 75-Ohm BNC cables, fantastic price-performance!
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2018, 14:40
if u believe what RW says then putting ferrites on digital does no harm, but analogue is another matter.

Digital is very high freq analogue transmission

RW's right... The Ferrites core sleeves should have minimal to no tangible impact on S/PDIF or AES digital bitstream; a 352.8kS/s bitstream is only a 5.644MHz signal after all. Even DSD256 is only 11Mhz. Whereas the ferrite cores provide peak impedance on signals in the 100MHz+ frequency range.

IIRC, the reason for Chord's recommendation is to clamp down on high-frequency parasitic interference getting through via DAVE's BNC interfaces.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 04, 2018, 15:24

As for the BNC cable though, I'd highly recommend using something better than generic BNC cables; the impact is audible. For the DAVE-dCS combination, I'm using Oyaide's pure-silver directional DB-510 (http://www.oyaide.com/ja/products/audio_cable/digital_cable/db-510) 75-Ohm BNC cables, fantastic price-performance!

I was actually amused when Rob went on record to say that he prefers the non-fancy, cheaper and generic BNC cables. this created quite a furore over @ head-fi. but what folks seem to agree on is that no matter how fancy the BNC cable is, there seems to be an audible improvement with ferrite clamps.

the Oyaide looks nice but the longest length is 1.3m only huh? I need a 2m one since the ferrite clamp "trick" seems to need a 2m length cable in order for it to work.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 04, 2018, 15:35
even among non-fancy, cheaper and generic BNC, I still prefer canare12g over it's belden brethren.

But then again, they say digital is digital *shrug*
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 04, 2018, 15:38
I tot the 2m is for reflection problems, while ferrite was for noise introduced by blu2's fpga? 2 different issues.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2018, 15:50
...
the Oyaide looks nice but the longest length is 1.3m only huh? I need a 2m one since the ferrite clamp "trick" seems to need a 2m length cable in order for it to work.


I tot the 2m is for reflection problems,...

75-Ohm interfaces were specifically designed for impedance-matching so as to eliminate reflection issues :P... I seriously doubt 1.3m vs. 2m will have much of a difference (with proper 75 Ohm cables anyway).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: stvc on June 04, 2018, 15:54
Not sure I understand what you mean... If you meant my dCS Upsamplers, I am using it's upsampling functions of course (among it's other functions); all PCM (from disc or streams) gets upsampled to DXD, and DSD to DSD128, for my main audio room that is (which is exclusively dCS based).

For my bedroom system, I've paired DAVE with the dCS Network Bridge, it doesn't upsample, just streams native PCM/DSD to DAVE.

Opps, i'm misleading by your picture, i thought it was a blue Mii and Dave combo.. which make me puzzle that you having blue MII and not using it upscaling function.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 04, 2018, 16:01
Opps, i'm misleading by your picture, i thought it was a blue Mii and Dave combo.. which make me puzzle that you having blue MII and not using it upscaling function.

 ;D... Chord's and dCS' matte-silver finishes are very similar.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jerome_the_lang on June 04, 2018, 16:08
Haha, someone flipping a lot of pratas today.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 12, 2018, 14:39
Just received my 5 sets of Ferrite core sleeves from Digi-Key (3 different rated Wurths, and 2 from TDK)... Should be in interesting weekend  ;D

(http://i67.tinypic.com/2z4mrfn.jpg)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 12, 2018, 14:49
I'm currently using 4 each at the DAVE end and 1 each on the Blu 2 end, on my BNC cables. I can hear a difference. can't quite describe it coherently but it seems like some of the background "hiss" that I used to hear in my music seems to be gone now. not sure if I'm just imagining stuff though but I sure am looking fwd to read about your listening impressions :)

meanwhile I'm awaiting delivery of the Oyaide cables that you recommended. they should be here sometime in July.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 12, 2018, 15:34
I'm using about 15 fair rite per cable, they occupy end to end . The sound is duller
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: francishuang on June 12, 2018, 23:10
Try shifting the position of the ferrite

I'm using about 15 fair rite per cable, they occupy end to end . The sound is duller
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 13, 2018, 06:08
end to end all occupied liao, nothing to shift
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: francishuang on June 13, 2018, 07:41
I think tats too much   :)
The sound will become dull
Is the ferrite clamping hard onto the cable, sound will become dull too

end to end all occupied liao, nothing to shift
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 13, 2018, 09:19
I'm currently using 4 each at the DAVE end and 1 each on the Blu 2 end, on my BNC cables. I can hear a difference. can't quite describe it coherently but it seems like some of the background "hiss" that I used to hear in my music seems to be gone now. not sure if I'm just imagining stuff though but I sure am looking fwd to read about your listening impressions :)

meanwhile I'm awaiting delivery of the Oyaide cables that you recommended. they should be here sometime in July.

Whats the rating on your Ferrite cores, specifically the Impedance rating at 100MHz?

I think you'll like the Oyaide BNCs... might even possibly remove the need for the Ferrite cores! Try it without them as well.  ;)


I'm using about 15 fair rite per cable, they occupy end to end . The sound is duller

Yikes, that sounds a bit much (pardon the pun) ;D

The need for these Ferrites obviously also depends significant[ly] on what's connected to DAVE and whether it's spewing crap over the BNC... Is it Blu2 that's connected you[r] DAVE?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on June 13, 2018, 09:26
Yikes, that sounds a bit much (pardon the pun) ;D

The need for these Ferrites obviously also depends  significant on what's connected to DAVE and whether it's spewing crap over the BNC... Is it Blu2 thats connected you DAVE?

Ya, blu2 to dave. Actually I was just adding till there's no more significant diff (that's about 8 or so) then thought, what the hell, just fill up the rest of the cable.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 13, 2018, 09:49
Ya, blu2 to dave. Actually I was just adding till there's no more significant diff (that's about 8 or so) then thought, what the hell, just fill up the rest of the cable.

...but at what point did the "significant diff" turn from good difference to bad difference?  :P - Quite often with minute changes it's hard to tell good difference from bad difference except through prolonged listening (weeks) in one state, then changing it back.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 13, 2018, 11:52
Whats the rating on your Ferrite cores, specifically the Impedance rating at 100MHz?

I think you'll like the Oyaide BNCs... might even possibly remove the need for the Ferrite cores! Try it without them as well.  ;)

I bought the ones recommended by Rob Watts:

http://sg.element14.com/wurth-elektronik/74271633s/ferrite-core-split-8mm-100-ohm/dp/1635622

the Impedance rating at 100MHz is 100ohm, according to the spec sheet.

yeah I believe by the time I get my hands on the Oyaide, my ears would already be familiar with the current sound with the ferrite cores so hopefully the difference that the Oyaide makes would jump out at me.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 14, 2018, 09:37
I bought the ones recommended by Rob Watts:

http://sg.element14.com/wurth-elektronik/74271633s/ferrite-core-split-8mm-100-ohm/dp/1635622

the Impedance rating at 100MHz is 100ohm, according to the spec sheet.

yeah I believe by the time I get my hands on the Oyaide, my ears would already be familiar with the current sound with the ferrite cores so hopefully the difference that the Oyaide makes would jump out at me.

Ahh, ok. The ones I've got are include double and triple that impedance... it should make for a starker effect if there's any ;D.

W.r.t the Oyaide, be careful of the cable size, you need minimum 8mm internal diameter ferrite core sleeves.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on June 14, 2018, 09:44
Hey a customer dropped in the other day with a Deltec Bigger Bit DAC and said it was made by Robert Watts. It used a TDA1541 chip and he's been looking for a replacement for that vintage system. He has a TEAC transport modified with a Deltran clock output.

He was asking if it was the same Rob Watts from Chord. Anyone know?

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 14, 2018, 09:47
Hey a customer dropped in the other day with a Deltec Bigger Bit DAC and said it was made by Robert Watts. It used a TDA1541 chip and he's been looking for a replacement for that vintage system. He has a TEAC transport modified with a Deltran clock output.

He was asking if it was the same Rob Watts from Chord. Anyone know?

https://zstereo.co.uk/2014/09/12/chord-hugo/ (https://zstereo.co.uk/2014/09/12/chord-hugo/) ;)

Quote
...Rob Watts has come a long way since he “foolishly decided to get involved with manufacturing hi-fi”. After leaving Cardiff university in 1984 he cofounded Deltec Precision Audio and made a name for himself as a gifted electronics engineer.
...
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on June 14, 2018, 11:02
Cool :)

I found another one..

I wonder if this is the same Malaysian place I went to when studying in London :D


(http://www.acoustica.org.uk/DPA/images/RWintvw_HFW0691_1.JPG)
(http://www.acoustica.org.uk/DPA/images/RWintvw_HFW0691_2.JPG)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 14, 2018, 12:59
Thanks for that! Very interesting read.

...

I wonder if this is the same Malaysian place I went to when studying in London :D

...

I'm sure it is... I believe it's no more though, think they lost the tenancy a while ago?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 14, 2018, 13:09
W.r.t the Oyaide, be careful of the cable size, you need minimum 8mm internal diameter ferrite core sleeves.

yes when I spoke to Ryan from X Audio, I did tell him that I intend to use these with the ferrite cores that I already have. he assured me that they would fit the cable. nevertheless when I go to collect the cable in July, I'll bring one of the ferrites along with me just to be sure.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 19, 2018, 08:49
Not unexpected results from trying out Ferrite Core sleeves on the BNC inputs on DAVE...  ;)

I tested pairs of Ferrite cores with impedances ranging from 80-Ohms to 350-Ohms (@ 100Mhz), attaching one on each of the Dual 75-Ohm BNC cable between the Chord DAVE and dCS Network Bridge.

Starting off with the 350-Ohms Ferrite, the effect was extremely pronounced; significant top-end roll off, like listening through a crappy pair of speakers. It was useful though, to benchmark the exact sonic impact the ferrites had. The only "positive", of you can call it that, was reduced sibilance on poorly mastered low-res material, making it somewhat more palatable.

Long story short, I ultimately settled on a pair of Wurth 246-Ohm Ferrites (https://www.digikey.sg/product-detail/en/wurth-electronics-inc/74271131/732-1504-ND/1638908), positioned right at the connector edge into DAVE; this one seems to perform the best - best combination of attenuating a slight "haze", yet providing no measureable roll-off at the top-end, while preseving full transparency and impulse response.

I also tried going back to a USB stream directly to DAVE from my Melco N1A (with a Corning Fibre-based USB cable, and with the dCS Network Bridge disconnected from DAVE), the noise floor seems to increase slightly! To be sure it was not Power Cable related, I swapped power cables between DAVE (Oyaide Tunaim GPX-R ) and the dCS (Cerious Liquid Ceremics); didn't make much of a difference.  The sonic results from removing dCS from the chain points to possible reasons why the combination seems to work so well - somehow the dCS Network Bridge makes DAVE sonically better for standard un-upsampled bitstream ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: gtl on June 27, 2018, 11:22
Been toying with getting a Dave and BluII. Improved redbook sounds extremely intriguing. Currently using an Ayre QX-5. I have compared the Dave to it and it was very close. But by all accounts the Blu would elevate things to a much higher level. Anyone compared the Dave and BluII to other DACs?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jigster on June 27, 2018, 14:07
Anyone have issue of noise from Dave/BluII? There's a slight buzz coming from my speakers whenever I change the input to the Dave/BluII.
Tried putting some ferrite cores onto the bnc cables but the buzz is still there.
Changed to a diff bnc cable (from stock to Black Cat Digit 75s) but to no avail.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 28, 2018, 14:36
Anyone have issue of noise from Dave/BluII? There's a slight buzz coming from my speakers whenever I change the input to the Dave/BluII.
...

Possibly ground-leak related - make sure the DAVE/BluII and your Pre-Amp/Amps are on a common ground. When you change your Pre-Amp input to DAVE/BluII, what happens if you disconnect the BNC cables between DAVE and BluII, does the buzz disappear?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: jigster on July 05, 2018, 11:14
Possibly ground-leak related - make sure the DAVE/BluII and your Pre-Amp/Amps are on a common ground. When you change your Pre-Amp input to DAVE/BluII, what happens if you disconnect the BNC cables between DAVE and BluII, does the buzz disappear?

Hey Andrew,

Thanks for the reply. Apologies for the lack of response.
Amp is down so haven’t tried your suggestion, gotta wait for it to return from repairs.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on July 18, 2018, 23:27

it looks like Chord will be unveiling a new product this weekend at London Can Jam. if you are a current DAVE owner, then you might want to look at this... skip to 4:15 ;)

https://youtu.be/Bn_TFoh594U
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on July 19, 2018, 06:29
m scaler
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 19, 2018, 07:03
it looks like Chord will be unveiling a new product this weekend at London Can Jam. if you are a current DAVE owner, then you might want to look at this... skip to 4:15 ;)

...

Isn’t that the already announced Choral Étude Stereo Amp? :P

http://www.audioxpress.com/news/chord-electronics-introduces-new-choral-etude-stereo-power-amplifier

Quote
Chord Electronics Introduces New Choral Étude Stereo Power Amplifier

Chord Electronics has chosen High End 2018 to unveil a brand new analogue amplifier topology design, the company’s first for nearly 30 years. Although many improvements have been introduced along the way, the new Choral Etude stereo power amp provides a glimpse of what's coming for the British company, "highly advanced, it heralds a new era for powerful, wide bandwidth, low noise and low distortion amplifiers," Chord states.


(https://cdn.xingosoftware.com/audioxpress/images/fetch/dpr_2,w_1200/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.audioxpress.com%2Fassets%2Fupload%2Fimages%2F1%2F20180521184503_ChordElectronicsEtudeinEnsembleStandWeb.jpg)

John Franks talks about it on Darko’s channel - parts of the design apparently coming from consultant Robert “Bob” Cordell (http://www.cordellaudio.com) (@ 5.50). Bob’s original paper on the feed-forward error correction for MOSFETs can be found here (https://pearl-hifi.com/06_Lit_Archive/14_Books_Tech_Papers/Cordell_Bob/MOSFET_Power_Amp.pdf)

http://www.youtube.com/v/MkV2uOZ3VTo&fs=1 

It’ll be interesting to get my hands on this amp at some point and benchmark it against my main Amp ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on July 19, 2018, 14:34
I don't think it is the Choral Étude Stereo Amp - the Étude is no longer a secret since it has been publicly announced. I think it's another new product altogether... :)

I can see myself getting the Étude someday when I get a chance to build a proper stereo system.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on July 19, 2018, 18:37
the new product should be a stand alone MScaler. but it will be a surprise if it is in a form factor matching TT2 rather than Dave
 
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 19, 2018, 19:38
I don't think it is the Choral Étude Stereo Amp - the Étude is no longer a secret since it has been publicly announced. I think it's another new product altogether... :)

I can see myself getting the Étude someday when I get a chance to build a proper stereo system.

Hmmm… You’re probably right… Assuming that covered up unit in the vid is the actual unit, the size doesn’t match the Étude.

The Étude is definitely an attractive piece just based on some of it’s technical details and size. Interestingly though, the “feed-forward error correction” technique designed by Cordell is based on work done by the illustrious Dr. Malcolm Hawksford (http://www.aes.org/events/143/presenters/?ID=5834), co-founder of LFD Audio (http://www.lfd-audio.com)… But the Étude is “Fan Cooled”??… thats a deal-breaker right there ;D…

Cello had a pre-amp called Étude… :P

(http://www.hifido.co.jp/photo/17/760/76018/a.jpg)


the new product should be a stand alone MScaler. but it will be a surprise if it is in a form factor matching TT2 rather than Dave

That should be interesting! Could be a market game-changer for owners of 3rd party DAC without good upsampling! ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on July 19, 2018, 21:28
if the new product is indeed a standalone M-scaler, then I foresee it eating up the sales of DAVE and Blu2. most folks would probably invest in the Hugo 2 and standalone M-scaler in order to achieve the SQ of the BluDAVE.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: gtl on July 19, 2018, 22:27
Isn't the Dave better than the Hugo 2??? Why not Dave and the new M Scaler? Makes sense for those totally not into CDs no?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on July 20, 2018, 15:56
Isn't the Dave better than the Hugo 2??? Why not Dave and the new M Scaler? Makes sense for those totally not into CDs no?

I think the idea is to achieve the SQ of DAVE via a cheaper route by combining the Hugo2 with the rumoured M scaler.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on July 20, 2018, 16:04
If it's indeed an mscaler in tt form factor then have to see how's the heat dissipation of the chip in a smaller chassis.

The blu runs warm to touch even in standby mode playing digital files in that larger form factor.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on July 21, 2018, 21:41
(https://chordelectronics.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/M-Scaler-L-Front-900x675.jpg)

https://chordelectronics.co.uk/product/hugo-mscaler/
Title: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: nfnc on July 21, 2018, 22:04
Where does this leave the Blu 2 then?

https://darko.audio/2018/07/chord-electronics-announce-hugo-m-scaler/ (https://darko.audio/2018/07/chord-electronics-announce-hugo-m-scaler/)

https://audiobacon.net/2018/07/21/the-chord-electronics-hugo-m-scaler-your-prayers-have-been-answered/
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on July 22, 2018, 15:06
I think the Blu 2 still has a place in the Chord product portfolio as long as CD transports are still in demand 😊 I’ve been using the Blu 2 since late last year and I don’t feel compelled to sell it in favor of the Hugo M- scaler. I do foresee current owners of the DAVE and Hugo TT2 investing in the Hugo M- scaler.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on July 22, 2018, 19:52
Could I use an existing CD transport to the MScaler to work like a Blu Transport.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 22, 2018, 20:38
Very nice… I’ll surely pick one up as soon as possible... It’ll fit perfectly in my bedroom system between the dCS Network Bridge (which doesn’t do any upsampling) and DAVE.


Could I use an existing CD transport to the MScaler to work like a Blu Transport.

Absolutely. Or any streamer that outputs PCM. The only thing you’ve got to watch out for is that your DAC supports “AES3id” inputs - thats the Dual AES3 over BNC standard that the M Scaler uses for the full 705.6k/768k PCM streams. Any lesser rate and you’re not fully utilising all of the 1M taps.

At less than half the price of Blu2, there’s really no doubt it will have an impact on Blu2 sales (which I’m sure Chord is fully expecting). But kind of surprised though that it doesn’t have a native Ethernet port… quite regressive w.r.t streaming.  Also, the aesthetics is positively horrible, the whole Hugo line in fact, butt ugly ;D... Wish they’d used the Choral range design for this M Scaler.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on July 22, 2018, 20:49
I meant in conjunction with the DAVE or TT2
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 22, 2018, 21:03
I meant in conjunction with the DAVE or TT2

Absolutely not a problem. M Scaler doesn't care whats the source of the redbook stream, and DAVE/TT2 won't even know any different. There's no control channel between Chord's various components. :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on July 23, 2018, 09:07
wonder if the HMS and TT2 can be powered by a powerbank. I have a location with no AC, but bringing in a powerbank is fine.

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 23, 2018, 20:05
wonder if the HMS and TT2 can be powered by a powerbank. I have a location with no AC, but bringing in a powerbank is fine.

Yes!:)... According the charts Rob presented at CanJam... “Powers from 9 to 15V - portable battery bank can power it” (see vid below).

Rob confirms the M Scaler is exactly the same upsampler/filter circuits as Blu2... “Obviously this is less than half the price… are you losing anything if you buy an M Scaler? No. In fact you’re gaining some extra bits because its less sensitive to <something-can’t quite make it out>“... definitely sounds like they’re ready to have M Scaler cannibalise Blu2 sales ;D

About the M Scaler starts @ 1.20m, comparison to Blu2 @ 5.30m

http://www.youtube.com/v/ZciJFvU4XQc&fs=1
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on July 23, 2018, 20:11
Is the power supply on the Blu2 something special? That you’d need more than just a battery pack? I remember RWA used to say a bad battery may sound worse than a cheap battery.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: etnt on July 23, 2018, 20:33
my bludave is sorted out already, but I'm looking for a setup at a location that dont have access to mains which is currently using a H2.

Looks like TT2/HMS would be the sandwich to go for with a powerbank. But are there USB A to whichever connector they use cables?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: ks on July 23, 2018, 20:39
in head fi, some are wishing that since
-there's Dave and Blu2
-there's now Hugo TT2 and MS
would there be a Qutest + a matching scaler?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on July 24, 2018, 08:44
the press release for the MScaler says it will work with the Qutest too IIRC
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on July 31, 2018, 17:44

http://www.youtube.com/v/VfscfTkHgM4&fs=1

In answering a question about how M Scaler compares to Blu2

(@30.19mins)
Quote
“I’ve managed to eliminate the need for Ferrites… So, umm, thats because I’ve improved the isolation of the BNC outputs. So, you don’t need to worry about ferrites. In fact, listening test that we were doing, ferrites actually make it sound slightly worse, which is bizarre. So the isolation of the output drivers on the BNC has been improved, but the actual code is identical.”

Time to ditch Blu2 (... just teasing ;D)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on August 19, 2018, 10:43
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-0b8-5n95njY/Wz5t6A13jCI/AAAAAAAAgfY/knbD_tGQaXYTD9KNWDwP6lxytAVk-K7uQCLcBGAs/s1600/ult2.jpg)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on August 19, 2018, 10:45
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-hgbQRMT-Dt0/Wz5t-8BgorI/AAAAAAAAgfc/xPm6Pr-sbI4_2EVSa0EaXfyKwCuftazoACLcBGAs/s1600/ult3.jpg)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on August 19, 2018, 10:48
(http://www.avcat.jp/main/avnews/files/2018/07/FB_IMG_1530616737875.jpg)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on April 10, 2019, 20:21
for those of us who are still married to Poly, Chord has released a new firmware - after nearly a year! - that takes the device one step to how it should really have been right out of the box, when it was released nearly 2 years ago.

https://chordelectronics.co.uk/faqs-category/streamers/
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on April 11, 2019, 06:16
for those of us who are still married to Poly, Chord has released a new firmware - after nearly a year! - that takes the device one step to how it should really have been right out of the box, when it was released nearly 2 years ago.

https://chordelectronics.co.uk/faqs-category/streamers/

And did it work for you? GoFigure (on iOS) crashes the minute I click the firmware upgrade button...  ::). I stopped using Poly for a long time because of it's finicky behaviour, and GoFigure is not much better. They're probably Chord's worst products.

Mojo travels with me solo, wired  :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on April 11, 2019, 13:00
The Poly isn't a great on the go player like the A&K but with a Roon set up, it has been pretty much bullet proof for me

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on April 11, 2019, 13:09
And did it work for you? GoFigure (on iOS) crashes the minute I click the firmware upgrade button...  ::). I stopped using Poly for a long time because of it's finicky behaviour, and GoFigure is not much better. They're probably Chord's worst products.

Mojo travels with me solo, wired  :)

yes I managed to update the firmware on Tuesday after seeing the Facebook post. the update process will test your patience - as with all things related to Poly. I managed to stumble my way through before I updated successfully. the iOS app did crash on me as well and I found that unplugging the Poly from a power source and then initiating the update via the iOS app worked.

Roon connectivity at home is much better now - it is almost flawless and during a 2hr listening period, I "only" experienced 2 dropouts. this was probably the longest listening I've managed on Roon with the Poly.

today I took the Poly outside of my home. while commuting on the NEL, listening to offline Tidal content via Airplay was smooth - no dropouts or any other strange behaviour. previously I experienced audio speeding up, dropouts and all sorts of funny behaviour but not this morning.

currently, as I write this in the office, I am listening to Snarky Puppy's new album "Immigrance" on offline Tidal via Airplay and it sounds lovely :)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on April 11, 2019, 14:21
And did it work for you? GoFigure (on iOS) crashes the minute I click the firmware upgrade button...  ::). I stopped using Poly for a long time because of it's finicky behaviour, and GoFigure is not much better. They're probably Chord's worst products.

Mojo travels with me solo, wired  :)

https://chordelectronics.co.uk/faqs-products/poly/

Quote
Step 4

Open the Gofigure App. Go to Settings> Device Settings, you should now have the option to update the firmware. Tap update firmware. Gofigure will quit once it has sent the command to update to Poly as indicated by the pop-up. This is not a crash, so do not restart Gofigure immediately to try to update again.



Step 5

Poly’s ‘P status’ light will cycle through a range of colours, showing the update has commenced and is downloading.


Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on April 11, 2019, 14:36
The problem is - when you have power plugged in, the Poly LED always shows white. No color cycle on the unit unless I disconnect the power.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on April 12, 2019, 06:59
https://chordelectronics.co.uk/faqs-products/poly/

Quote
Step 4

Open the Gofigure App. Go to Settings> Device Settings, you should now have the option to update the firmware. Tap update firmware. Gofigure will quit once it has sent the command to update to Poly as indicated by the pop-up. This is not a crash, so do not restart Gofigure immediately to try to update again.


Step 5

Poly’s ‘P status’ light will cycle through a range of colours, showing the update has commenced and is downloading.

Fcuk me... I should have RTFF (Read the Fcuking FAQ ;D)... pretty dumb way for the software to work (even if it merely initiated the Mojo to directly pull down the firmware). Chord’s documentation really sucks, they need to invest in better Writers. ::)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on April 12, 2019, 07:26
Not only that. After I read the FAQ, I went to headfi forums and was told the server is down.


Apparently too many people are initiating the 2.0 upgrade over and over.

So they will wait to restore 2.0 later when the demand has died down.

I guess after 2.0, future updates won’t be so problematic.

I don’t understand why they couldn’t do a good old USB update.

Ps Andrew how is the Dcs Network bridge as an interface to the DAVE? Does the Blu2/MScaler accept dual BNC?
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on April 13, 2019, 06:50
...
I don’t understand why they couldn’t do a good old USB update.

Ps Andrew how is the Dcs Network bridge as an interface to the DAVE? Does the Blu2/MScaler accept dual BNC?

I think Chord tried to be "too smart" with Poly's original firmware update mechanism, they probably imagined an "auto-update" was a good idea (probably envisioned themselves as an Apple or Google with App auto update  :P)

The dCS Network Bride is absolutely brilliant sounding with Dave... I haven't tried the M Scaler at home, but I imagine it's (Dual) AES3id ports work the same as Dave's in it's compatibility with dCS. So, you'd connect... 'Net (Ethernet) --> dCS NB [Dual AES to Dual BNC via Neutric Adapters] --> M Scaler [Dual BNCs] --> Dave.

A couple of caveats though;
- The dCS NB doesn't currently support PCM above 32/384kS/s, so no DSD256 support etc.
- The dCS NB only does MQA Core decode, no MQA Rendering (which typically has to be done by the DAC, which Dave doesn't support of course)
- The dCS NB sounds best when dual-clocked externally (as opposed to just it's own internal master clock) 
- There's a compatibility issue between dCS and Chord w.r.t Dual AES support; For Redbook streams, the dCS NB automatically reverts to non-dual AES mode (since you really don't need 2 x 192KS/s for Redbook streams), but Chord doesn't seem to like non Dual AES streams on it's Dual BNC ports, so what ends up happening is that Redbook streams are somehow mono'ed by Dave! I imagine the same problem exists with M Scaler. The fix is easy enough on my system, I added an SPDIF-to-AES/EBU connection between the two, and for Redbook streams I switch Dave's input to AES (instead of Dual BNC).

I know, it seems like a lot of hoops to jump through for just Ethernet stream/Roon connectivity into Dave... there's probably a dozen other non-dCS ways to do it, but I doubt any would sound as good  ;)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on April 13, 2019, 08:29
Apparently after v2.0, you no longer need to worry about these interface-less OTA updates.

The Chord update server came online at 12am here last night... and i finally updated it overnight.

this morning it reported v2.00

Thanks for the update on the dcs Network Bridge. The biggest problem I had with the DAVE/HugoTT2 was the lack of a streamer from Chord but the dcs NB seemed to be a perfect fit.

Was just curious if they would play nicely with an MScaler in between.

I guess the other option was to use something like a Lumin U1/U1Mini over USB to achieve DSD256 but I am not convinced that is the best interface anymore
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on April 14, 2019, 10:39
Jeez, Poly is fcuking frustrating >:(... Out of nowhere the damn BlueTooth on Poly stopped working, so GoFigure can't connect to it, and I can't update the firmware... Letting it's battery drain down in the hope that BT starts working again after. ::)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on May 24, 2019, 11:21
there's a new firmware for the Poly out 2 days ago. this is supposed to improve wifi performance. if you have updated your GoFigure app to the latest version, then you will be able to update the firmware at the touch of a button, via the GoFigure app.

my personal experience with this latest update is that it seems to play better with Roon - lesser dropouts and I am able to stream a complete album (45mins or more) smoothly with no audio dropouts both from my local collection and Tidal.

i am still amazed that it took Chord 2 years to get to this stage but now that we are here, the Poly seems to be getting better and better.

I think owners of the Hugo 2 are in for a treat should the 2Go every materialise, based on what Chord have learned with this whole Poly fiasco.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on May 25, 2019, 13:11
I would love a Hugo2 compatible streamer with wired Ethernet
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 07, 2019, 11:46
I would love a Hugo2 compatible streamer with wired Ethernet

If you're OK with USB, then there're plenty of options of course (including the Poly itself if you're OK with WiFi, it's actually compatible with the Hugo2, not just the Mojo). But if you're keen on using dual AES (via the two RCA ports), then there are very few options out there (the dCS NB being the prime... can't think of any others actually! :P).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: Doggie Howser on June 07, 2019, 12:04
Does it work with Hugo2!??
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 07, 2019, 12:19
Does it work with Hugo2!??

Poly? It should... Other than power trigger, there's no "integration" between Mojo and Poly actually. I haven't tried it, but Poly should work with any USB DAC (as long as the Poly's power can be triggered to switch on).
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on June 15, 2019, 19:00
Trying out mojo...can't figure out how to use poly yet, now using USB cable instead.
(https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=1mzqm8vBx24AZTDCKiZhrD8J_J5Bjv71l)
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 15, 2019, 20:12
Trying out mojo...can't figure out how to use poly yet, now using USB cable instead.
(https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=1mzqm8vBx24AZTDCKiZhrD8J_J5Bjv71l)

You would need to download and install the GoFigure app on your mobile device first. Then you would need to update the firmware of your Poly. Depending on the current version of the firmware that is already installed on your Poly, updating to the latest version - 2.0.3 - can be quite complicated. If you bought this from a store in SG, perhaps they can help you install the firmware. If you want to do it yourself, the Chord website has instructions to walk you through the steps. Chord’s customer support is also very helpful in this matter.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on June 16, 2019, 16:53
AVOne has an upcoming workshop for the Poly on 29 June. You can signup via their Facebook page.
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: wusplay on June 16, 2019, 17:14
Thank for the tips. I put poly aside first.
anyway I plugged Mojo into my active desktop speakers Kef LSX, Oh man, can't imagine it could make such a difference, so this is just a Chord entry level portable dac.. amazing
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: AndrewC on June 17, 2019, 07:34
...anyway I plugged Mojo...

Welcome to the club  ;D
Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: demogoblin on June 29, 2019, 21:33
How is mojo compared to qutest?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Chord (DAVE, Blu2, Hugo2, Mojo, Poly) - Discussion Thread
Post by: InnocentBlood on July 16, 2019, 15:00
for those of us still married to Poly, there is an upcoming firmware update version 2.04 that is meant for those of us who are having trouble getting the Poly to work with Roon. if you cannot wait for it, you can send an email to betatest@chordelectronics.co.uk with your Poly wifi number and request to be included in the test.